The Cricket Thread

[Queenslander]

Play has been suspended indefinitely in a Sheffield Shield match at the MCG because of dangerous pitch conditions, less than three weeks out from the Boxing Day Test between Australia and New Zealand.



https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-07/mcg-pitch-deemed-unsafe-in-sheffield-shield-match/11777028?pfmredir=sm

[niko_cee]

It's all well and good abandoning for a shit pitch (it isn't, suck it up dickheads) but they should do the same when teams roll out slow, flat, do nothing shitfests a la that one in Hamilton on the basis of playing being a waste of everyone's time.

Seeing as I very much doubt they'll be using that pitch for the test match I don't see the reason (other than to make a story out of it) to even make reference to it.

Should probably get some sort of medal for making a minefield in Australia, mind.

[Danny]

1206906891374415872

What a day.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I watched the end of it in Guildford Cricket Club (a prestigious team which produced Bicknell, Rikki Clarke, Dernbach etc) and for shame there were at least 10 of the 50 people in the room watching the tennis on another screen. I mean, fucking tennis.

[hfswjyr]

Still hurts.

[niko_cee]

Trying to do the BBC's England Test team of the decade thing and it seems you are essentially required to pick Prior to keep. :sick:

It's not that easy actually. Batting sort of picks itself (I went Cook, Strauss, Trott, Pietersen, Root, Stokes) but then 'keeper is a poor crop (Prior, Bairstow or Butler) and the third seamer seems to be a choice between BIG Steven Finn, Chris Tremlett on the back of a single series/year, Bresilad or Bloakesy. Half tempted to just go with Moeen to get him in there (Swann takes the spinner berth for me).

I suppose our golden era sort of straddling the 2005-2015 period makes the time constraint harder to work with.

[Ian]

I forgot, had Prior already started to go to pot by the time 2010 rolled around?

[Jimmy Floyd]

I went for Ian Ronald Bell instead of Kevin Peter Pietersen because, you know, well I don't know actually but I'm not leaving Bell out. I'm not leaving Trott out either so for the purposes of this I'll decide to take a hard line on Textgate.

I went Moeen ahead of Swann as well, I'm the People's Selector. Swann is an embarrassing man. Third seamer seems a strangely fallow field but it shows how dependent we have been on the big two. I'll take Woakes over Bresilad.

Keeper I went for Bairstow with some reluctance.

[niko_cee]

I rather assumed the stats provided were for the period in question, but I don't know.

I went with Moeen and Swann. Feel bad about Ronald. Could probably slot in instead of 'Rooty' at 5.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Yeah they were. I'm trying to remember the distribution of Pietersen's best stuff but I remember him being absurdly good as late as 2012 (Colombo). Bell donned India in 2011 and Trott only debuted in 2009 so he gets in for sure.

Jesus Christ we are going to be shit when Jimmy and Broad are done.

[Queenslander]

Wee bit negative this bowling.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I swear God is heavily invested in Jonny Bairstow being in the England Test side. Ever since they dropped him it's been a concerted effort by the fates to get him back in there.

[igor_balis]

Ha

[hfswjyr]

Wee bit negative this bowling.

We just don't have the class of bowling attack available to trouble batsman of this calibre, so we're reliant on them making a mistake (e.g. Manus).

I totally agree with comments recently around the test rankings being a farce.

[igor_balis]

More points for winning a 2 match series 2-0 than a 5 match series 4-1

[Jimmy Floyd]

Archer just bowled an 80mph dobber half volley followed by a 92mph searing bouncer. He is a curious old cat.

Curran the pick today, he is going to mature into a proper don.

[Ian]

Nice to see we've kept them to a reasonable total for us to collapse before getting a third of.

[Ian]

Welp.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Watching Philander is such an education. Those are my absolute favourite types of bowlers. Philander, McGrath, Mohammad Asif, Timmy Murtagh, Mohammad Abbas, Martin Bicknell. Even Stuart Clark for a short period. Just beautiful to watch.

Proper artists.

Then on the other hand there is Nortje.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Only took Bairstow six balls to get cleaned up missing a straight one this time. I swear they are addicted to picking him, as if he's heroin under a motorway bridge.

[Max Power]

Bairstow clean bowled again is it? Very surprising.

[Ian]

You know I saw you mention Bairstow up the thread but didn't connect that he'd actually been called back into the team.

What particular question is he supposed to be the answer to?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Pope is ill and it was him or Zak Crawley (no one should be called 'Zak'). I don't know why he is even out there though, if they're going to have a backup keeper it should be Foakes.

I should have thought they will bring Pope back for Cape Town if he is well, but Root's administration is capable of anything.

[Ian]

What has Foakes done that he can't get near the side?

[Jimmy Floyd]

I think they have a simulator which shows his superior keeping doesn't make up for his batting deficit to Buttler/Bairstow, however to be brutally honest the latter two have been rank poor in Test cricket for a long time now, in Buttler's case for his entire Test career (though I would still make him captain).

So I'm not sure what data the simulator is using and I'm not sure anyone else is sure either.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The other problem we have is that our captain is in no way a thinking cricketer and has persistently shown himself not to be up to the job, but an orthodoxy has developed whereby there's an acceptance throughout English cricket that 'there's no one else' who could take the captaincy. There are quite literally ten other people just in this XI who could take it.

[Ian]

Combine that with the idea that if you stand down as captain you might be seen to be some sort of hideous coward. And that removing a captain means you GOT IT WRONG in a way that's unforgivable. Utter nonsense.

[igor_balis]

I also don't like this idea that root has to be captain cus hes the only "undroppable" player. What happens if you make x captain then x has a shit run of form?? Well, you keep playing them anyway. If they're a good captain at least you're getting that out of them; most of our batting order is woefully out of form already anyway.

Definitely would advocate a brierly esque specialist captain at 8 not bowling. Any obvious candidates in the county game?

[Jimmy Floyd]

There is a championship-winning captain already in the team.

The best captain in county cricket by a mile is not English (Ryan ten Doeschate), other than that there is no one amazing. Moeen is absolutely brilliant in the white ball game but I'm not sure he's done it in red ball.

[Ian]

What, as in he's not English to the extent that even we can't find a justification for picking him?

Has he never had a cup of tea or a custard cream? I thought that was the sort of level of qualifying required in cricket.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I guess this doesn't matter at all but the selection of Morgan (CBE), Stokes (OBE), Buttler and Root (MBEs) to recognise the World Cup win, with no other players honoured, is absolutely farcical.

[Shindig]

They would've done the whole squad but Baroness Floella Benjamin overpowered them.

[niko_cee]

This is one of those days where you go in with a sense of mild optimism and then see some mook bat you out of existence. An England 3rd day special.

[Ian]

What are you doing having mild optimism?

Hasn't that been thrashed out of you by now?

[Ian]

I'm pleased for Archer that he's taking some wickets here.

Even if we skittle them from here there's not a chance we're taking this lead down though.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Everyone in the squad is either ill, shit or dead. It's like Rorke's Drift without the singing.

[niko_cee]

Yeah, mild optimism was too strong, faint hope.

Does seem a bit farcical with everyone going down with lasagneitis.

[Ian]

I didn't think we'd be something-0 by tea.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Philander is line and length God. I don't know how you survive for any period of time against him.

I like Sibley and think we should persevere with him.

[Jimmy Floyd]

This is a bit disconcerting in that one more good session and we're RIGHT IN IT. We used up all of these for decades at Headingley though.

[Ian]

Yeah we'll be three more down by drinks.

[Jimmy Floyd]

If nothing else I would like to see Burns continue for a defiant hundred and plenty.

[Ian]

I like Burns a lot. And it's mostly.attitude. He seems unflappable. Doesn't appear to worry about previous dismissals or even the last ball.

[Jimmy Floyd]

We have shown a lot of fight in this innings but there's just way too much to do.

I swear Big Vern gets a stone fatter for the start of each spell. Maybe he's just doing the normal Christmas festivities mid-Test.

[Ian]

We're not getting near this total anyway but there's been a decent amount of "why the fuck couldn't you have played like that in the first innings?" so far.

As much to set him up for the rest of the series as anything else it'd be nice to see Buttler make the most of getting to bat for a bit with somebody who's not a bowler.

EDIT:

it'd be nice to see Buttler make the most of getting to bat for a bit with somebody who's not a bowler.

Never mind.

[niko_cee]

I see the back page of The Times has Root blaming the bowlers for this defeat.

:happycry:

[Ian]

That's fucking rich.

I assume the ECB have told him that's why given he doesn't seem too bright.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I get the feeling Root is way too powerful and that Silverwood was a massive insider appointment. The bowlers were a bit ropey on day one but they still bowled them out for 277. If the batsmen had matched even that we'd have come within a hair's breadth of winning.

[Ian]

1211638333526425602

The throw. :D

[niko_cee]

At this rate those guys might be getting call-ups soon.

Should probably just abandon this tour now.

[Ian]

Who the fuck is going to open then?

[niko_cee]

Bairstow. :baz:

[Jimmy Floyd]

Bairstow is sniping them all, 100%.

We literally don't have another opener out there do we? Sending Crawley and Sibley out there to face Rabada and Big Vern would be like an Isandhlwana re-enactment. Might as well get Woakesy to do it and play six seamers rather than five.

This is like a club cricket dilemma when one of our openers goes to Pafos for a fortnight and the choice is between promoting some mook from number eight, or the guy in the 2s who is dogshit and can barely move in the field. I'm not sure England tours should ever really get to that point.

[hfswjyr]

I think we should just leave Test matches against Australia at home to the big boys now.
At least in the ODI's we're a chance. I haven't seen a single day go our way this series. Not for lack of trying, but they are just a different class.

[Jimmy Floyd]

India will get demolished there next year and I quiver at the thought of us going there any time soon.

[niko_cee]

Crawley, Pope and Bess in or Burns, Bairstow and Archer.

At least we're decent at the toss these days.

[Jimmy Floyd]

We literally don't have another opener out there do we? Sending Crawley and Sibley out there to face Rabada and Big Vern would be like an Isandhlwana re-enactment.

Alright then Cetshwayo, show us what you've got.

[Ian]

This would be a good time for Pope to get a big score. He's applied himself well so far.

[niko_cee]

It would, but the chances of an England batsman going on and converting a good start must be almost zero. It's the same every game, starts all round, no serious scores.

[Ian]

Even if if he does survivce to the close and gets a 50, say, before then he'll be out first thing anyway.

[Ian]

Well it's going to be a glorious 29 for Buttler before he gets caught out, then.

[niko_cee]

Yeah, we've gone shit or bust here. Hopefully one of these goes full Stokes-mode from last time down here.

[Ian]

The carnage of that innings. :drool:

It was beautiful.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Well it's going to be a glorious 29 for Buttler before he gets caught out, then.

Today's winner.

[Danny]

Can we give up on Buttler being a test player and bring back Foakes?

Don’t get me wrong, I love the man for his short form stuff but it’s just not going to happen.

[Ian]

Today's winner.

:moop:

[niko_cee]

Maybe you could sell yourself as a world leading spot fixer?

[Ian]

Well I suppose somebody should benefit from watching England play cricket.

[Danny]

To be fair, fans of the opposition typically do.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The bad thing about this is that having watched Roston Chase roll us for an eight wicket haul last year, the likes of 220 all out on a flat one seem just par for the course, if not even a touch on the plucky side.

[niko_cee]

Every batsman gets a start and we chuck in a collapse as well. Groundhog day.

[niko_cee]

It's a disgrace that Broad is allowed to bat higher than 11, he's just awful (with the bat) and has been for too long.

Fair play to Pope for making the best of a bad situation.

[Ian]

Good work from Pope there. Won't last more than a few overs in the morning but gives the bowlers a little something to work with.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Jesus, I had us bowled out there and closed the cricinfo tab before they put the no ballup.

Rabada is basically bowling off 21 yards in this series so far, every side on replay he oversteps.

[Ian]

Does he normally have form for that?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Jimmy Anderson is a farce. 580th test wicket at the end of the day there and his average has just slunk below 27. Since 2010, in 107 Tests he has 432 wickets at 24.26.

I cannot imagine how shite we are going to be when he and Broad finally retire.

[Ian]

Funnily enough I was having that very conversation earlier this afternoon.

It's going to be bad.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Jofra and Sammy is a good start but unless the latter improves his consistency we won't have anything like the technician that Anderson is. Woakes has some more years of being a good home bowler but he's shite away.

I've been looking for the next Jimmy-style artist for ages but not sure I've found it yet. Lots of good young quicks with mechanical actions who spend too much time in the gym and will end up in Finnville. Lewis Gregory is the closest thing we have to a Philander type.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I have become obsessed with this type of bowling, this video should be on Pornhub:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKr-5oo006w

[Ian]

Having to listen to Talksport while cooking there because TMS don't have the rights. :sick:

Not good coverage.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The Cricket Social on BBC is very good, albeit it isn't ball-by-ball commentary but various people sitting around in a studio talking cricket for eight hours and occasionally crossing to Jonathan Agnew over there.

Today they have Ramprakash, Steven Finn (:(), Andy Zaltzman and a northern women's spinner whose name escapes me.

[Ian]

See I swerved the Cricket Social because I thought it was all going to be a bit hahaha bants but maybe I should give it a bash.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Nah it's been pretty decent every time I've listened to it. Think TMS but without the ability to do ball-by-ball commentary.

[Ian]

Talksport was bilge. The main commentator was paints ("He's built like one of those traditional 1930s blacksmiths!") and they were doing an admittedly not very exciting interview with Makhaya Ntini and his son at lunch. An interview that despite being prerecorded and them knowing how long it was they managed to cut him off halfway through his last sentence.

[igor_balis]

1213832938535768065


Outstanding

[Ameen1190]

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[Ian]

You can't make me, Ameen.

[Jimmy Floyd]

It's not even started yet but fear not, Liam Dawson has re-signed for the Peshawar Zalmi which should see them go one better than last year's losing final.

[Byron]

Loving the live text this morning, with people lambasting Sibley for playing slow and boring.

IT'S A TEST YOU THUNDERCUNTS. LET THE MAN PLAY PATIENTLY.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Didn't think it would take long for that. His innings here has quite literally won us the match, in all probability.

[Ian]

Loving the live text this morning, with people lambasting Sibley for playing slow and boring.

IT'S A TEST YOU THUNDERCUNTS. LET THE MAN PLAY PATIENTLY.

I was absolutely delighted yesterday that although they didn't all hang about for ages like Sibley we had a top order who were all, by and large, approaching it properly. Hopefully this is indicative of what Sibley's capable of and him and Burns can stodge their way to glory for the next few years.

Proper test cricket.

Also when I first scanned your post I saw it as "Thundercats" and was much confused.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Sibley is quite a limited player in that he doesn't really drive or cut the ball (especially against pace) so needs to be incredibly disciplined leaving outside off to drag the bowling straighter, where he is proficient.

However, he has always had that discipline in the first class game and in this innings he has translated that against a top class attack including one of the premier surgeons of the day and two quick men. It's encouraging. The first challenge for him will be to maintain that patience when teams don't leave the off stump channel. The next challenge will be to resist the England setup and media trying to make him be more 'positive' outside off, which I'm not sure, with his technique and setup, would be a good idea - it'll open up way more dismissals than are available when he plays like this. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.

[Ian]

Did you see Gooch talking about this on the Debate the other day? Talking about batsmen positioning themselves so their eyeline is just outside off for the sake of "positivity" but it also means they don't actually know where their stumps are and encourages them to chase any old wide filth that gets flung down. As you say, the key thing is for him not to cave and think he has to start waving his bat after everything.

Also, speaking of the Debate, why have they bumped it up to 45 minutes now Bob is gone? :mad:

[Jimmy Floyd]

I didn't but will seek out. Buttler in particular gets into lots of one day positions in Test matches, where he plants the feet on fifth stump to give him a power base and then the hands just follow the ball. In fact, though less exaggerated, I'm 99% sure that Root's plateauing form in Tests has come about from something like the same phenomenon, where he is so keen to get bat to ball from his white ball methods that he can't resist feeling for 5th/6th stump deliveries he should leave alone.

Bairstow is a bit different in that he just seems to miss the thing.

[niko_cee]

101 overs and not a single no ball in this innings. Hard to believe.

[Ian]

In fact, though less exaggerated, I'm 99% sure that Root's plateauing form in Tests has come about from something like the same phenomenon, where he is so keen to get bat to ball from his white ball methods that he can't resist feeling for 5th/6th stump deliveries he should leave alone.

I was saying to somebody the other day that it used to feel like Root used to take ages to get into an innings. Feeling his way in and sizing up the bowling, letting the bowler come to him and then starting to score the runs.

Now he gets earlier runs but barely converts them into anything, possibly for the reasons you've said.

I assume the Gooch comment would've been on the Debate for the first day of this test. Whichever one had him and Ebony Rainford-Brent on.

[thommo]

This innings has filled me with hope for the future. Hopefully no pressure is put on Burns, Denly and Sibley to score at a quicker rate, because we have that explosiveness down the order to capitalise on the tired minds and legs of bowlers who have been ground down by a solid top order.

218 runs in 79 overs yesterday sets the platform, and we've walloped 150 in 26 overs before lunch today. Perfect.

[Ian]

Declare at this point, Shirley?

[thommo]

Maybe a 20 minute dart after lunch? Keep the openers guessing a little as to when they come out.

[Ian]

We're 400-and-odd ahead now. Batting longer feels like when we used to try and pile up a sodding 500 run lead just to be safe and left ourselves too little time.

Or let me put it to you this way: this pitch, that iffy crack aside, has been good enough for an England opener to bat a day and a half.

[Ian]

And of course we haven't declared.

[thommo]

Well now we should have bloody declared. I would have been fine with an immediate declaration on the 8th wicket, but what's the point of Broad and Anderson going out there?

[Ian]

It's fucking moronic.

There's barely any point in Broad getting his pads on when we actually need the runs, let alone when we're miles ahead.

Fucking declare you cowards.

[thommo]

Actually, let Broad hook Rabada for 6, and then declare before the next ball. That would make all this dilly-dallying worth it.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I was ok with the declaration. Faf signalled he had given up on the match ages ago when he bowled Maharaj all morning.

[Ian]

Currently a bit fascinated with the up and down votes on the BBC live text.

Who is even voting on these? Are they responding to what has been written or the event it's describing?

So many questions.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I am obsessed by them as well. I want to know the nature of the electorate. The clearest trend is that good news for England gets up votes and bad news for England gets down votes, but on the author's shite banter and people's texts in, things become far less clear.

One thing I have noticed is that any highlighted quotes by female commentators/analysts get a good chunk of downvotes regardless of their content. There's something about the existence of women pundits that really frustrates a fairly large tranche of people.

[Ian]

I find the cricket ones I've seen or listened to pretty good. Alex whatserface on all the football ones isn't even close to the worst football ones. As you say, a woman's voice just gets certain unnecessarily angry.

To be fair my mum has always bitched about basically any female newsreader or sports pundit she sees.

[Ian]

Denly is withdrawn in favour of Dom Bess' off-spin, now turning the ball in to the right-handers, hoping to create indecision around off stump. Hamza isn't what you'd call a picture of certainty, an inside edge almost having the short leg field interested. There are 20 overs left in the day.

This got zero votes of either flavour. Chilling stuff.

[Ian]

Feels better getting that extra wicket before the close there. Should still be good to get this done tomorrow and hopefully get Jimmy more involved.

[Ian]

I see that Hameed has moved county. Any real chance that he's going to get back to where he was? It'd be nice to have options for opener so if more injuries happen or one of Burns / Sibley don't work out to not have to resort to Keaton Fucking Jennings.

[Jimmy Floyd]

KFJ will play in Sri Lanka. Hameed has been fully broken for about two years, time will tell if a move to Notts will do the trick.

[thommo]

Weren't we in Sri Lanka touring last winter? Seems strange to have another one scheduled for the following year.

[Ian]

KFJ will play in Sri Lanka.

Nooooooo. If he does better because those are more his conditions then fucking Ed Smith is going to go "OH SHIT IT'S WORKING!!!" and we'll be back where we were. Looking at his subcontinent scores on Cricinfo it's very shit or bust. Ten innings, two centuries, one fifty, a near-fifty and then six sets of absolute shite.

[Ian]

Cheers, Faf.

It did sound from the live text like the nerves were getting to South Africa a bit with a couple of iffy shot choices.

[Ian]

That's more like it. Was worried Malan would hang around for ever (not a concern I ever had with Dawid.)

[Jimmy Floyd]

This sort of scenario is where our old mate Jofra would come into his own.

[Ian]

Sounds like Denly is getting the ball to do a fair bit.

[Ian]

That seems to be a wicket apiece off two deliveries of absolute filth that we've served up. :drool:

[Ian]

I wish I was at home watching this.

If we draw because we run out of time to take this last wicket I'm going to find out who wanted to keep batting yesterday and burn their house down.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Stokes is approaching folk legend status now.

[thommo]

I've done the square root of fuck all today in work because I've been constantly refreshing and listening where I can to this. What an amazing effort from Stokes AGAIN to drag us over the line.


If we draw because we run out of time to take this last wicket I'm going to find out who wanted to keep batting yesterday and burn their house down.
Perfectly timed declaration, and we got to see the majesty of Broad at the crease too. :D

[Jimmy Floyd]

I thought the declaration was fine. If this South Africa team batted 150+ overs then fair fucks.

Stokes' morning assault yesterday proving crucial in that regard.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Buttler calling Big Vern a knobhead and then telling the bowler to 'bowl it past his fucking gut' is well worthy of the MBE he got last week.

[Ian]

Is that what he's said? :D

Stokes bloody thrives on the big moments.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Not often I get to say this nowadays, but lol at India.

[debbie11]

Australia thumped India by 10 wickets in the first ODI.

[Ian]

Seeing the cricket has started has just broken my dream from last night.

I was at somebody's house (not one I recognise so I'm not sure whose) and Jofra Archer and Jos Buttler were in the back garden playing about with a cricket set for kids. I wanted to go and join in but I was too busy helping with dinner in the kitchen.

Also this has started well so far.

[thommo]

The pitch seems completely dead though. Hopefully it provides something as the match progresses because it could really peter out into a bore draw.

[niko_cee]

Do either of these batting line-ups really have it in them to bat out a bore draw though? Calamity is only ever an over away for both.

[thommo]

We were only 8 overs away from one on a surface that offered more (for the first 3 days at least) in the last Test.

[Ian]

If anybody can make this look like a minefield at some point, England can.

[Jimmy Floyd]

This looks Nagpur-tier from the few clips I have seen. Proper shitheap. Won't even get to see MS Dhoni run himself out for 99 here either.

[niko_cee]

I think it would have been unfair to categorise the last test as a 'bore draw' had SA batted out. Cardiff when Jimmy and Monty made their stand was hardly a boring game, but yeah, this does look a bit dead. Hopefully it deteriorates massively. We've definitely got it in us to spaz our way to a plucky 300 first innings effort before being ground into the dust and scoreboard pressured in the 3rd innings.

[Jimmy Floyd]

We need to bat most of tomorrow, no doubt about that. Just to annoy them if nothing else.

[Ian]

Ahhh, an opener getting in and then lobbing his wicket away. Lovely. This is England.

[Ian]

It sounds like Crawley was very, very obviously being set up for that and has walked right into it.

Is chasing it down the leg side our new "wafting at filth that's wide of off stump"?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Batsmen are programmed to tuck away anything on leg stump so it's a bit harder to be disciplined there.

[Max Power]

Following at work and watching us getting tantalisingly close to the sub 2rpo innings run rate is keeping me distracted.

Should be a big one for Root here.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He tends to bat well on these decks so here's hoping he doesn't run out of partners. Can see Stokes chucking in a now-trademark 4* (60) start too.

[Jimmy Floyd]

They'll be through us by the close here.

[thommo]

Top recovery in the end from Stokes and Pope. I really hope England don't ruin Pope - he's fantastic to watch with some lovely strokes, and he seems to have a calm temperament, perfect for the Test environment. I could easily see him in this middle order for the next decade.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He's a beauty. Just oozes class. I thought Maharaj would butcher us then but he just ran out of steam. We still want 400 really but it's more about batting time. We have two thoroughbreds in our attack and of the three workhorses, two are kids. I bet Root and Denly end up bowling loads of overs.

[Ian]

Rabada banned for fourth Test
Big news.

South Africa bowler Kagiso Rabada has been banned for the fourth Test after picking up a demerit point for his celebration of the wicket of Joe Root yesterday.

Oof.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I'm a bit torn on this one. I hate it when players scream in dismissed batsmen's faces (Jimmy Anderson and Mitchell Starc are also repeat offenders) but we don't need to be dishing out bans for it. Just make him wear a stupid hat all day or something.

[Ian]

Stokes. :cool:

[niko_cee]

It's a great innings and all but he's thrown it away at the end there (and tried to several times before that).

[thommo]

I feel 'thrown it away' is a particularly harsh term for a batsman who has made 120 and shared a 200 run partnership for your team. If he'd made a classy 25 and then wafted a wide one to cover (aka Vinced it), then fair enough. As it is, he's set the stage for Pope to (hopefully) get his first 100 and for Buttler and Curran to accelerate before tea.

[thommo]

Ok, scratch Buttler from my previous post. :facepalm:

[niko_cee]

Here we go.

All out for 400 now. Should have been coasting to 500+. He did throw it away. Don't make me break out the Goochology.

[Ian]

Or he's let Buttler in do that.

I agree with Niko and I think both things can be true. He's chucked his wicket away out of what looked like impatience but that doesn't make it a bad innings, just a bit of a waste of potentially piling on more. He's still put us in a very good position but the potential of the players following him shouldn't let him off the hook.

[Danny]

Curran getting a little too excited there. Was a big score available for him

[Jimmy Floyd]

It's not easy to get runs on this deck. Left handers having a pump at Maharaj has been our only real way of doing it.

Buttler needs to sort his life out really.

[Ian]

I was really happy for Pope and then he took his helmet off.

Drop him immediately. As in before the end of the match.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He's always worn that headband to bat as far as I can remember. I think it kind of suits him.

He will get so many runs against teams like Sri Lanka and that on home decks. And against good teams, no doubt, but he will cream the shit everywhere for fun.

[Ian]

Pollock was saying on Sky he has some doubts about Dibley and Crawley and whether you'd be able to just pick them on any surface / against any opposition but he said the same, that Pope you'd be looking to pick every time he's available.

Until Bairstow decides to reclaim his spot, obvs.

[Ian]

Rabada's face there. :D

[Jimmy Floyd]

Richly deserved misery for him, has been taking the piss with no balls all series.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Pollock was saying on Sky he has some doubts about Dibley and Crawley and whether you'd be able to just pick them on any surface / against any opposition but he said the same, that Pope you'd be looking to pick every time he's available.

Until Bairstow decides to reclaim his spot, obvs.

Crawley is questionable (looks a bit skittish to me) but I'll have Sibley anywhere.

[Dave.]

Crawley is questionable (looks a bit skittish to me) but I'll have Sibley anywhere.

I'm happy with Sibley and Burns opening in the near future. Denly will continue to bat no.3 for a year or so, lets hope Crawley improves a little in that time and we have a reasonable top three.

[Ian]

I put Dibley as a typo but maybe I should start calling him The Vicar.

Or have all the bantertwats already started doing that?

Broad batting 11. :drool:

[thommo]

That little partnership is such a perfect way to round off a big innings. 73 runs in 35 minutes, and seeing Rabada getting carted around is the cherry on top. He could have bowled 30 no balls a Test if they were being correctly called.

[Ian]

Handy bit of work from Bess there.

Sounded like Hamza didn't want any of Wood.

[Ian]

While the Cricket Debate was obviously going to suffer without Bob I also just don't like it as much as back when it was the Verdict with the Sunday Supplement-style set-up but also always having somebody from the nation we're playing in the current series on there too. It's still decent as they tend to picki well but the views aren't as varied.

[Jimmy Floyd]

It can get a bit cosy on cricket panels as the people involved generally all played with each other and don't want to rock the boat too much (that was why Bob was great). They kind of need a Souness figure, which Nasser sort of is but he's also quite positive and constructive.

Broad will make an amazing pundit one day, I hope he goes into it.

[Ian]

Yeah I mean Bob aside you never got fireworks on the Verdict but by having somebody from the opposing nation you're at least getting a few more "Yeah, buts-"

I know Shastri is a fanny for a lot of reasons but him and Bob were always good on the Verdict and Tom Moody was good when he did that whole Ashes series of them as well.

I reckon you'd right about Broad and Sky will probably do their utmost to get him when he packs it in.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I think there are domestic people they are missing as well due to not being MASSIVE names. Michael Carberry was on the BBC thing the other day and was really good. Derek Pringle should be on everything (his book is a must read too). They could also have, say, an ex player plus a journo as the latter has a bit more freedom to say what they want to say.

[Danny]

Shiv certainly doesnt need a paternity test on this one

Opened, batted all day and then ended up not out.

https://i.redd.it/1zgnspwg1eb41.jpg

[niko_cee]

Thought his name was Tangerine for a second there.

[Ian]

I think there are domestic people they are missing as well due to not being MASSIVE names.

I've often thought for football that there are so many players, managers, coaches etc. that there must be a few who'd be properly engaging, interesting pundits but the attitude is "Well he played for Tranmere, he can't know anyway."

[Jimmy Floyd]

I saw Japan v New Zealand on the cricinfo bar and had to do a double take. Under 19 World Cup. How marvellous.

Loving this Test cricket with Dom Bess hoying his 6/10 twirlers at Nortje (2* off 50). Hopefully he ends up with all ten here and Indians/Australians seethe.

[niko_cee]

I was thinking this is very much going to be his Jason Krejza moment.

[niko_cee]

Although maybe I have that wrong, I was thinking he returned crazy figures against India once but wiki disagrees.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He got an eight for didn't he? Michael Clarke was the real pisstake getting 6/10 or something.

This prompted me to watch this again, fucking hell: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsFatA-5_R8

3:55 the magic starts.

[igor_balis]

I was thinking this is very much going to be his Jason Krejza moment.

My mate knows a girl who shagged him, shit in bed apparently.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Lol at this start. Three poles tumbling in three overs, all to ludicrously bad shots.

[Max Power]

Had a feeling we were gonna bat again for a minute there.

Great stuff but Jesus Christ those shots, Philander and de Kock especially having played so nicely yesterday.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I am 100% certain Cook would have batted again. 'You can't predict the weather'

[Ian]

We never used to enforce the follow on fucking regardless so The Data must be really struggling with the weather if it's demanded that.

Scene: The ECB control room. Banks of computers and screens generating The Data, to determine The Plans. A technician looks at his glowing monitor in disbelief and throws his hand into the air

Geek: Mr Smith? Sir? You're going to need to see this...

Ed Smith struts haughtily over to the technician and peers at the screen. The perma-smug look fades from his face. He begins to sweat.

Ed: That can't be right, man.

Geek: It is, Sir.

Ed: Pioppycock. Run the numbers again.

Geek: I have, Sir. Twice. That's definitely what the Data is saying.

Ed gulps as he pulls out his phone and dials a number.

Ed: Rooty? It's Big Ed........ Put them back in.

A garbled but clearly shocked response can be heard.

Ed: Just do it, Rooty!

Ed Smith hangs up the phone and slumps into a nearby office chair, head in one hand.

Ed: And may God have mercy on us all.....

[Jimmy Floyd]

I have read Ed Smith's book comparing baseball to cricket (so you don't have to) and he really does overthink things. I seem to remember him thinking that the pitcher is comparable to cricket's batsman, while baseball's hitters are like the bowlers. I have never quite got my head around that. I think the logic was that the odds are stacked against hitters/bowlers on each delivery. What he seemed to be missing was that one of them is trying to score runs by hitting a ball into/out of a field. That seemed the most obvious comparison to me.

He LOVES moneyball and things like that, but the whole point of moneyball was to maximise utility with relatively scant resources. The Northamptonshire Steelbacks have done it quite well in cricket, but England, as its name suggests, is literally a country and has every cricketer in said country available to choose from (except, alas, for Sir Alastair Cook). As such they don't need to maximise scant resources, they just need to pick the best players in the right combination for the conditions.

The weird thing about his reign so far is that despite all his stats guff, all his decisions seem to have been contrary to all available stats. Jason Roy, Jos Buttler, Joe Denly...

[Ian]

You've said before that he clearly thinks he's some sort of maverick who can just roll by on INSTINCT.

[Ian]

Saffers showing Root exactly what they think of him pushing to get his five-for.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He's probably trying to save Broad's legs. I would get Curran on though.

[Ian]

This all sounds a bit tragic at this stage.

[Danny]

Anyone listened to the BBC bit on Cronje? Thought it was pretty good.

[thommo]

Our old friend Joel Wilson with a glorious mistake inside the first 8 overs.

[Ian]

Is the stadium nearly empty??

[Jimmy Floyd]

I'm backing Zak here, every single run for him takes us further away from a Jennings recall.

[Ian]

Anything but Jennings. :mad:

[Danny]

I feel very uneasy about our recent opening partnerships being this successful.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Burns
Sibley
Crawley
Root
Stokes
Pope
Foakes
Curran
Bess
Leach
Wood/Archer

The team to win in India next year. Unless Mo comes back. Then I'll have to murder one of my darlings.

[Danny]

I am with you on that team. Saw the title of the Tuffers and Vaughan show the other day was “Pope will end up at 3”. I would rather him not to be honest. Let him do his thing in the middle order for 10 years.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Vaughan just talks shite and I think he knows it. Proper piece of work.

South Africa's short ball/leg theory plan at these two is proper chocolate teapot.

[Ian]

If not by moving him to three how ARE we going to ruin Pope? If he just keeps on getting good scores they'll start getting itchy.

[Jimmy Floyd]

You would have to be mental to push him to number three. Genuinely deranged. Five maybe, in time, but Stokes is there now so no need to change anything. Root-Stokes-Pope is that sorted which it hasn't really been since Collingwood retired.

[Ian]

Assuming they don't call up KFJ our batting line up looks as strong as it has in a long time. I'd still like Foakes though.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Ed Smith's furious determination not to pick Foakes will really be tested for this tour of Sri Lanka coming up. If he picks Bairstow and Buttler again I might just start watching croquet instead.

[Ian]

I've probably asked this before but why is it he won't pick Foakes?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Nobody knows but I suspect it's because he has run it through a computer and found that batting > keeping, statistically. That is less true in spinning conditions I think (and our next MASSIVE series is India away), and it's also less true when Bairstow and Buttler are scoring no runs. In Buttler's case there is also zero evidence he is ever going to score any red ball runs. I think he is a marvellous cricketer but at some point you have to deliver.

Foakes had a ropey batting season last year for Surrey but then you would, wouldn't you.

[Max Power]

Outrageously poor cricket from South Africa in the past half hour. Mark Wood carving sixes over point though :drool:

[Jimmy Floyd]

This Broad knock is proper Lazarus stepping out of the tomb stuff.

[niko_cee]

South Africa's short ball/leg theory plan at these two is proper chocolate teapot.

Yeah, that felt like peak shit England when they were doing that. As did the debacle of the last wicket. South Africa have rather disintegrated in this series.

[Gray Fox]

Left with England about to be bowled for 330 or so, to come back and not only see a lol 80+ final wicket stand, but S'affers are 6 down below 100. Lovely stuff.

[Jimmy Floyd]

They are a total rabble. It's easy to blame the Kolpak stuff but even if you reversed all that, what are you getting?

Kyle Abbott in for Dane Paterson
Duanne Olivier/Morne Morkel/Simon Harmer probably in for Pretorius/Maharaj

That makes their bowling lineup more consistent but doesn't transform it. Batting wise you're looking at Heino Kuhn and Rilee Roussouw, not sure they would strike any more fear into English hearts than the current selection of batsmen do.

Ultimately they have had the same problem a lot of countries have had during the last decade. If you don't look after your domestic cricket properly then the seasoned options just aren't there to step in when great names like Amla, de Villiers and Steyn come to the end. The ECB seem desperate to take us down the same route (bean counters get quite frustrated and upset when people talk about having a strong county game, because it just doesn't show up on balance sheets, hence the fucking Hundred) but the counties have held firm so far and keep churning out the talent, or at least most of them do. Hampshire and Glamorgan can get to fuck.

[niko_cee]

He may be a legend for them and all but Philander has totally phoned it in this series. That gut is a disgrace for a professional sportsman.

[Max Power]

This is a always a dull period of a test match. England justifiably batting again but with such a big lead and nothing really to be gained for South Africa there’s nothing really happening. At least if Stokes or Pope were in we’d get some stroke making.

Not knocking it, just on my one day of watching it’s the kinda boring bit :moop:

[Jimmy Floyd]

You can have endless fun watching Dom Sibley's leaving prowess, and Beuran Hendricks's dreadful wrist position. Mute it when Kevin Pietersen comes on commentary and it's the perfect Sunday.

[Max Power]

Quite like when Sibley watches the ball into the keepers gloves even when it’s a mile outside off stump.

[John Arne]

What's the theory behind not enforcing the follow on? Give the bowlers a rest?

[Gray Fox]

If the weather forecast is fine, build a lead you know can't be beaten, get your bowlers a rest and annoy the other side by having them field all day.

They're still going to have South Africa needing 400-450 with the best part of 2 days to bowl them out.

[Gray Fox]

Might be worth declaring here to get some overs in before the night.

[niko_cee]

Not really convinced by the way we've gone about this but whatever.

At least we can use it as evidence against Buttler.

[Jimmy Floyd]

What's the theory behind not enforcing the follow on? Give the bowlers a rest?

Exactly, especially when your stallion quick bowler has the most high maintenance body on earth. You also get to bowl when the pitch is at its oldest.

The only real times to enforce it are when you are pushed for time; when the bowling conditions are unusually good at that moment; or if you are playing Belgium and have a first innings lead of four million and just want to get it over with.

[igor_balis]

It was day 3 and we're 2-1 up in a four match series, enforcing the follow on would have been totally mental, and probably the only (admittedly tiny) chance south Africa had of getting back into the game.

If they'd somehow managed to set us 150+ to chase you just never know.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Not really convinced by the way we've gone about this but whatever.

At least we can use it as evidence against Buttler.

It was a bit weird but it's given Root another unconverted 50 and that's the real quiz.

[Ian]

This first ODI is going well.

[Max Power]

Proper throwback effort this

[niko_cee]

Yeah, we've won this format, so back to being rubbish at it.

Particularly liked Denly's inclusion, and his gritty sub-100 strike rate innings.

[Jimmy Floyd]

We really are getting all of the milk from Denly's teat aren't we.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Buttler has scored just one century in 41 Tests and his form with the bat has tailed off in recent months — he averages 29, 24, 21 and 16 in his last four series.

Some of his wicketkeeping when standing up to the stumps in South Africa was also a bit scruffy.

But Root is a huge fan of Buttler, a former Test vice- captain and Eoin Morgan’s No 2 in white ball cricket, while head coach Chris Silverwood preaches the mantra of continuity.

Surrey’s Ben Foakes, an ever-present when England whitewashed Sri Lanka 3-0 in late 2018, will go as second-choice gloveman.

:face:

[Ian]

Continuity for it's own sake. Great.

[thommo]

First time I've seen Mo give a batsman a send-off.

[niko_cee]

That review thing was ridiculous. He needed the send off.

Good to see the spin twins back at it.

Jordan was a bit pap in those final overs, although it's a hard task defending that short boundary.

[Jimmy Floyd]

First time I've seen this Sipamla but he looks a bowler to me. Lovely fundamentals. Looks like it would be a good action for red ball too, or perhaps more so.

[Jimmy Floyd]

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/8368/game/1204722/bangladesh-under-19s-vs-india-under-19s-final-icc-under-19-world-cup-2019-20

This was lol as fuck, particularly the various bits when the two sets of players were just screaming at each other in fury for no apparent reason.

Good to know they didn't stray far from the formula though:


Rakibul has the flag wrapped around him as he speaks: "It's an unbelievable experience. We came here with plans and it worked out really well. Whichever team executes their plans better on the day wins, and that happened for us today."

[Clunge]

That was unnecessarily laboured in the end, shame Banton couldn't see us through. Still, 1-1.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Banton's set up is pretty much baseball. Planted feet, open stance. Literally cannot believe there are people (Michael Vaughan) advocating for him to bat 6 in the Test team. I doubt he'd average 30 in county cricket.

[Ian]

KFJ is in the Sri Lanka squad.

I wonder which actual promising opener is taking the fall for the useless twat. :moop:

[Dave.]

KFJ is in the Sri Lanka squad.

I wonder which actual promising opener is taking the fall for the useless twat. :moop:

To be fair, there isn't a great deal of options in this area. Sam Hain springs to mind but that's about it.

[Ian]

My problem isn't so much that he's getting called up for being good against spin (well I do have issues with that given his form seems to be crap, but let's pretend for the sake of this that I don't) as the fact that previous form suggests if he does do well we'll then insist on playing him elsewhere for a bit. And that he will be shit.

I don't see why we can't see how the ones we have get on.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He might be a Burns placeholder. It is so weird, having learned his cricket in South Africa and then Durham, that he is seen as a spin specialist.

I think it's more that he is wank outside his off stump, to be honest.

[Ian]

Averages 40 in ten innings on the subcontinent, 258 of it coming from two innings.

21 average outside the subcontinent.

SPECIALIST.

[niko_cee]

I loved the idea of sending Joe Denly in to 'maintain the right-had left-hand combination' whilst you've got Stokes sitting in the shed. Classic England behaviour.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Joe Denly's international career (all three formats!) is just pure banter. Ed Smith played with him of course.

[John]

I see America are having a go at cricket, equaling the lowest ever ODI score yesterday.

[Jimmy Floyd]

They should be better than that on paper, although Nepal have one nigh on world class bowler who looks to have sorted them out.

[Ian]

This is off to a fine start.

[Jimmy Floyd]

They'll never get these. Moeen is our leader.

[Jimmy Floyd]

They are getting these. I'd forgotten how rank poor we are in these situations.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Oh, they've out-choked us, despite Quinton de Kock being a cheating cunt. As you were.

[thommo]

Curran did well to hold his nerve for those final two balls. Fucking shameless cheating from the Saffers though, shouting from the balcony is such bullshit. And why did the 3rd umpire spend about 5 minutes when there was clear daylight between the bat and ball on the side-on camera?

[Ian]

How were they cheating? I was only half watching.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Quinny de Kock did that thing where it was LBW and he was signalling down to the pitch for the batsman to review, something which is illegal and I believe it was our saffa friends who had a massive cry when Australia did it a few years ago.

Naturally the decision was upheld.

[niko_cee]

Thanks christ they got Malan out there.

Does he ever move his feet? I always thought he was an elegant biffer.

Not much chance of getting these unless Mo goes mad.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Malan is a prick and Eoin Morgan hates him, so no future there.

We really need to stop picking people like Mark Wood in this. T20 demands changes of pace.

[Ian]

That was looking a properly tasty finish until Morgan got bored.

[niko_cee]

:cab:

Knew we'd need Mo to see us over the line.

[Jimmy Floyd]

T20 is a bit of a farce on the haaaah veld. No total is ever really enough. Easy sixes for everyone and you basically can't bowl anything except perfect yorkers.

[Max Power]

England on a road can get anything in limited overs cricket.

[igor_balis]

https://scontent-lht6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/86620257_2807349892693248_1734972324349739008_n.pn g?_nc_cat=100&_nc_ohc=6iw8to8_WHkAX_aN70b&_nc_ht=scontent-lht6-1.xx&oh=ded3877ca11c7441369bb73379ea9080&oe=5EBEE120