F1 2021 - Covid 2: Viral Boogaloo

[Jimmy Floyd]

If there's one thing we've learned over the last few years it's that Bottas cannot compete with Lewis.

[Gray Fox]

I know Lewis is winning the war so far, but it's just showing me how good Max actually is.

Bottas isn't anywhere near Lewis.

[SincereTheRebel]

Hamilton is miles ahead of the compo.

[SincereTheRebel]

I know Lewis is winning the war so far, but it's just showing me how good Max actually is.

Bottas isn't anywhere near Lewis.

Max is good. I still think Leclerc if he gets the right car underneath him. Has the latent for Max. Big If though as Fererri have been awful.

[Pleb]

Monaco's back tomorrow lads.

Mazaspin to throw his car into the swimming pool.

[Shindig]

"It's a pretty short debate, Murray."


Hamilton and Mercedes have set up a foundation to try to attract more people from an ethic minority background into motorsport, and he has set up commission to look into why minorities are under-represented.

There's a lot less of them, Lewis. That's why they're called minorities. Still, you never know who you're missing out on if you're not looking. The day a black lad/lass turns up on a MotoGP grid will be monumental. The Spanish crowds won't know what to to do with themselves.

[Disco]

The Spanish crowds will know exactly what to do, it's the ever competent sporting administrators who will be flummoxed.

[Jimmy Floyd]

99% of the population are excluded from motorsport, regardless of colour. The fact that a black driver made it to the top is nothing short of miraculous.

[Disco]

Colour aside it's amazing enough that someone from a council estate background made it as far as he did before Mclaren picked him up. Testament to the work him and his family had to put in and how good he is.

[SincereTheRebel]

Norris outshining Ricc again I see.

[niko_cee]

Le Clerc red flagging the session whilst on pole, lol.

[Gray Fox]

Nico Rosberg is proud.

[SincereTheRebel]

Clealry he wrote himself off. Legend status confirmed.

[SincereTheRebel]

Max will send it into turn one if he starts second and there is a chance.

[phonics]

So Ferrari are definitely cheating again right. They were good, found to be cheating, turned absolute dog shit, said the won't be doing any upgrades this year, and get poles? Yea right.

[Disco]

It's Monaco, you could probably peddle round and be competitive, it's the place where engine matters the least.

[Gray Fox]

Monaco is all slow speed corners and for 19/20 drivers you'll be following someone else around. The tyres last forever too.

Not enough room for the Mercedes to stretch its legs. Almost always a dull race though.

[Shindig]

Yeah, they could possibly manage the same in Hungary. If they manage a pole at Monza, ask questions.

[Gray Fox]

Easy win for Max from here then.

[7om]

Gutted for Sharl. I understand why they didn’t change the gearbox last night though. Worth the risk with it probably being their only chance for a win this season.

[Disco]

The dream was they collide at St Devote and all bets are off, this would suggest a bit of an open goal. If I were Toto I think I'd offer Bottas a new contract dependent on him being first by Mirabeau and Max in a barrier somewhere.

[Gray Fox]

Mercedes with the full implode button there.

[Jimmy Floyd]

At least the championship is alive (ish).

[Disco]

Ferrari lolling Sharl out of another Monaco race was quite amusing but that was the most interesting bit of the entire day, part of me hopes he never has a good result there just so we can avoid all the schmaltzy fairytale bollocks that would inevitably ensue.

By my reckoning there was one overtake for position that wasn't completed either on lap one (there were only two of these) or during a pitstop, and even then it was Mazepin being let past by his teammate. It wouldn't be so bad if they just embraced the shitness but even on Saturday you had David Croft correcting Martin Brundle and trying to claim it was merely 'extremely difficult' to overtake rather than completely impossible. They need to lean into it, take 20 laps off the race because what possible difference would it make and turn Saturday into the attraction. If you can have wanker sprint races at some circuits why not have a different qualifying at Monaco, one that highlights the contest between drivers and removes the bullshit traffic and crashing shenanigans that normally ruin it. Do a knock out system or have some little three lap head to head stagger races, something that is an actual contest.

[Shindig]

Qualify as normal, swap to Formula 2 machinery on the Sunday. I don't care if F1's not a spec series, Monaco is a spec circuit. Also, Max Mosley is dead. The excitement from the race probably did him in.

[Disco]

Formula E has a wide range of things that make it shit but the race they had at Monaco this year was amazing, they were even overtaking at Massenet. Ignore the horrible 'boost mode' shite and it was perfect, goes to show that it's the insanely big F1 cars that are more the problem but (for reasons which escape me) F1 seems wedded to having giant cars that simply don't work at tight circuits.

[Shindig]

It's all down to aero. Thicker cars leads to a bigger floor and surfaces to funnel air through. Plus, with the turbo era cars being so full of torque, the weight at the back keeps that manageable to drive. Probably. I don't know what you do with the layout. There's very few roads you can get the cars down and the closer you move it inland, the more you have to deal with the hills. Plus the posh bastards like to watch from their yachts.

[Gray Fox]

The cars are huge since refuelling went, I think Brundle said something along the lines of them occupying the same length and width of a Range Rover. Combine that with the aero making it very hard to follow another car closely means you get what we got on Sunday.

Next spec is supposed to get rid of a large part of that along with BIG TYRES, so maybe it'll be better next year. We also got no one binning it into a wall or breaking down on track this time, which is quite unusual for Monaco.

In a weird way I imagine it to be the best circuit to drive, but the worst to watch currently.

[niko_cee]

Yeah, it's definitely one for the drivers and not the spectators.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I like watching the visual and the driving skill at Monaco, but I guess people are looking for CLOSE EXCITING RACING so whatever.

[Shindig]

Closer than dropping back 2 seconds to prevent your tyres from boiling, at least.

[niko_cee]

I like watching the visual and the driving skill at Monaco, but I guess people are looking for CLOSE EXCITING RACING so whatever.

The aesthetic is certainly there, but that only accounts for so much.

Maybe they should make it a 'throwback round' a la other sports and get everyone to use historic kit.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I would make it stupidly long. 200 laps or something. Test the endurance of car and driver, and force them to stop more than once.

[Shindig]

They did 100 in the 60's. Historic kit already gets a run. That brings up some good racing because you've got cars out of position and they're not really doing this for a living. I'd love a grid full of those Arrow A2's though.

https://www.scalemates.com/products/img/7/7/9/185779-12835-pristine.jpg

[phonics]

Fan car and that one with 6 wheels only please.

[Gray Fox]

Looks like the poor lad in the Moto3 crash yesterday hasn't pulled through.

[Shindig]

Bugger. Watching any bike race, I'm always terrified when I witness a bike strike.

[SincereTheRebel]

In the clip I saw, I didn't really understand what happened.

[Shindig]

Yeah, I think the camera down the main straight don't give you a proper view of it. I think someone hits Dupasquier, he's down in the middle of the track and he gets hit by a following bike. 3 bikes involved, at least.

EDIT: Seen a closer look. He goes down in the pack and the next rider (the one that somersaulted down the straight) collects him immediately. His own bike does some of the damage. No time to react. :(

[SincereTheRebel]

Small mistakes and its gsme over, as it should be. Two man wrote off in Q1

[Gray Fox]

Ricciardo really isn't getting along with that McLaren is he.

[SincereTheRebel]

He hasn't got along with anything since he beat Vettel

[Shindig]

LeClerc again. Where's this pace come from?

[Disco]

A giant tow.

[Gray Fox]

A shame we were denied that finale.

It's great seeing them all this close at a race too. A shame the 2022 regs will blow that out again.

[Shindig]

This is the closest Mazepin's been to Schumacher on raw pace, too. Shame they're a second off the Williams' but the race has safety car written all over it.

[Gray Fox]

I've been a critic of Bottas in the past, but he's been done over today. He was told to play the team game and give up the tow first, which he did. If anything too well. Then for the 2nd run they sent him out first of anyone and Hamilton last. No way he could have made that up to give the tow back.

And now he starts 10th for his troubles.

[Shindig]

Nurburgring 24 hours is under way. It's drenched. :youpi:

[7om]

I've been a critic of Bottas in the past, but he's been done over today. He was told to play the team game and give up the tow first, which he did. If anything too well. Then for the 2nd run they sent him out first of anyone and Hamilton last. No way he could have made that up to give the tow back.

And now he starts 10th for his troubles.

I do feel for the bloke this season. His luck is just horrendous. I do think this is the beginning of them end for him at Merc, I just don’t know if it will be George who replaces him.

[phonics]

The downfall of Danny Ricc is :drool:

Banter your car out the way Daniel, you're being blue flagged.

[Pepe]

I do admit that seeing Norris completely don him gives me pleasure.

[Shindig]

Nurburgring weather update: Fogged to fuck. Race halted. :(

Formation lap and restart scheduled at 11am. Still foggy. 11 hours after the red flag dropped.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Erm... lol?

Proper '...and, collossally, it's Mansell!' vibes there.

[Shindig]

Absolutely. Red Bull calling for the red flag even though the race finishing under the SC would've guaranteed Checo the win. Vettel's winning this.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Absolutely. Red Bull calling for the red flag even though the race finishing under the SC would've guaranteed Checo the win. Vettel's winning this.

They were probably hoping for no restart so Verstappen would win.

[Shindig]

Ah, to wind it back a lap. Probably not a good idea when the FIA can use this as an advert for SPRINT RACES!

[SincereTheRebel]

Just tuning in to a formation lap with two laps left.

[Shindig]

Barbecued brakes.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Double lol.

Perez deserved that win, did a great job all day.

[Gray Fox]

What scenes.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I haven't missed Vettel's shite on team radio when he does well, that's for sure.

Mexican anthem again :drool:

[Shindig]

Mazepin apparently did Schumacher at the restart and finished 14th.

[Gray Fox]

Suspect Hamilton leaving his special brake warming device on has saved the title race there.

Pirelli need to do one with their purposefully degradable tyres.

[Jimmy Floyd]

A tyre that simultaneously requires a one stop strategy (with cars pitting in the first 10 laps), and then blows up, is the absolute pits, if you'll pardon the pun.

[Pepe]

Just looked at the results. What the fuck happened?

Perez. :cool:

[phonics]

Missed the f1 now I'm fuming.

[7om]

Great race.

Seen some people online blaming the teams rather than Pirelli for the blowouts. I swear I heard Crofty say that the hards were rated for at least 35-40 laps. Lance and Max were both under that number when they failed.

I absolutely love Gasly and Alpha Tauri by the way. I think it’s because he got absolutely shafted at Red Bull but the guy is so loveable. Brazil drag racing Hamilton to the line and winning in Monza last year were amazing viewing. Great to see Seb put in back to back great drives as well.

The only downer (aside from the obvious) was Leclerc not quite having the pace to stay out front that long. Ferrari are improving though and the sport really needs them.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Gasly's re-pass on Leclerc to get the podium was top bombing.

[phonics]

Teds Notebook is an incredible thing. It's just a guy talking to himself, completely unscripted but its informative, educational and funny. You could not watch the race and be able to picture the entire thing in your head just listening to it.

[phonics]

Also not that I have any right to criticise Hamilton when it comes to driving a formula 1 car but did he not notice that his brakes appeared to be creating the sort of plumes you’d see at a vape shop before the start?

[Gray Fox]

Toto suggested it was when Perez came over to try to squeeze him, Hamilton was adjusting his balance and this caused him to knock it with his finger.

[7om]

Also not that I have any right to criticise Hamilton when it comes to driving a formula 1 car but did he not notice that his brakes appeared to be creating the sort of plumes you’d see at a vape shop before the start?

I don’t think that was his problem, unless I’m mistaken. Hamilton accidentally selected the ‘magic’ strat which completely changes the brake bias, hence the lock up.

[phonics]

I figured the brake button was already on which is what was making them look on fire.

[Shindig]

I thought he'd overcooked them on the way round. I've seen some cars sit like that after formation laps but never to that degree.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kUOpUl3Etk

I was hoping ADAC would put together a better package than this. The first couple of hours were ridiculous with everyone navigating the standing water. Shame the fog rolled in but it did make for a decent 3 hour dash towards the end. Augusto Farfus being biffed genuinely got a "Fucking hell!" out of me (they don't show the actual crash in the video) and I enjoyed the Hyundai iQ or whatever that had a hood held together by gaffa tape.

Looking forward to the Spa 24 next month, now. Assuming they're able to pump the flood waters out of Eau Rouge. Le Mans is in late August so maybe weather will mess with that as well.

[Disco]

Lol at Sir Lewis having the title on a plate and pressing the crash button by mistake, especially after the 'marathon not a sprint' message.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Perez completely bottled the restart, which probably in turn made Hamilton shit himself when he found himself ahead (who knew they changed brake bias settings during the arrival into T1).

Also not to be a circuit design nerd again, but the start finish line really needs to be a lot further back, it seems absurd that they have a drag strip the length of the Caspian Sea and then about ten feet between the line and the braking zone.

[Disco]

I suspect the line is where it is to prevent first corner shenanigans, give them more of a run and there'll be twice as many divebombs and restarts.

[Shindig]

Man, Marquez got a third successive DNF yesterday. I think we're seeing the end of him. :( Quartararo would be out of sight if he could convert his poles to wins.

[Disco]

Get Acosta in pronto, I just watched him fall off and still finish 8th.

[Pleb]

Williams without a team principal now.

[SincereTheRebel]

all these stupid blue lines all over the place.

[Shindig]

More tyre gambles. Hamilton can't make these last.

[Disco]

Live band playing the anthems should be a stipulation for all races.

[Gray Fox]

Bottas fucked over yet again. Firstly they didn't listen to the driver, who knows best, when he told them they needed to switch to 2 stop. They not bringing him in for a run at a fastest lap is mind boggling.

The latter makes me think they already see him as out of the title race so no bother.

I strongly suspect the Mercs being human this year has a lot to do with them putting eggs in the 2022 basket, but it's tough to see how they stop Red Bull from here.

[7om]

Yep, Valtteri has got to be getting seriously pissed off. Are they doing this to justify dropping him for next season?

[niko_cee]

Whether he gets fucked over or not, he's just useless as soon as any sort of pressure is on. Verstappen up behind him, instant mistake.

Hamilton probably got the bigger team fucking with their bizarre first stop strategy.

Err, sorry Lewis, not sure what happened there . . .

[phonics]

Alonso has done a lot better than I thought he would. Danni Ric would be in Ocon positions.

[Disco]

Not sure about that, he donned Ocon silly last year.

[Shindig]

There's a real changing of the guard happening. I can't imagine Merc are throwing this in favour of next year. They are definitely trying to STRATEGY their way around Red Bull but it's just not going to happen. Not unless the Honda engines belch themselves to death.

In other news, Marquez won at Sachsenring. 90 points adrift, 11 rounds to go.

[Gray Fox]

Bottas dropping it in the pit lane is quite impressive. 3 place penalty already.

[Disco]

He's a shitty cookbook away from being the new Grosjean.

[7om]

Is anyone else getting tired of Paul Di Resta? The guy has zero personality and adds fuck all in everything he says. The worst part is that he never gets rotated while we only get the excellent Anthony Davidson every other race.

[Disco]

I think he has plenty to add but he has the delivery of a charmless goblin and if you took a drink every time he rags on Hamilton you'd be in trouble on Sunday evening.

Rosberg, for all his faults is the best driver pundit they've had (Brundle excepted).

[Gray Fox]

Davidson is limited because he still works with Mercedes, right? I remember them talking something about the workings of the car and tried to ask him but he wouldn't say.

Brundle will always be the top commentator because he has the right voice. But the key thing is he raced against all of the guys you grew up watching/adoring.

Di Resta is a bit shitter because his personality is that he's Scottish.

[7om]

I’ve been surprised by the reaction to Bottas’ pitlane spin. Brundle just said it wasn’t reckless. How was it not? He’s lost control of the car where there are numerous mechanics and pitlane staff standing around. It sure as hell would have been considered reckless if he’d hit someone. It’s a shocking and careless piece of driving, for me.

[Shindig]

An all Brundle commentary box wouldn't work, would it? They sound too alike.

[Disco]

Both do the same job so I think one or the other, but the younger one is very good when he's on F2/3.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Martin Brundle is just great, achieving the impossible by simultaneously sounding like a serious expert with 40 years' experience in the sport, and also like your dad's mate who did a bit of club racing once and drinks dark ale at the weekend.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Also, credit to Lando - he is giving Ricciardo a good shoeing so far.

[Jimmy Floyd]

This 'song' being sung on the grid by a bloke in lederhosen is the worst thing ever to happen in the continent of Europe.

[Disco]

I'm driving home today so I won't see it but the Styrian anthem was a highlight of last year.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Yeah, it was that, but mocked up to some sort of weird Christian pop / synth backing track, and sung by a man dressed absurdly on a very small podium while the drivers looked on in bemusement.

[7om]

Where the fuck is the rain? We were promised it!

[Pepe]

Also, credit to Lando - he is giving Ricciardo a good shoeing so far.

Yes he is. :drool:

[Shindig]

Mazepin's been getting the better of his teammate again. Not that I'm considering that suspicious. Russell's got another chance of points. Let's see if he actually keeps that.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Any race where I hear 'the wind is starting to pick up' on commentary before halfway is doomed.

[Gray Fox]

Russell is cursed so something will stop him.

[Shindig]

Russell is cursed so something will stop him.

Done. :D

[Gray Fox]

He needs to get out of that Williams as soon as he can.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He should probably be in the Mercedes by now, Bottas is useless.

[Shindig]

I don't know where he goes. He could switch to Mercedes but what are you really gaining from that? He's better waiting for Vettel, Kimi or Alonso to retire.

[Gray Fox]

He should 100% want the Mercedes drive.

They’re also falling back in the constructors race which is what the team care most for, because of Bottas.

Remember we also have a regulation change coming. Judging by how far the gap has closed this year you’d suspect that’s Mercedes having most of their eggs in the 2022 basket.

[Jimmy Floyd]

This is one of the all time worst races.

[Shindig]

Oof. I can't see Lewis winning the title. He needs mad efforts like Bahrain and converting missed opportunities like Baku just to stay in touch.

[7om]

I don't know where he goes. He could switch to Mercedes but what are you really gaining from that? He's better waiting for Vettel, Kimi or Alonso to retire.

He’s already been at Williams one season too many. There doesn’t seem to be any inclination that any of those three will retire.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I can't imagine him not being in the Mercedes next year. They need a Hamilton succession plan and it ain't VB.

[Gray Fox]

The margins this year are closer than they appear for the most part. For example, if Lewis held Max off for 1 more lap last week, he arrives here with a championship lead.

The bad news for him is he's started developing the habit of just losing out. It used to be he'd always be on top by hook or by crook. Add in that there are clearly two #2 drivers behind them that wont threaten this title race and it looks to be slipping away.

[7om]

Yeah the tide has turned. The good luck and important strategy calls all seem to be going Max’s way and there doesn’t seem to be much Lewis can do about it. It’s fascinating viewing.

[Gray Fox]

The key telling point is Lewis isn't even angry or annoyed. You can see the look of a man who knows he can do nothing about it right now.

Some rain mixed in to next weekend would be great.

[Shindig]

Meanwhile, normal (that is to say complete batshit) service is resumed in MotoGP. Quartararo wins ahead of Vinales and Mir. Marquez had a good recovery ride to finish 10th (21st on the grid). 4 wins for the Frenchman.

[Disco]

I fully expect Russell to be in a Mercedes next year, I also have a sneaking suspicion that Ocons new contract may signal how much longer Hamilton is sticking around.

[7om]

I fully expect Russell to be in a Mercedes next year, I also have a sneaking suspicion that Ocons new contract may signal how much longer Hamilton is sticking around.

Is he worthy of the second seat alongside Russell? I’m thoroughly unconvinced by Ocon.

[Disco]

He's another of Toto's boys, and if he stays clear of Alonso for the rest of this year and next then you could certainly make the case. He also had a year away and actually came back, which you wouldn't expect if he was rubbish.

[Shindig]

Alright, I'll play some F1 musical chairs here:

Kimi retires.
Bottas takes his seat.
Russell to Mercedes.
GP2 / Engine Supplier Money Child to Williams. Schumacher?

Lewis, Seb and Fernando carry on for another year. Kimi left his decision late this season which is why I'm seeing him as the first to blink.

[Disco]

In other non-F1 news the racist Kyle Larson missed out on a record equalling 4th NASCAR win in a row with a flat tyre on the last lap at Pocono this weekend. :happycry:

[Shindig]

2023. Get in there Lewis.

[Disco]

Shits on my Ocon theory, I suppose they'll need to find someone else to bring in alongside Russell. Eyes on the second Williams seat for a clue on that one I reckon.

[Shindig]

With the older guys hanging around (and being good), it really limits the drives.

[7om]

Shambolic from Ocon in Q1. Fernando is donning him.

[7om]

George :drool:

Knocks out Leclerc, Sainz, Ricciardo. Mega lap.

[Gray Fox]

Amazing session for the young English drivers.

[Shindig]

I love grids like that. Hopefully Lando can challenge for the lead and Russell can finally get a monkey off his back.

[thommo]

George through to Q3 on the mediums is a genuinely incredible achievement. Lando in P2 is great, but I imagine the race pace wont be up there with Mercedes and Red Bull.

Unfortunately, it'll probably be quite a dull race, unless we get some changeable weather.

[Shindig]

We'll get something from the grid mix-up. However long that lasts.

[thommo]

What an awful decision that is from the stewards to give Lando a penalty. No contact whatsoever, not even brushing of tyres - Perez should have backed out. Too desperate to get past early on.

[niko_cee]

All of those penalties were ridiculous. You could tell the Norris one wasn't when Christian Horner didn't think it was. Is it now official steward policy for people to be allowed to chuck it up the outside and have the racing line car cede position?

The Norris one all the more daft as Perez only got into the position he was in by exceeding track limits on one of the corners in the run up to the incident.

[Pepe]

Alright lads, get on it:

https://www.hamiltoncommission.org/the-report

[Pepe]

Support and empowerment: we call on those in leadership positions to support Black children to excel in STEM subjects, and to empower them to choose – and succeed in – fulfilling careers

Accountability and measurement: we call on those in leadership positions to step up, to acknowledge the unfairness that exists and to commit to change – the first step being to collect data to form a benchmark from which to improve.

Inspiration and engagement: we call on those in leadership positions to work harder to show Black children that STEM subjects, engineering and motorsport ARE for them, and to excite them about the opportunities that they offer.

Truly groundbreaking stuff.

[Pepe]

Students who are eligible for free school meals do worse, in general, regardless of ethnicity, in all subjects - the dominant factor here is poverty.

Yet we will ignore that entirely.

[Gray Fox]

1415676827071180807

In other news Lando Norris was held up at Wembley at the weekend. They nicked his 100k watch.

[Gray Fox]

Russell. Mercedes. ASAP.

[7om]

It’s going to happen isn’t it? It’s inevitable at this point.

[Gray Fox]

Hamilton and Russell sensational there.

Russell taking that stonking lap with the track to himself and crowd going mad may be my favourite moment of the season.

[phonics]

What time is the sprint race? I'm hype for that.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Russell is world champ material. Then again Button wasn't and he won one, so you never know, but yeah, he's brilliant.

[phonics]

It's always hard to gauge car v driver but when you're getting 8-10 and your team mate is getting 18-20 there's something happening.

[7om]

As good as George is, that’s also a reflection of Latifi’s ability as well.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Latifi is toilet but he's still beating the Haases, so I'm taking that as an indication that Russell is A list.

[Gray Fox]

The other hint was when he took over from Hamilton in Bahrain. He donned Bottas despite not having his own seat nor knowing what the buttons on the wheel do.

[Disco]

He got close enough to Bottas in Bahrain for it be a donning and he is undoubtedly going to Mercedes next year, otherwise their driver line up is going to look very odd when Hamilton goes.

[Shindig]

Not sure I'm sold on this. 17 laps is enough to recover from a fuck-up. Binning it in normal quali ruins your weekend. It doesn't have the stakes.

[Gray Fox]

Tell that to Sergio Perez.

[Disco]

It was ok but the 'battle' at the front was over after 2 laps and you could see people settling from fairly early on. It looked more than anything like a free tyre test for tomorrow.

[7om]

Not a huge fan, after this one event. It all looked a bit pedestrian because pit stops are not even a consideration.

[Disco]

Also, all the drivers and the crowd celebrated far harder yesterday than they did for today's result. Not saying this format doesn't have its place, and I would certainly like to see experimentation at other circuits, but on first viewing the normal three sessions seem better.

[Shindig]

I feel like doing it at only some events makes it feel a little unfair. You do it everywhere or not at all. In other news, I've decided I might start putting race reviews up on my youtube. I'm picking whatever race winds up in my recommendations and just seeing if it's a good race or not.

First up is 1984's Austrian Grand Prix. I'm going in with as little context as possible and I think that's the Prost/Lauda at McLaren year.

[Gray Fox]

It was nice seeing more on track action, but I don't think it offers much that the current set up doesn't.

The only real thing of interest was to see if Bottas starting on the softer tyre could do anything, but it seemed as if it was too hot for them to work.

The mediums seemed cooked after 17 laps on a low fuel car too, so if we have the same temps tomorrow, we could be looking at a 2-3 stop race.

[Disco]

I think they'll just drive slower and nurse them long enough to take the hards and go to the end, even though that almost backfired last year in similar conditions.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Sprint races work in dogshit spec categories, because everyone has the same chassis so there is a chance of meaningful action. In a proper formula like F1 they are pointless pap. It ain't broke, even if Liberty seemed convinced that it is.

[phonics]

I was confused by the sprint races. I thought the whole point of them was that the good cars start at the back?

[SincereTheRebel]

Yeah. Im all for two sprint races with the second race, in reverse order.

[Shindig]

Not when only the first 3 get points. They'd tank it in practice.

[Pepe]

Sprint races are only acceptable when racing on souped up volvos.

[Gray Fox]

First glance says Max deserved to go off there.
He was weaving all over the place to cling on.

[Disco]

Well that was pretty inevitable, Hamilton had enough of letting him go.

[Gray Fox]

Having looked at the replay, Max does leave Lewis some room but he was still moving too much for my liking.

It’s been very nice and respectful between the two so far, but we’ll see what happens now.

[Disco]

They both left enough room, racing incident all day long.

[Giggles]

Whoever is going the bbc live text has had 4 power wanks at this stage. John Lewis becoming Schumacher too, maybe it just comes with age no matter how much you’ve won. Shame for Ray Charles though.

[Shindig]

Great recovery drive. He's having to really fight for his wins these days. Nice to see the penalty didn't cost him.

[7om]

The only argument against Lewis there was he was understeering at the apex. Gutted for Leclerc though, it was a mega drive.

[Shindig]

Early thoughts on Austria '84:

That pit entry looks real dodgy. Helmut Marko skulking the grid and talking to Lauda is weird. Like, I know he had a fairly successful racing career but I can reconcile that with the Red Bull puppetmaster. The layout looks like the current one-ish on paper but it's so much longer and sweeping. And there's not much in the way of barriers. Seeing a photographer on the inside of the Bosch curve made me wince a little.

One red flag after a Dutchman went off. Didn't seem necessary and he made it back under his own power. Piquet looked to have bogged down on the restart but held the lead. Prost was right on him, in fairness. Lauda's in 4th but, given this is his Championship year, he must get back to winning ways. My German's not great but I think the video title gives it away.

[phonics]

Teds Notebook is so good. You almost dont have to watch the race.

[Shindig]

Now I've seen the incident at speed, I can understand the shit Hamilton's getting for it. Not intentional but he had space to use on the inside. I think he was expecting Max to back out and Max was expecting Lewis to go inside and give him room. Now each other know what they're dealing with.

[Gray Fox]

It's a classic case of 2 not going into 1.

The interesting thing about it, is that we've known Max to be extremely aggressive throughout his career. Lewis knows this better than anyone and has played fair game with him. I feel like the sprint yesterday has told Lewis he's going to have to up the ante if he wants to beat Max this year.

This is the first time Lewis has shown the aggression back. I also believe Max would have done exactly as Lewis did if the cars were swapped.

[phonics]

Teds notebook covered this, apparently Hamilton saw in the sprint race that they have an advantage on cool tyres so it was get in front lap 1 or lose by a mile.

[Disco]

It's the first time Hamilton hasn't backed out, he did at Imola and Spain (?) when Verstappen threw a move down the inside and forced him to move or have a crash. Today he opted for not moving, or rather staying in the corner. And on the move itself, Verstappen leaves him space on the right/down the inside (and knew he had taken it) but the inevitable consequence of doing that is that the car on your inside is going to be wider through the corner. Multiple other drivers throughout the day opted to go slightly wider, Verstappen did not and he found a car slightly off the apex when he turned into his normal line. I think if the positions were reversed Hamilton runs it wide and maybe loses the spot but isn't in the barrier (or hospital). Verstappen is completely ruthless and it's great to watch but every now and again he runs across someone who calls his bluff.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I've had a look, I'm going racing incident. If either of them wants to pull out of that they can and there's no crash, but neither of them did, ergo crash.

[Gray Fox]

He also pulled the same move on both Norris and LeClerc and neither ended up in a hospital.

[Jimmy Floyd]

"Very disappointed to be taken out like this," Verstappen said.

"Watching the celebrations while still in hospital is disrespectful and unsportsmanlike... but we move on."

I've always found Max alright, even quite liked him at times, but I'm prepared to get the Come On Tim Union Jack bunting out for my guy Lewis if Gouda Gary is going to start rolling out this sort of nonsense.

[7om]

Max is going to be a bull in a china shop in Hungary. He’ll dive bomb Hamilton at the first opportunity.

[niko_cee]

You'll mean he'll drive like he always has then?

Fucking lol at Horner and co crying about that crash. I know myopia is a given in such matters but do they just expect everyone to dive out of Verstappen's way as he bowls around with his high-risk hyper-aggressive driving style? Hamilton also overcoming the penalty to win in the last few laps only added to the amusement. Thought it was funny how Martin Brundle (was it?) kept going on about Hamilton having been given the second most lenient penalty. Assuming we're not saying that's black flag territory ( Dr Marko :harold:), isn't it also the second most severe (ie the middle) penalty? 5s, 10s, stop-go?

Demolition derby for the rest of the season.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Horner has always been the whiniest prick on the grid, it's definitely not going to change after his boy has a trip to Northampton General.

[Shindig]

It is quite astonishing that with a pace, tyre and points advantage, Max decided to do all that on lap one. He wins that race the first DRS zone he comes to. He wins every race from there. It's his championship and if he bins it, it's on him.

[7om]

This jus popped up on my YouTube recommended:

https://youtu.be/QtDPQQQWP_M

[thommo]

I saw this the other day - really shows how fast an impact that was. The way the broadcast cameras work, you never really get a full sense of the speed of the cars now, constant zooming in and out to keep it fully in shot (and no doubt please the sponsors) dampens the feel of speed.

Have you heard Max's radio after the shunt? Proper grape lady vibes.

[Disco]

That's a factor of the aerodynamics as well, I'm sad enough to sometimes watch old 90's stuff and the cars look faster because they're less planted despite being multiple seconds a lap slower.

[Disco]

Part of the evidence Red Bull presented in their appeal of Hamiltons' penalty was 'a reconstruction by Alex Albon' :happycry:

[Jimmy Floyd]

I did lol at that. A true expert in naive collisions with Hamilton.

[Giggles]

It was definitely a home town shout though.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He got a 10 second penalty. I'm not sure what else they were meant to do.

[Giggles]

I’m sure you were all calling for 10 second penalties when Schumacher was at it over the years.

[Shindig]

I can't call to mind that many Schumacher collisions that were punishable. 1994 was kind of debatable. His car was borked, he couldn't exactly test out his handling when Damon was immediately on him. 1997, he was disqualified for an intentional act. Monaco, punished again. Did he get punished for running Barrichello close to the wall?

It's worth noting more penalties are given out now to more people. 11 drivers ended last season with penalty points. Albon topped that. :D

The current list:

Lando: 8
Russel: 6
Vettel: 6
Kimi: 6
Giovanazzi: 5
Latifi: 6
Mazepin: 5
Tsunoda: 4
Stroll: 4
LeClerc: 2
Hamilton: 2
Bottas: 2
Ocon: 1
Ricciardo: 1
Sainz: 1
Gasly: 1

Only Verstappen, Schumacher and Alonso have none. We're not even half way through the season.

[Disco]

Anyone else already bored of how certain things are now always talked about in the context of the cost cap? Every crash, new engine, or large cup of coffee is apparently spelling financial doom for the team involved. The reality is the cap is so high that it barely affects the highest spending teams let alone any of the midfielders, rather than call out their bullshit all they're doing is adding to the propaganda coming from the teams as they try and get the early arguments in for when the cap is inevitably lowered. Even then things like replacement parts or crash damage is already figured into the budget, they don't run out the back and knock up a new wing every time Tsunoda bins it in practice these things are already manufactured. In fact the amount of stuff they simply throw away is staggering and must dwarf the cost of anything damaged in crashes.

[Gray Fox]

But that crash cost Red Bull $1.8m!

[Disco]

Is that what they reckoned? :D

Given that you can buy a rolling chassis for about £300k that seems unlikely unless their new suspension is made of faberge eggs or something.

[Gray Fox]

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.red-bull-estimate-damage-to-verstappens-car-from-hamilton-collision-will.4KgQmjryYnBWvTbLQu5IYc.html

That's coming from Horner though, so make of that what you will.

Sounds like the engine wasn't saved either, which was not long put in, so you've likely got Max having to take a penalty come Monza time to get a fresh one in.

[Shindig]

Yeah, it's a bit bollocks. I could see that if the gearbox and engine were written off but that engine's in the car this weekend. With the threats of Red Bull bringing their own lawyers to the table, you could see them getting fined for bringing the sport into disrepute.

Bernie would've laughed them out the building.

[Gray Fox]

Oh so they did save it. Further SEETHE if that craps out at some point during the weekend then.

[Disco]

In FP1 they said it went back to Japan to be checked and is ok, didn't have to break the seal on it so no penalty. Which you have to believe is true (and rather impressive) because they'd be milking it to death otherwise.

[Disco]

Yeah, it's a bit bollocks. I could see that if the gearbox and engine were written off but that engine's in the car this weekend. With the threats of Red Bull bringing their own lawyers to the table, you could see them getting fined for bringing the sport into disrepute.

Bernie would've laughed them out the building.

The stewards basically did just that, they said the content of the appeal failed to meet the criteria to even be heard.

[Shindig]

They have the most impressive mechanics on the grid. When was it Max binned it on an installation lap and had it sorted for the formation?

[Disco]

Hungary last year, essentially replacing the front corner in (about) twenty minutes.

[Gray Fox]

Some of this disparity between teammates is confusing.

I get that Perez is not as fast as Max, but by 1 second?

It's not like Yuki and Gasly where you have an inexperienced driver against one with a few years behind them.

[Disco]

It's almost as if they've spent the last few years binning off perfectly good drivers.

[Gray Fox]

That is some incredible shithousery from Lewis.

[Shindig]

Mind. Games. :D

[niko_cee]

World class trolling by Hamilton there.

The wanker Max Fan Brigade making it all the more amusing.

[Gray Fox]

I didn't expect them to work that quickly.

https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/31381/12369295/max-verstappen-angry-about-ridiculous-continued-questioning-about-lewis-hamilton-collision

[Jimmy Floyd]

Hamilton is in so many heads, it really is marvellous to behold at times.

[Disco]

If Verstappen is the only one on softs then he sort of needs to be ahead at the start to make it work does he not? First lap could be fun.

[Gray Fox]

The Mercedes were the only ones fast enough to make it to Q3 on the mediums, so the entire top 10 will be on softs otherwise.

The softs were burning up today very quickly and it's supposed to be a fair bit hotter tomorrow too. Lewis could use Valtteri being up for a fight. If they can hold Max off for a lap or two they should dirty air their way to a 1-2.

[Jimmy Floyd]

You can't really pass anywhere there and DRS is useless, so I can see Max trying a mad dive into 1 or possibly 4 if he's close enough. If he doesn't at least get ahead of Rear Gunner Valtteri he'll probably find it difficult. I'm not sure if the undercut is particularly effective there either.

[Shindig]

Zandvoort looks similar. Whoever gets pole will take that.

[Disco]

Hamilton is in so many heads, it really is marvellous to behold at times.

His second outlap in Q3 was within a couple of seconds of all the other ones yet because this one was shown on telly it was 'gamesmanship'. If he wins the title we're going to need a bigger smiley :happycry:

[Shindig]

Rain in 11 minutes.

[Giggles]

His second outlap in Q3 was within a couple of seconds of all the other ones yet because this one was shown on telly it was 'gamesmanship'. If he wins the title we're going to need a bigger smiley :happycry:

Does anyone actually believe he won’t?

[Gray Fox]

More rain please!

[Disco]

Fucking lol.

[Giggles]

:D he couldn’t have dreamt it better.

[niko_cee]

2 Bulls with one stone for rear gunner Bottas.

:lol:

[Disco]

Bottas making a strong case for being kept on next year.

[Shindig]

Wow. Heads have gone. :D

[niko_cee]

Now Red Bull trying to red flag it.

Successfully.

[Gray Fox]

#announceBottas

[Shindig]

Get ready for the next episode of the Russell Curse.

[Disco]

Red flags for fun these days, does no-one have a broom anymore?

[Shindig]

One of my favourite parts of the 1984 Austrian GP was seeing marshals sweeping the inside of the chicane as cars were coming towards them. Halcyon days.

[Gray Fox]

I’ve no idea how that Red Bull didn’t stop running.

[7om]

The stoppages are absurd here. It’s going to end up being a 30 minute break just to sweep up some debris.

[Giggles]

Norris is doing some fair victiming for a lad that was throwing himself around the pit lane.

[Shindig]

I repeat: Heads have gone.

[Disco]

I foresee a rule change because that looked ridiculous.

[Shindig]

The curse! :D

[Gray Fox]

How bad is that fuck up from Mercedes

[Giggles]

It won’t make any difference in the end as Hamilton still win with the damage on the Red Bull, but that was a very strange decision from Merc.

[Shindig]

14 runners left.

"Prioritise Nicky" - FUCK!

[Disco]

I can't see him driving through the whole field, it's too hard to pass here.

[Shindig]

He needs clean air. I'm not sure stretching his tyres would get him much. Actually, that's possibly the play unless Ocon and Vettel are too far ahead.

EDIT: Ocon nearly DQing himself after the finish. If he crossed the finish line a second time, he would've been punished.

[Disco]

Great for Ocon, always nice to see a first win.

[Disco]

Is this another instance of Hamilton not knowing the rules? He seemed to be suggesting he stayed out for the second start because he wasn't called in, which of course the team aren't allowed to do, it's the drivers' decision.

[Giggles]

He owes that to Alonso.

[niko_cee]

That race was comedy gold from start (restart) to finish. Hamilton lining up as the only car on the grid was hilarious. Good of Mercedes to save us from the formulaic procession it should have been.

Ocon should be thanking Alonso for that win. Awesome defending, although I have no idea how that squares with the modern obsession with 'leaving a car's width' and all that crap.

[thommo]

Alonso was so impressive. I don't really think he did anything over the line in his defence really, just supreme skill in defensive driving.

If Hamilton came in with everyone else, he wins that race by about 2 laps. Massive balls up on his part, surely he knows after 15 seasons that he gets no radio from the engineer on the way to the grid.

Williams scoring double points is huge for them too.

[Shindig]

I don't know what else Mercedes could've done. They thought it wasn't dry enough and, once the guys behind peel in, they can't do anything else. If they pit when everyone else does, they're waiting for the field to stream past so they don't get an unsafe release.

[thommo]

Hamilton said on the radio it was definitely time for dry tyres. The rest of the field kept their positions in the pit lane (apart from George Russell's cheeky attempt down the side) so he could have done the same if he put his foot down in the pit lane entry.

[niko_cee]

The thing I didn't understand was that with the track being bone dry, which seemed pretty clear, why did they all start on inters in the first place? Did they have to?

[thommo]

They could have changed in the pit lane but had no information on the track until the formation lap. Even Rosberg on comms was surprised as they drove round at how dry it had got.

[Giggles]

Herbert is a fucking mong.

[Disco]

Herbert is a fucking mong.

He really is a terrible presenter, barely ever makes sense.

[niko_cee]

They could have changed in the pit lane but had no information on the track until the formation lap. Even Rosberg on comms was surprised as they drove round at how dry it had got.

How is that the case though? Do they have no one outside of the pit lane? It wasn't as if there was a dry line, the track was completely dry. Surely a cursory man in the stands could have told them that (seeing as they have Deep Blue levels of analysis for incoming weather and race simulation). Just seemed odd.