View Full Version : The Ultimate WWE Thread
Waffdon
09-10-2022, 08:51 AM
Rhea Ripley is really good at her job.
Hopefully Rollins is done with Matt Riddle and moves onto someone more talented.
Bit harsh on Riddle, he's very good.
As is Ripley and really needs to be given some womens feuds to get back into rather than just clearing up Team Purple's mess for them.
Shindig
09-10-2022, 09:24 AM
The new mask looks a little ECW on SciFi.
Waffdon
09-10-2022, 09:28 AM
Bit harsh on Riddle, he's very good.
As is Ripley and really needs to be given some womens feuds to get back into rather than just clearing up Team Purple's mess for them.
I just can’t take him seriously albeit I barely watch anything at all and just want to see Main Event (champ) Rollins back.
I'm hoping under HHH they'll veer him more towards the NXT idea of him which they've sort of started to because Vince giving him the gimmick of flip flops, weed and 90s movie references wasn't ideal.
Gray Fox
09-10-2022, 12:02 PM
+1 for not being able to stand Stoner Bro. And put some fucking boots on or something.
Brutes v Imperium - Walter and Sheamus battering the shit out of each other hasn't gotten old yet and some good old 50/50 booking means we get to do it again likely. Good opener.
Rousey v Morgan - Felt like a bit of a botched finish. There was also a spot in the match where a propped up chair on the turnbuckle was supposed to be there for Ronda getting springboarded into it. The chair fell off just before the spot and it seemed like neither knew how to fix the situation for about 20 secs before deciding to do it but just into the ring post instead. Another spot on the outside where Ronda was supposed to flip Morgan but dropped her on her head/neck. I don't feel like the two work well together. Smiling as you're supposed to be passed out was also odd.
Drew v Randomer - No idea who this guy or his annoying companion is, but a predictable type of ending. Seems a big drop off to go from nearly toppling Reigns to the mid card almost immediately for Drew. That they spent some of the commentary time telling us how Drew had just been unlucky lately, losing out from a lot of interference, to not see it coming again makes him look thick.
Bayley v Not-another-Sasha-Banks-type - Probably should have main evented. Was good fun, even though as Ian said they did seem to forget what spot was up next at times. The lady who needs a haircut was booked strong and fought off the interference well, even if a little unbelievable. The finisher onto the ladder to put Bayley down looked great even if it was odd the was still holding it.
Edge v Balor - Way, way, way too long. I was sure the finish would be that, but with Rey Mysterio being the one getting twatted with a chair at the end. Could have easily cut 10 mins off this.
Ripley also now finds herself in a tough spot(almost like Chyna was). She looks more than competent mixing it up in the mens division and such there doesn't seem to be much on for her on the womens side of it.
The finish suggests there's yet more to come from this one. Yay...
FREAKIN Rollins v Stoner Bro - As before. Felt like they had to cut time on it due to probably Edge overrunning, or one of the 50 video packages. Also made very little use of the fact it was supposed to be an MMA style bout. It just felt like a cage match with added platforms.
DC also being there(and in not his best shape) was completely pointless. At one point Rollins audibly suggested he'd go choke DC out. That should have seen DC do something other than stand there shouting get down like an annoyed parent.
Spooky Bray stuff - Crowd went nuts for it. I feel he does the character side of the stuff well, but then it gets to the point where it's just Bray Wyatt at the end, so Vince then pulls the plug in favour of his guy. We'll see what Trips does for him. Hopefully no comedy mallet in sight.
wullie
09-10-2022, 01:29 PM
Bray Wyatt should be alright if they stay away from the supernatural nonsense, having him burnt alive but then losing a wrestling match leaves you nowhere to go like with the Undertaker who got better when he became an MMA grandad with spooky lights rather than being an actual zombie.
Shindig
09-10-2022, 02:00 PM
He took being set on fire surprisingly well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4baAzkepvo
"OH MY GOD, SAY IT, SAY IT, SAY IT!" Sit the fuck down, you mark. :D
It went on too long and Bray's brand of spooky shit is more like if you pushed Papa Shango.
Gray Fox
11-10-2022, 07:29 AM
Lesnar :cool:
wullie
11-10-2022, 07:49 AM
Gallows and Anderson got a decent reception when you consider how awful they were/were made to look last time around.
Lesnar :cool:
Proper eyeroll when I saw him in the thumbnail for the review there. Poor Bobbo.
Gotta get that win back, brother. At least they'll do it in Saudi.
"So seeing as Lesnar is getting the win his will also be through a screwy finish right?"
"Hahaha good one Bobby."
Forgot all about Crown Jewel. Fucking Logan Paul.
Sir Andy Mahowry
11-10-2022, 04:00 PM
1579587473696763904
Book him against Roman.
Disco
11-10-2022, 04:22 PM
Didn't even hook the leg, very disrespectful.
Shindig
11-10-2022, 05:13 PM
I bet that dog passed the medical Saraya was supposed to have.
Sir Andy Mahowry
14-10-2022, 12:28 PM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-63227696
The "one wish" of a 97-year-old woman came true when she got to go to a live wrestling match.
In her earlier years, Jane Prosser used to go to the matches with her late husband, Jack, on special occasions.
Now in an effort to widen well-being activities for its residents, the team at Katherine House, in Bristol, took Ms Prosser to re-live her glory days.
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/54A2/production/_127066612_img-20221002-wa0007.jpg.webp
:cool:
Love that she went for it with the lucha mask and everything. Legend.
https://whatculture.com/wwe/aew-reportedly-worried-this-injured-star-will-never-return
Perfect time to transition him into a manager role, I'd say.
phonics
14-10-2022, 04:41 PM
Think he’d need a name change too.
Shindig
14-10-2022, 05:52 PM
He can handle Tony's drugs. Bagman Adam Page.
Disco
14-10-2022, 08:06 PM
Roidy magoo Katsuya Kitamura dead at 36.
https://i.imgur.com/wXT68iE.png
Shindig
14-10-2022, 08:20 PM
Yeah, that heart's not surviving a surprise party.
Gray Fox
15-10-2022, 01:48 AM
So they didn't even bother getting Rey to put Dominic over, he just goes to Trips, tells him he wants to quit now. Instead he gets transferred to Smackdown and given an Intercontinental title shot? Okay.
phonics
15-10-2022, 02:12 AM
Man I love Brays speech on smackdown so much more than the bs intro on extreme rules. He’s just a guy and he was hurt.
I thought they did the Extreme Rules bit really well but possibly because I was interpreting (perhaps optimistically) it as a sort of swansong for the bits of his career they were showing before he came out but the Smackdown promo was really good. I'm curious as to how the new gimmick will be done given how the promo ended.
So they didn't even bother getting Rey to put Dominic over, he just goes to Trips, tells him he wants to quit now. Instead he gets transferred to Smackdown and given an Intercontinental title shot? Okay.
That'll come in time you'd think. I think it makes sense to keep them apart for a bit. Probably have some crossover at the Rumble then either a match at Mania or when Rhea gets bored of cockteasing him and batters him have Rey and Dom tag vs. Judgement day or something.
They important thing is that I am right into Walter vs. Rey, a hundred times more than I'm interested in anything Dom has ever or will ever do.
So they didn't even bother getting Rey to put Dominic over, he just goes to Trips, tells him he wants to quit now. Instead he gets transferred to Smackdown and given an Intercontinental title shot? Okay.
On the surface it seems like the only way to stretch it out until WrestleMania.
wullie
15-10-2022, 01:57 PM
With the brand split being less than strict I'd imagine the moody gang will come find him and provoke him into the eventual match.
Yeah the idea of Bray (or Rey for that matter) being assigned to a brand is a bit lol given the Bloodline, Rollins and whoever the fuck else have been popping back and forth as they please for ages.
Sir Andy Mahowry
15-10-2022, 05:33 PM
They have SPECIAL DISPENSATION which is only given to 3 or maybe 4 or possibly 5 but surely not more than 10 wrestlers.
The system works.
Roidy magoo Katsuya Kitamura dead at 36.
His story is so bizarre. I was enjoying his run as a young lion a few years back and he literally disappears over night. Rumours he had a moped accident, failed a drugs test etc. Then didn’t he go into kickboxing or something?
There’s a fascinating story in there somewhere. Tragic though. 36, fucking hell.
Japan is so secretive in general so after he left it's all rumours as to why. He got schooled by some 56 year old in MMA last year though.
Disco
15-10-2022, 08:55 PM
I thought it was concussions that ended his NJ run but it seems a moped accident as well followed by a go at MMA and then fitness videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeYxs1JSd7c&t=331s
Sir Andy Mahowry
15-10-2022, 11:48 PM
Finally got round to watching Extreme Rules.
Brutes/Imperium was easily the best thing on the card, they wanted to beat the piss out of one another and they accomplished that goal incredibly well.
Rousey/Liv was crap, it was dull had a shit finish and they clearly don't gel well together, please don't give us another match.
Kross/Drew was a typical Kross match. Incredibly boring. His presentation is absolutely amazing but when it comes to his in-ring work I'm just so bored.
Bianca/Bayley was decent and it was always going to be. Didn't work too well as a ladder match though.
Balor/Edge, zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. That felt like it lasted a week.
Riddle/Rollins it was ok but I hated the new fight pit layout and I don't think they really went hard enough for what should be more like a real fight. Seeing fatty DC was nice though.
The Bray return was done well but his new mask is even worse than his old one and I still don't get why so many people are frothing about him.
Overall it was decent viewing but the worst Triple H PPV thus far.
Watched the main event from last night's NXT. Not bad. I was hopefully they'd have binned the dayglo lighting but apparently not. And I remain unconvinced about Breakkkkkker.
This is a fun spot I saw skipping through the rest of the show, though:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jp1NQWE2uQk
Maybe less fun if you're Wes Lee.
Sir Andy Mahowry
25-10-2022, 12:53 AM
1584703658628898816
Damn.
WWE’s camerawork continues to baffle me, there.
Rhea Ripley is one of the few good things on that show. Absolute star.
Bit harsh on current Raw, that
But agreed on Ripley, who I'm just glad to see having a good time again after Vince tried his best to ruin her. She's great and should be in the women's title picture. Have her take it off Belair at least Judgement Day would have a title then too.
Obviously three hours is hard to book but they don't do themselves any favours. They go to commercial 30 seconds into every match so straight away they're telling the viewer that entrances and backstage comedy skits with Johnny "no personality" Gargano are important, but the wrestling match on the wrestling show is when you should go put the kettle on. It completely takes you out of it.
Also it'd be great if they didn't job Gable out every week and took that stupid gimmick off him. It's time for him to go away for a bit. We're at the point where it does nothing for either guy in the match because we know the outcome so whoever beats him doesn't gain any momentum from it. But it's nice to see Theory won again; jobbing out the briefcase guy is such lazy booking and they were in danger of squandering him.
The Gable thing I come.and go on but I'll allow time for now to see if HHHs NXT booking habits end up translating to the main roster where until you were in a specific story you may well lose as often as you win. Happened with plenty of good NXT guys early does, Lee being the one who comes to mind. If Gable's still losing every week in 6-12 months with no sign of progressing onto other things fine but I'm prepared to be patient for now and see what main roster booking looks like for guys like him.
And there is a problem for them currently where they don't have many bad wrestlers (hello, Omos) and you can't rehabilitate everybody at the same time so somebody's got to take the losses. I wish it wasn't Gable because he's great but I'll tefer back to my previous point for now.
As for all the stuff about the structure of Raw as a TV programme you're absolutely right on all of.it, but I can't get exercised about it because I don't watch it as a TV programme. I don't sit down to consume.it that way. I skip yonthe matches and segments I want and because I'm already skipping on the (terrible) flow of the thing doesn't impact me. I saw Raw live about five years ago though and it's even worse as a live experience.
My opinion re: Gable, and I might be in the minority, is that if the guy has a big upside but you currently don't have anything for him, then take him off TV completely or at the very least keep him out of matches. How can you miss him if he never goes away? And it's not like they're running some obscure territory so are low on workers. Every time he's lost the purpose has been to get the other guy over (Gargano, Strowman, now Elias). Surely there is someone else in the 250 contracted guys who you can cycle in for a few weeks to do that job and not kill off something you might have with Gable down the line. Wrestling fans love a return. Make him disappear for 3-6 months then bring him back in a solid spot and you've automatically got momentum going forward.
Also, you mention Omos but it seems Triple H at least understands how to get a big guy over. Don't expose them in a 8-10 minute match but just have them squash geeks for weeks on end. They did the same with Strowman on Smackdown last week too. So when the PPV comes around and someone gives them a competitive match, both the winner and loser gain from it. If it worked for Andre, it'll work for these lumps. Well, Strowman at least. Omos is useless.
Yeah I was gonna say the difference is against the right opponent Strowman can do something entertaining. Omos' upside genuinely ends at his height.
He should be muscle, not a wrestler. At least him and Braun is on a show I won't watch.
Sir Andy Mahowry
25-10-2022, 06:10 PM
1584952941630443520
Ian.
Strong lineup.
Oh yeah, that's decent. I probably won't see it until next week.
Tony Khan is pathetic. He's trying to build Ring of Honor and keep a solid relationship with New Japan so he jobs out FTR (tag champions of both companies) in a #1 contender match for the AEW titles. Does anyone want to see Swerve in Our Glory (what a shit name) vs. The Acclaimed again? I'd probably watch the PPV if it was FTR in there instead.
Also what is the deal with throwaway World title matches on TV? Everyone knows it's Moxley vs. MJF at the PPV so why bother? It's not like they've had Penta do anything in AEW anyway.
It’s properly gone to shit. MJF is the only good bit (And Max Casters raps.)
Bring back the Bucks.
Your first line is absolutely correct.
The second one can get to fuck. And it seems they've turned heel in the Punk saga because they booted the door in right into the Punk's dog's face and took out two teeth. And dogs are always the babyface.
wullie
27-10-2022, 09:35 AM
I don't like when they just mash names together to make a tag team name, Warjoe is another shit one. WWE loves a bit of that, although Showmiz was close to an exception as it's a decent pun.
It's just lazy. They need to speak to the Japanese about tag team names: Holy Demon Army, Strong BJ, Dangerous Tekkers. :cool:
randomlegend
27-10-2022, 12:42 PM
I would like to add my :D to Ian's
phonics
27-10-2022, 05:47 PM
The overarching story of AEW might be a bit meh atm but the wrestling is A++
Riho vs Hayter was an absolute banger. Bryan v Sammy was good. There's always at least 2-3 good matches per Dynamite so it's still worth it. I guess if you just view Wrestling as Eastenders with some chops then maybe it could be an issue.
Shindig
27-10-2022, 05:49 PM
And it seems they've turned heel in the Punk saga because they booted the door in right into the Punk's dog's face and took out two teeth. And dogs are always the babyface.
:uhoh:
phonics
27-10-2022, 05:53 PM
It's also definitely not true.
Disco
27-10-2022, 06:36 PM
Amazing what utter bollocks people are willing to believe just to paint people they don't like.
wullie
27-10-2022, 07:07 PM
I just want to know if they slapped their legs when kicking the door.
Sir Andy Mahowry
27-10-2022, 07:11 PM
The Bucks are pros, ofc they did.
I just want to know if they slapped their legs when kicking the door.
:D
Disco
27-10-2022, 07:35 PM
Just got around to Royal Quest and Aussie Open / FTR is amongst the best tag matches of the year, which is a strong group.
Yep. The camera work wasn’t great but it was tremendous otherwise. The crowd were so hot that last ten minutes.
Gray Fox
29-10-2022, 12:38 AM
Very much enjoying the Bloodline trying desperately to stay in character when Sami Uso has the mic in his hand.
Shindig
29-10-2022, 07:11 AM
Didn't take long for Bray's return to jump the shark. Uncle Howdy? Fucking Wurzel.
Is he feuding with himself?
Very much enjoying the Bloodline trying desperately to stay in character when Sami Uso has the mic in his hand.
Just seen that. :D
Sir Andy Mahowry
01-11-2022, 12:47 AM
Swerve v Lil Bow Wow is seemingly in the works :lol:
Very much enjoying the Bloodline trying desperately to stay in character when Sami Uso has the mic in his hand.
Yeah that segment on Smackdown was great. Credit to Reigns for working his amusement into his bit too, while Jey kept thinking he'd got a hold of himself but had not. :D
It's also a good sign that the Bloodline stuff is back on track and good again (in no small part due to Sami) as evidenced by that proper crowd reaction when Jey said he doesn't care what Reigns thinks.
It seems AEW Rampage was a little wild last night. Shibata had a match and Mike Tyson commentated on it. :cab:
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 03:30 PM
I'll be watching SAUDI BLOOD MONEY just because I like watching PPV's live at sensible hours.
What I don't get in the build up to Logan Paul v Reigns is the whole ONE LUCKY PUNCH thing they're going with for Logan Paul. A man who failed to beat a fellow Youtuber twice in a boxing match (one amateur one pro) and was carried to a draw by Floyd. He's never, at least professionally, knocked anyone out so to say he has one punch knockout power is a bit strange.
They’re hoping the Saudis don’t know the difference between him and his brother.
Disco
05-11-2022, 03:48 PM
It's wrestling, it doesn't have to make sense.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 04:04 PM
It wont happen but Roman should squash him, no Bloodline interference and have him win by KO via Superman punch. They can then claim that Roman has more knockout power than Floyd.
Disco
05-11-2022, 04:10 PM
Live WWE though, almost unbearable to watch already.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 04:19 PM
What a bullshit finish.
Watching a WWE show live. :D You can't have that little else to do.
I just watched Gunther (ugh) / Rey from Smackdown and it was, entirely predictably, very good. Would love to see them get a chance at making a proper PPV epic. I like that Gunther has a bunch of different ways to finish matches rather than one finisher and while it didn't look as impactful as they'd have hoped for I loved the idea of him yanking Rey off the ground by the arm just so he could clothesline him back down for the win. The corner powerbomb / rana spot was great too.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 04:21 PM
Bobby with a heel turn :(
Gray Fox
05-11-2022, 04:38 PM
It wont happen but Roman should squash him, no Bloodline interference and have him win by KO via Superman punch. They can then claim that Roman has more knockout power than Floyd.
But did you know he has metal in his hand?
Disco
05-11-2022, 04:40 PM
Didn't take long for Bray's return to jump the shark. Uncle Howdy? Fucking Wurzel.
It looks like something from Bo Selecta.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 04:44 PM
Shitty finish number 2.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 04:58 PM
Scarlett's outfit, phwoar.
Gray Fox
05-11-2022, 05:02 PM
I've never understood her or Kross either. He is duller than Orton in the ring and she seems to not know the lyrics to the theme despite having sung it herself. Either that or she's the worst lip syncer there is.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 05:04 PM
Kross is horrendous, he looks the part and has a good aura about him but fuck me is he boring.
When he signed for NXT and they pushed him to the moon it was awful.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 05:13 PM
And that was such a dumb match.
Disco
05-11-2022, 05:54 PM
Is there anyone with worse taste in trousers than Boatman? He had the ones that made it look like he'd pissed himself and now these silly red santa trousers.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 06:58 PM
I've actually liked when Bray has been REAL TALKing in these promos but then "Uncle Howdy" comes along and I lose all interest.
Disco
05-11-2022, 07:27 PM
Every time I see him this youtube lad is surprisingly good, he's not just being carried either because I saw him be good against The Miz as well.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-11-2022, 07:36 PM
Annoyingly (because he's a massive cunt) he's really good.
He is brilliant in the air.
Logan Paul is, annoyingly, a decent pro wrestler but they never, ever should try to position him as the de facto babyface again because he's just not remotely likeable.
Shindig
05-11-2022, 08:12 PM
He doesn't really have a character. Even David Arquette got that part of the business.
Bray Wyatt the person is terrific on the mic. He makes you listen. But I’m fucked if I know what he’s going on about.
wullie
05-11-2022, 09:08 PM
Uncle Howdy is like something from Kevin Sullivan's Dungeon of Doom so I almost like it, as long as it just ends up being someone in costume battering him rather than a cinematic psyche match where Bray plays all five roles or whatever.
Logan Paul has a better look and better promos than most of the actual wrestlers these days and it seems he can work a better match than a lot of them. Is he great or is wrestling shit now?
Gray Fox
06-11-2022, 01:24 AM
Well since about 2010, Vince has tried his best to turn everyone he can into one certain style. Problem is then you end up with Generic Wrestler #42 v Generic Wrestler #17 all of the time.
There have been a few exceptions, but the guys who don't conform well(PAC, Rick O'Shea etc) to this change just get punted down or off the card. Triple H's NXT was the opposite if I remember correctly. Pretty much nothing special character wise, but the in-ring stuff was excellent.
It'll take time to get Vinces grubby little mits off everything.
Sir Andy Mahowry
06-11-2022, 02:31 AM
1589050293119221760
Pretty crazy he worked half the match with one knee.
Do WWE women generally wear boiler suits or was it cos Saudi Arabians don't let women show flesh?
Saudi I think. I was most upset Scarlett Bordeaux had too much skin covered. She’s outstanding to look at usually and actually overshadows Kross so he’s fucked if they ever divorce.
Sir Andy Mahowry
06-11-2022, 12:13 PM
Do WWE women generally wear boiler suits or was it cos Saudi Arabians don't let women show flesh?
Saudi, even the refs had to wear an undershirt.
How are you guys watching Raw and Smackdown? I don’t have BT Sport so is there a decent highlights package that gets put out anywhere?
Waffdon
07-11-2022, 01:31 AM
Just watch it on YouTube if you want highlights
If you're not averse to alternative streaming methods then just Google "watchwrestling", it's got all the known promotions.
wullie
07-11-2022, 09:40 AM
They show highlights on one of Channel 5's freeview channels as well so it's on the My5 thing too.
igor_balis
07-11-2022, 06:16 PM
Just don't watch it you mad bastard
Read the reviews then use watchwrestling to skip through for the good segment and 2-3 good matches (depending how good a week it is) is the correct approach.
Theory failing to cash in on the US title. :D oh dear. He was clearly not ready for a world title but when I was reading the results and saw he was cashing on on Seth I didn't don't expect him to still lose.
Also pleased to see Mia Yim back. No idea what she's got to do with the OC but anybody surviving Retribution is a good thing and I liked Yim in NXT.
I know people like to paint Triple H as the saviour and that he can't do anything wrong but fucking hell, that's ridiculous. Austin Theory is a great prospect (even though he's not ready for where Vince was pushing him) and burying him like that is just Triple H screaming "this was Vince's guy and it's my era now and you will know it" type shit.
They need to fuck off that briefcase for good though, so hopefully this is the beginning of that.
wullie
08-11-2022, 08:49 AM
With HHH bringing everyone back, I'm going to be very disappointed if Captain Howdy isn't James Ellsworth now.
Waffdon
08-11-2022, 08:51 AM
Even watching 3 minutes highlights is impossible with that utterly dreadful commentator they’ve brought in. How the fuck did he qualify for a position
I know people like to paint Triple H as the saviour and that he can't do anything wrong but fucking hell, that's ridiculous. Austin Theory is a great prospect (even though he's not ready for where Vince was pushing him) and burying him like that is just Triple H screaming "this was Vince's guy and it's my era now and you will know it" type shit.
They need to fuck off that briefcase for good though, so hopefully this is the beginning of that.
Yeah, I think Theory will (and absolutely should) still do well because i think HHH likes him from NXT but this is not the right way to deal with this particular turd leftover from Vince.
If they're turning Rollins face (dunno if they are but it reads that way?) you could have had basically exactly the same Bobbles / Seth / Theory stuff from yesterday but rejig it a bit so that Rollins gets the brunt of Langley's ire and Theory takes the belt.
Rollins as US champ can't be the LONG term plan anyway, you'd think.
I accept I'm a fossil when it comes to views on wrestling but my view is that the US title should be held by a guy who can wrestle good lengthy matches on TV often (like the old TV title basically but not every week). Rollins is not that guy anymore. I used to be really into him as a heel back in the days he cashed in but honestly that knee injury years ago ruined him and he's never developed the psychology to really compensate for it at main event level. He's still got a place in the upper midcard but he's not the US title guy now. They use Gunther in the same role on the other show with the IC title but fuck knows who's the guy on Raw. Triple H will probably put it on Johnny "same face for every mood" Gargano.
Waffdon
08-11-2022, 10:34 AM
Rollins is definitely good enough to be anywhere on the card.
That's fine, he's just not for me anymore. I feel like he tries to wrestle the same matches he used to 6-7 years ago and his body won't let him so it's just a slower version. He's never really transformed himself as he's aged (like Shawn Michaels did in the late 00's vs. his out of this world mid 90's run).
I also don't like a fuck load of other popular guys so I'll leave it there. :D
wullie
08-11-2022, 10:38 AM
Can't believe they chucked the 24/7 title in the bin, Eric Bischoff you've done it again
It's alright, Jim Duggan will find it in a couple of months.
wullie
08-11-2022, 10:55 AM
If they don't do that now at the next legends special show HHH is dead to me.
Watching the Usos / New Day segment and Kofi's just referred to "being saddled with the gimmick of" being the power of positivity guys. Good segment though, and I liked that they referred to their respective histories and feuds, like the gauntlet match where the Usos forfeited their spot. A pity Riddle's involvement was just having the personality of weed jokes though. After a bit of progress during the Rollins feud it's just straight back to how he was being written when he was first called up I guess.
And that whole Theory thing isn't any better watching than it reads.
Just seen AEW announced they're coming to the UK next year Baz
I might actually watch Full Gear, there's a couple of matches that are intriguing:
Saraya vs. Dr. Britt Baker DMD - could be alright but will be scared the whole match that Saraya might die. How do WWE not clear her for five years but suddenly AEW think she's good to go?
Jay Lethal & Jeff Jarrett vs. Darby Allin & Sting - Jeff Jarrett wrestling in prime time in 2022, what the fuck?
The Acclaimed (Anthony Bowens & Max Caster) (c) vs. Swerve In Our Glory (Keith Lee & Swerve Strickland) - they're 1-1 so it makes sense to have the decider but I'm not interested in the slightest in SIOG. Working with Keith Lee is like working with a mattress.
Toni Storm (c) vs. Jamie Hayter - this should be very good. Hayter is brilliant.
Chris Jericho (c) vs. Bryan Danielson vs. Claudio Castagnoli vs. Sammy Guevara - not interested. Jericho is all over AEW at the moment and he's the reason it's shit. They've killed Danielson and Castagnoli in record time. Guevara just needs to fuck off.
Jon Moxley (c) vs. MJF - MJF is the future. Give him the belt.
Just seen AEW announced they're coming to the UK next year BazTAKE MY MONEY.
I wonder when tickets will be out, and where they’ll go.
wullie
10-11-2022, 01:38 PM
Got to be Craven Cottage unless it's impossible to an arena setup there. Can see Darby Allin being chucked from the cottage already
Browning
10-11-2022, 02:11 PM
Jericho is doing well to be all over AEW and also (seemingly) on the Masked Singer.
Keith Lee is great, Ben, you fool.
wullie
10-11-2022, 02:41 PM
Keith Lee's debut with them where he threw the guy half a mile into the air was fantastic. I'd prefer to see him and Swerve off doing their own thing now though, they're a bit of an awkward pairing.
Sir Andy Mahowry
10-11-2022, 02:45 PM
I miss Keith Lee so much, I love him.
His fights with Dijakovic in NXT were a real highlight.
Well yes I should point out I've not seen any of him and Swerve as a team but Lee the singles wrestler is great.
And as Wullie says he so does a great meme bit. Coming up behind Finn Balor like a slasher villain is my favourite.
Keith Lee is great, Ben, you fool.
Nope not for me. I did say the other day I can't get away with a lot of popular guys so be prepared for contrasting opinions.
I used to really like him back in his indie and NXT days and enjoyed a lot of his matches against Ishii and the like, but looking back it's mainly because he was very different to the usual flippy shit. I did think at the time that WWE fumbled the ball with him and I blamed them for releasing him but now I can see why. He doesn't do much of anything anymore, age/injuries have really taken their toll because of his style. I've pegged him in the same category as Rollins, in that he hasn't evolved himself as he's got older so injuries really highlight what a shell of their former selves they are.
wullie
10-11-2022, 03:50 PM
He had some great moments like when Brock Lesnar was battering everyone in the Royal Rumble and suddenly here comes the big man which felt like they really had something there, but it's not helped that his promos are all 'indubitably my liege, it appears we are at conflict'
Yeah his cadence on the mic is strange. But when you're the big man with Swerve, you don't need to talk. I think the team needs to be done after Full Gear though. Swerve can go to the next level but he's just missing something. I'm not entirely sure what that is but a singles run might fix that.
Shindig
10-11-2022, 06:59 PM
Saraya vs. Dr. Britt Baker DMD - could be alright but will be scared the whole match that Saraya might die. How do WWE not clear her for five years but suddenly AEW think she's good to go?
They haven't even scuffled in the build up, have they?
Got to be Craven Cottage unless it's impossible to an arena setup there. Can see Darby Allin being chucked from the cottage already
Hopefully they tour. TNA did the Olympia in Liverpool on their first tour so fingers crossed for something like that. Smaller/mid venues. My mate went to a ROH PPV in there in 2017. Bucks, Cody, Hangman and Bubba Dudley all on the card. :drool:
Shindig
10-11-2022, 07:25 PM
I missed the chance to see TNA's Robbie E at the Meadowfield Sports Centre. They had a talent share with some fed in Middlesbrough. The even had their own fake Abyss.
The fucking state of it. :D
Nope not for me. I did say the other day I can't get away with a lot of popular guys so be prepared for contrasting opinions.
I used to really like him back in his indie and NXT days and enjoyed a lot of his matches against Ishii and the like, but looking back it's mainly because he was very different to the usual flippy shit. I did think at the time that WWE fumbled the ball with him and I blamed them for releasing him but now I can see why. He doesn't do much of anything anymore, age/injuries have really taken their toll because of his style. I've pegged him in the same category as Rollins, in that he hasn't evolved himself as he's got older so injuries really highlight what a shell of their former selves they are.
I agree, he’s shite. Just a smiling fat bloke.
What’s worse, not liking Keith Lee or Bryan Danielson?
Bryan Danielson obviously.
But I can see your point, he's a complete non-entity this year. His work has no fire anymore. They killed him by turning him face and putting him in BCC.
Reading up on Dynamite a bit and I think Khan really needs to get a handle on what he wants AEW to be. Surely having Jeff Jarrett making fun of Braun's weirdness and HHH's nose isn't what anybody thinks AEW is supposed to be for?
Road Dogg said Bret wasn’t a good wrestler. :D
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Road Dogg is a fucking idiot who'd be doing some job in the PC at best and some fat old jobber in front of crowds of a hundred at worst if he wasn't Hunter's mate.
Shindig
11-11-2022, 07:05 PM
If it wasn't for HHH, he'd still be carrying Jeff Jarrett's bags.
Daniel Bryan is a vanilla midget. He peaked during them 6 months when he feuded with the Authority and since then he’s been a non entity.
My stables getting quite crowded now. :cool:
Meltzer’s star ratings have become a bit of a joke in the last ten years since he got trigger happy on G1, but Ospreay has now gone past Okada to be second most all time 5* matches. Only two off Misawa.
That’s pretty lol but Will is actually great these days since he went heavyweight. I think only Okada can touch him.
Disco
12-11-2022, 02:52 AM
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The Usos / New Day tag match on Smackdown was really good. I liked that ahead of the two false finishes (the Woods kickout in particular) they pulled the camera out to try (in the case of the second Midnight Hour) and show that there was nobody there to break up the pin. I couldn't see Jey for the second one and it actually leading to a kickout for the first worked really well I think.
The two 'World Cup' matches were a bit meh because Boatman and Jinder was only ever going one way and Nakamura / Escobar had potential but Nakamura didn't look like he could be arsed.
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If you only watch the top right panel of that it looks a very different video.
Nakamura hasn't been arsed for about five years now. Massive shame.
I have no interest in New Day these days but I'll have to watch that one at some point.
No as a thing New Day a very much treading water but they still do a good match and while this wasn't as good as the New Day / Usos classics because this is ultimately a TV match it's still a very good 15-20 minute bit of tag wrestling.
Rumour I've seen online is London for a Dynamite taping and Manchester for Rampage/Dark
Damn.
https://whatculture.com/wwe/wwe-iron-survivor-challenge-innovative-new-nxt-stipulation-revealed
I'll give it the benefit of the doubt until I see it but this feels a bit busy.
And iron man match seems an odd choice for them to try and jazz up given WWE doesn't even do many of them.
phonics
16-11-2022, 09:36 PM
I went to a CMLL show when I was in Mexico and while great the rules were the most confusing thing in the world.
Furthermore, most of those 2⁄3 falls matches are trios matches, with a caveat— each team has a captain and in order to win the fall, either the captain must be pinned or submitted, or both of the other members have to take separate falls.
And then within that there's a 90 second period after a pin where rules no longer apply and they hit each other with DQ moves. It's bananas.
CMLL is certainly unique. I prefer their wrestling style over AAA but it’s confusing as fuck if you’re not an avid watcher.
Shindig
16-11-2022, 10:37 PM
Fantasy booking time: They can save the Saraya/Britt Baker nonsense if it turns out Britt signed the doctor's note that cleared Saraya fit. Imagine a wrestler clearing someone for the express purpose of killing them.
Cocaine Tony letting a dentist sign off the medical clearances would be a good twist.
Disco
16-11-2022, 11:07 PM
Dirty Mouth Doctor.
Fantasy booking time: They can save the Saraya/Britt Baker nonsense if it turns out Britt signed the doctor's note that cleared Saraya fit. Imagine a wrestler clearing someone for the express purpose of killing them.
That would be cool. It's about the only thing they can do to save it. So far, Saraya (the babyface) has come off like a mark ("I'm coming back because I love this business" - urgh) while Baker (the heel) keeps dropping the truth and is getting more cheers.
wullie
17-11-2022, 08:31 AM
The argument they had about whose house it is was puzzling as it's Swerve's house, he's even got a song about it and everything.
This sounds like the legal wranglings over The Yard all over again.
Elite straight back into a title match and FTR unable to get on an 11 match card for Full Gear.
EVPs in full swing again already.
They finally gonna put the belt on Jamie Hayter? She was so over at one point, but now it seems like nobody cares again cos Saraya's bored everyone to death.
Hayter is brilliant. But just add her to the list of people that have got over then been squandered.
Wardlow, Starks, FTR, Danielson…
Disco
18-11-2022, 01:30 PM
I remembered Hook existed yesterday, where did he go?
I'm not as frothing about the elite returning in a title match, Dynamite has been on pause since they left (and half the main title scene went with them) so Tony has clearly been waiting to resume his original plans.
Hook is another one. Powerhouse Hobbs as well maybe, although he needs a slow build.
I’m just done with the Elite. Omega was great from his IWGP Junior Heavyweight reign right up until winning the big one (his actual reign was the beginning of the end) but I’ve never “got” the Young Bucks appeal at all and they all act as if they’re superstars who have earned the right to dictate how a prime time national promotion should be run even though the biggest place they wrestled in America up until then was fucking Reseda. They just rode Cody’s coattails and got lucky they found a billionaire mark who wanted to play Total Extreme Wrestling in real life.
Disco
18-11-2022, 04:21 PM
You sound like Cornette. Like their wrestling or not they were a huge deal as part of Bullet Club and a big part of selling AEW as a viable promotion and the idea that any of us know what's going on behind the scenes is laughable, and anyway none of them holding titles for the first year or so rather goes against the narrative of them just booking themselves and their mates to win (which actually describes 75% of all wrestling ever). Minimising the success of Khan/AEW and insisting that very successful wrestlers were nobodies because they didn't go to NXT makes you look very silly, the fact that they were considered for leading roles in a new promotion having 'only wrestled Reseda' should demonstrate how valuable they were rather than the opposite. AEW has plenty of things wrong with it and I find some of their booking trends quite frustrating but the fact that they're compared to and expected to compete creatively with WWE is rather good from a standing start only three years ago.
I want them to succeed. Even though I have a lot of gripes with their product (especially recently) I am more likely to endure a full AEW show than WWE but I just can’t get away with the Young Bucks. The final straw was a few months ago when the sensical rubber match with FTR for all the titles (which FTR would have won because they were immensely over) inexplicably went down the tubes in favour of the shitty trios tournament. I’m more of a NJPW fan so in my opinion Bullet Club wouldn’t have been any worse off without them. The whole Bullet Club invasion kind of derailed Ring of Honor. It’s sold a shit ton of merchandise in USA but Bullet Club has never done anything decent in the country; all the hype was from the NJPW marks. MJF was right.
And not going to NXT isn’t one of my arguments. I prefer wrestlers who didn’t go through the WWE system because it makes them all the same generic shite.
Disco
18-11-2022, 05:12 PM
Selling a big pile of t-shirts is enough (assuming you're Tony Khan or someone who runs a tv network) and I would argue that nobody was buying Bone Soldier merch. Agreed on the title bloat, there was a match a couple of weeks ago which ended with about 8 belts in the ring and it does render most of them pointless. I wonder if that's just a problem with american tv/sports in general, there's so much of everything that any individual part is pretty meaningless.
Who did Moxley wrestle on TV for the title a few weeks ago? Penta I think. That epitomises the title situation. Moxley vs. MJF was already official for Full Gear, so they had to say at the last moment it would be Penta vs. MJF if he won. Well absolutely nobody bought that so it made the title look less prestigious, but also Moxley gained nothing because he beat a guy who’s had no build towards the top of the card and it made Penta look a right geek for going into a match with absolutely no hope. Tony did it literally to have a decent match on TV. In that case it should be a non title match so people believe Penta at least has a slither of a chance.
If AEW had an actual booker they’ve got the tools to be really entertaining.
They seem to have realised that cos last nights women’s title match (Toni storm vs er, someone) was to be the first opponent for the winner of Toni Storm and Jamie Hayter at Full Gear.
Disco
18-11-2022, 05:35 PM
Everything since the Punk debacle has seemed an afterthought, it's what makes me pleased to see the rest of them coming back because they'll probably get on with whatever was originally planned rather than dicking about. It is frustrating that the reaction to losing several of their better wrestlers was to wait around rather than utilise the rest of the good people on the roster. Cole, Page, Black, then four more after All Out must put a hole in your plans but there are plenty of others who could have been used better. They're still eminently more watchable than WWE and even with some ropey feuds there's a lot of good wrestling, it just seems like such a backward step compared to their earlier stuff.
I think Storm might retain and I wouldn’t be mad because Storm is good too but it would be great for Hayter to complete her rise. Having said that, Hayter can probably succeed with or without the title whereas I think Storm needs it.
Disco
18-11-2022, 05:49 PM
Best 100% predictable title match ever? Page / Archer from earlier this year ended up being great fun.
https://www.wrestlinginc.com/1108636/chris-jericho-has-olympic-sized-plans-for-pro-wrestling/
Lol.
Hopefully it's not Tony booking the gold medal.
That is an awful, awful idea. Shut up, Jericho.
Shindig
18-11-2022, 07:39 PM
So ... they'd need performers and bookers from the same country? And eliminate the idea of a bracket because, as soon as countries come up against each other, there's an obvious conflict?
You and your lofty ideas, Jericho.
Yeah it'd have to be standalone matches with judges you'd think. And fucking lol at getting impartial judges for pro wrestling styles from different countries.
Disco
18-11-2022, 08:01 PM
No, you have two wrestlers from each country and they have match together. Most Meltzer stars wins.
So Japan win by 17 stars every Olympics then.
igor_balis
18-11-2022, 08:18 PM
Young bucks were at some indie show at some hole in Leicester I went to a few years ago, and after 7 pints, surrounded by what looked (and smelled) like some kinda CeX employees conference, seeing their flippy dippy bullshit in the middle of the card was pretty great tbf.
Disco
18-11-2022, 08:29 PM
So Japan win by 17 stars every Olympics then.
Only if it's in the Tokyo Dome.
The opening five seconds of Rampage completely sum up JR. :face:
Watched some bits of Smackdown. It's a shame both Ali / Ricochet and Dunne / Zayn didn't get more time but I suppose the latter was always likely to be in service of the Wargames build though. Still, Dunne winning is good if it means there's any chance at all we're getting him and Walter again. :nodd:
(It'll be Boatman. :moop:)
The opening five seconds of Rampage completely sum up JR. :face:
Oh dear, that's pretty bad. :D
But then he's been pretty bad for a very long time now.
If only they had a couple more commentators then they could take him out of the booth.
Shindig
19-11-2022, 12:38 PM
It's kind of depressing to see him carry on. His legendary ability to give a match a soundbite has long since vanished.
When was he last actually good? Ten years ago? Fifteen? I remember even at the point when they were just wheeling him out for the odd Wrestlemania match he seemed like he was past it.
His best play-by-play days were actually in Mid South and WCW. He was so iconic in the Attitude Era because of his emotion (especially when Austin was involved) but the Bell's Palsy really did a number on him when it first started in 1994 and progressively got worse from there; he was just so far ahead of the rest at the time (all the other greats had since retired) that it didn't become really noticeable until the mid 2000's.
Disco
20-11-2022, 12:01 AM
I forgot Full Gear was tonight, Kingston / Akiyama sounds intriguing.
Disco
20-11-2022, 12:05 AM
Wrestling ppvs are on a Sunday and my brain is too old to accept anything different.
Also, buy my mustard or whatever.
Gray Fox
20-11-2022, 12:07 AM
Basically PREMIUM LIVE EVENTS can't compete well with the NFL on Sunday nights now.
I think I’ll need a week to get through this PPV. The match times alone add up to 3 hours. :cab:
Disco
20-11-2022, 01:01 PM
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I think I’ll need a week to get through this PPV. The match times alone add up to 3 hours. :cab:
Yeah I did laugh when I saw the length of the card. Madness.
1594296110914637826
Those flashbacks to previous Dome matches really show how much Kenny has aged since leaving. Injuries have caught up big time.
Queenslander
20-11-2022, 09:17 PM
1594296110914637826
:drool:
All caught up on Full Gear. Not sure what the internets general opinion of the PPV was but it thought it was outstanding. Main event was pretty bad but always to be expected when Mox is wrestling, and absolutely buzzing that MJF is finally the champion.
Wardlow was amazing (I don’t understand why it didn’t show any replays of his top rope awesomeness) and the pop for The Elite was incredible.
Seems like rather than tell JR to stop calling him Jack, Jungle Boys just changed his name to Jungle Boy Jack Perry. :cab: Also why do we get Mox’s wife’s input before most matches nowadays?
Disco
21-11-2022, 02:57 PM
I don't think there was a bad match on the card, quite the feat given how dodgy some of the build up was.
I'm watching this NJ/Stardom show and goodness but there's a steep learning curve to get into Stardom.
AEW Full Gear is going to take me a while to get through. Two of the matches I want to watch are on the pre-show (I like Starks, and Akiyama is a legend).
NJPW/Stardom I might just have to watch the last two matches unless you recommend a particular random tag? Apparently the women's title match is brilliant.
I'm watching this NJ/Stardom show and goodness but there's a steep learning curve to get into Stardom.
How so?
Disco
21-11-2022, 04:38 PM
Same with any new promotion but with added language barriers. Plus (without wishing to sound like Cornette) there seems a definite trend in Joshi gear and I haven't seen enough to tell them all apart yet.
Japan is stuck in the 90's with regards to technology. Even NJPWWorld is clunky as fuck. AJPW's effort is still shocking. The best one really is DDT but their style is...unique.
Disco
21-11-2022, 05:21 PM
AEW Full Gear is going to take me a while to get through. Two of the matches I want to watch are on the pre-show (I like Starks, and Akiyama is a legend).
NJPW/Stardom I might just have to watch the last two matches unless you recommend a particular random tag? Apparently the women's title match is brilliant.
The mixed tags are mostly just exhibitions (the one with Tana and Hayashita is probably the pick) but there's also Mutas last match and Ospreay / Umino which is pretty good.
I recently finished the book NITRO by Guy Evans. If anyone is at all interested in the inner workings of WCW then I can’t recommend it enough. It’s so well researched and written and absolutely blows ‘The Death of WCW’ out of the water.
300 pages talking about wrestling. :cool:
I really hope this MJF vs Paddy Pimblett thing doesn’t go anywhere.
wullie
23-11-2022, 10:28 AM
I recently finished the book NITRO by Guy Evans. If anyone is at all interested in the inner workings of WCW then I can’t recommend it enough. It’s so well researched and written and absolutely blows ‘The Death of WCW’ out of the water.
I nabbed a load of books on that dodgy pirate kindle site before it went down so I've got this on my list, looking forward to it. I'd advise against the Brian Gewirtz book if you already know that he's great, the Rock is great and the McMahons are great.
While we're on this, if you're interested in how the business used to work, the Lou Thesz Hooker book is very good.
Here is my review of Full Gear, the first event of AEW I’ve watched in its (almost) entirety for a long time, so I thought I’d celebrate the occasion by hitting you all with lots of words about it. It’s taken me five days so I feel a sense of accomplishment just by reaching the end. I won’t complain about the length of WrestleMania ever again. This fucker looked long enough so I skipped any angles/skits so if I missed something obvious then that’s why. I wanted to give up on this after the ROH title match because I wasn’t enjoying it but I plowed on in the name of content for the board.
Starting out with the pre-show as there’s a couple of matches I want to see.
First up, a 10 Man Tag involving absolutely nobody I give a shit about. This show will be long enough so let’s skip this one straight off the bat.
Ricky Starks vs. Brian Cage: this is what most TV/pre-show matches should be, really. No need to go kill yourself every week with suicide dives. Starks is a great underdog babyface, he’s a good seller and has great fire in his comebacks - look how the crowd were eating it up by the end. Other than a random Canadian Destroyer there was absolutely nothing risky done in this match. Brian Cage’s problem is that he’s confused about what he should be; he’s a fucking unit and AEW don’t have many fucking units so he should act like a fucking unit, but instead he wants to be this flying big man. This was actually one of his better matches because he toned it down and did more power moves to help get Starks’ story across. He should win this whole tournament shambles; Starks vs. MJF would be great.
Eddie Kingston vs. Jun Akiyama: watching this for Akiyama (legend). I get that Eddie Kingston loves old AJPW (so do I) and wants to wrestle all these Japanese guys in Strong Style matches but he’s not very good at it. His machine gun chops were pretty bad here particularly and 50-something Jun Akiyama is just still so fucking smooth that I felt he inadvertently showed Kingston up a bit. But a lot of people like Eddie’s shtick. Admittedly I’ve not been watching AEW much recently but I thought he was on one of those losing streak arcs so even though in context of the company him winning made sense, in terms of his story it probably didn’t. Whatever, moving on.
To the main show, Robin.
Jungle Boy vs. Luchasaurus: at least AEW use the cage sparingly and use it when it matters in a real blood feud, as opposed to WWE busting it out for any old shit then giving the feud nowhere to go after that. And to add to it, the stupid “escape the cage” finish doesn’t exist in this company either so we’re off to a good start. Christian is just awesome but this match starts really bad. This is meant to be a grudge decider and Luchasaurus tries to go fucking collar and elbow which Jungle Boy ducks then hits the ribs with the least fiery offence I’ve seen in a long time. Thankfully Luchasaurus cuts him off quick and we get into classic heel domination. Jungle Boy scratching away at his forehead within a minute of the bell so nice to see they’re building this match up slowly, maybe Tony has only given them 8 minutes (spoiler: no)? That’s a pretty good crimson mask though I must say, he did seem a bit excitable with the blade. Some good babyface selling before Christian steals the key (but it shows up the refs as absolute idiots). Now Christian gets turfed and we are outside the cage in a cage match (ffs) which turns out to all be for the purpose of getting some toys in the ring. A bit more fire from Jack now but the Canadian Destroyer can fuck off, and he rightfully gets ploughed through the chair for trying it a second time. Nice comeback and piledriver and we should be getting towards the finish but that table hasn’t been used yet so we’re going longer. Luchasaurus hits the Undertaker’s finish for only a two count (lol). Jack comes back and sets up for the big elbow off the top. That’s a huge jump so fair play but he didn’t get all of it (sorry Michael Cole) and is surely hurt more than Luchasaurus but he jumps up anyway and locks in a submission which seems a bit strange; if you’re a big fuck off giant and you’re tapping out to a scrawny kid then you’re only heading one way on the card. Correct winner and they told the right general story but it could have been put together a lot better and had the classic AEW mistake of only selling when it suits. Jungle Boy also bled way too early, by the end it was inconsequential.
Death Triangle vs. The Elite: a significant proportion of the AEW audience go wild for this shit so fair enough let them have it, but it’s not my cup of tea. There’s some good workers involved but I fear they will get giddy and it will descend into an unapologetic spot fest rather quickly. I’m failing to see the next step for these guys too because they are literally the only two teams in this entire trios division; everyone else is randomly stuck together so you know they’re not going to win against a cohesive unit. Oh my God that was the most self-indulgent entrance I’ve ever seen and if that wasn’t enough we’ve got a crowd that seems hell bent on trying to get itself over (those Punk chants are just cringey if you’re older than 16, we know you like the Bucks). I’m sure it’ll be a good bit for the YouTube show though. A tag match with Rick Knox (I think) as ref, this will be nonsensical chaos in seconds. Starting with Omega and PAC, hopefully the other four don’t get in then. Ah never mind, these two have gone straight to the overly cooperative moves straight away anyway. Good heeling from PAC early on but that superkick and kip up spot was phony as shit. It’s good athleticism but the Bucks and Lucha Bros have wrestled this same match 100 times before and no doubt will 100 times in the future. I’m not even concentrating on the match now. Lots of moves before a suicide dive that everyone set up for 30 seconds ago then stand around like absolute dorks and the camera cuts to Nick smiling his head off whilst supposedly selling. Back to Omega and PAC so I’m paying a bit more attention again but it lasts 30 seconds before everyone gets their cue to jump in and do a triple tombstone spot. Lots more moves before Knox misses Omega’s foot on the rope (of course he does). Moves again before Knox misses Omega getting nailed with the fucking ring hammer. That was just six guys getting their shit in and we get to see it six more times. They need to cut Nakazawa and Cutler loose, nothing screams indie mentality more than them two clowns. Stars from Dave though so happy days.
Jade Cargill vs. Nyla Rose: woof this is going to be rough. Here comes Nyla in a low rider because Guerrero. Cargill looks great but she’s green so throwing her in there with someone who also needs to be walked through a match isn’t going to end well if it’s not short with a load of smoke and mirrors. We start with Nyla smashing one of the seconds outside which I have a lot of time for. Now we’re in the ring and I can see this going south in a hurry. Nyla is sloppy and Cargill is taking her bumps wrong. Injury pending. I almost can’t watch this, these two are just getting exposed on PPV, it’s going to be kind of hard to take Cargill seriously as an undefeated champion after this. Thankfully it was short but it did end kind of abruptly and both women have two managers standing there and none got involved. Weird.
Chris Jericho vs. Bryan Danielson vs. Claudio Castagnoli vs. Sammy Guevara: I don’t understand four way matches at all so I’m just kind of watching this without finding anything to comment on early doors. It’s not bad, just waiting for the eventual will-they-won’t-they alliances. And it’s the babyfaces to do it first, so we might get a good few minutes. Jericho and Sammy have a rest outside somewhere before Jericho boots Claudio in the face but he’s left himself exposed to the two faces, silly cunt. Sammy comes in with a very telegraphed double-cutter making the faces look a bit daft. Now some heeling from JAS but Excalibur makes a good point that it’s a World title match and they’re opponents so ROH is looking small time again. Prolonged 2-on-1 which ends in Jericho hitting a lionsault. Sammy breaks up a Jericho pin and here we go, 15 minutes in or whatever and we finally get some meaningful action. Although a shooting star press only gets a two these days. Claudio tossing Sammy out onto Jericho looked great but the four-way stipulation has just killed all suspense from these near-falls because the champion is still sat outside gathering his thoughts (I know he doesn’t need to be involved in the finish but unless it’s telegraphed that he won’t be, he will). Spanish Fly off the top and I still couldn’t tell you who is meant to be the giver/receiver in that instance. How long has this match gone now? It’s dragging. Things are just kind of happening and it’s entirely the booking’s fault. Speaking of idiot refs, Aubrey misses the most blatant foot on the rops from Sammy. Giant Swing which Jericho interrupts with the Judas Effect but he so obviously missed that he had to do it again. Summed up the whole Jericho as champion storyline that ending.
Saraya vs. Britt Baker: if we can get through this without Saraya getting hurt it’s mission accomplished. This has been a strange build up though because Saraya is supposed to be the babyface and Baker the heel, but if you’re a fan of AEW the company then you’re going to be backing Baker here as all her promos have referenced her carrying the division since its inception (she’s not wrong) while Saraya just swans in off the street. The start of the match tries to rectify this with Baker going straight after the neck. Saraya is rusty and gets blown up pretty quick but that’s understandable. The match is pretty basic and the crowd just do not give one shit about this. Bit scruffy towards the end as Saraya really gets out of puff. And she wins out of nowhere with two bad looking DDTs. That result was all wrong in my opinion. They could have had Baker win and Saraya blame the rustiness and then they go back a second time without anyone losing heat. Either short term booking from TK or Saraya is going to be very part time.
Fuck, this show is feeling long already.
Samoa Joe vs. Wardlow vs. Powerhouse Hobbs: three good big guys, this should be decent. However, the build has been a mess. So it’s pretty obvious “WarJoe” (lol) was put together a few weeks ago for the sole purpose of breaking them up but even if you disregard that, you’ve created a grudge where one member of the tag team turns heel on his mate so you’ve got yourself a nice brawl with a reason. But then inexplicably Hobbs gets put into the match and completely takes the gloss off the bad blood between the other two guys. A booker with a brain would hold back Hobbs to go after the winner. Anyway, less moaning about Cocaine Tony and more watching three big guys pound each other. Here we go, and Hobbs is getting too involved off the bat, the other two just split up and should be focusing on each other but Hobbs hits a mega suplex on Wardlow. I’m all about this shit and Joe should help blend it all together as the other two are still green. Then Wardlow did a moonsault and senton off the top which was miles more impressive than anything the EVPs did earlier. There was a good exchange between Wardlow and Hobbs (before Joe cheats to win) which is maybe foreshadowing something but it highlights the age old problem of three/four ways that it always descends into 1-on-1 with someone cycling in/out. In a normal company taking the belt off Wardlow would be an odd move given he’s over but in this company there’s a million belts so whatever.
Sting/Darby Allin vs. Jay Lethal/Jeff Jarrett: is this no-DQ just so they can brawl around the arena and the big goof at ringside can get involved without making the ref look like an idiot? Probably. Jarrett comes in with four Stings (yet FTR still can’t get on the card) and is just being an all round twat so this might actually be alright if it’s a one-off. TNA chants though, crowd being small time again. Bit of a goofy angle to start but Jarrett sells Sting like a killer. I don’t want Jarrett in 2022 but he could teach a lot of these guys a few things about basics. And we’re in the crowd already which obviously culminates in Darby trying to jump off something more wild than last week but he’s cut off by that giant weird looking fella. 62 year-old Sting takes a dive off the balcony onto the big cunt because he’s mental. Finally in the ring and Jarrett actually looks good. Darby sells like death when he remembers to. They used the giant for spots well but the match just kind of ended as Darby ran in from nailing Jarrett to hit his Coffin Drop on Lethal and that’s that. Had no hopes for this going in but it was alright.
Toni Storm vs. Jamie Hayter: both come to the ring looking like they want to cause havoc which is a nice change up from most of them either goofing off or just being casual as fuck. The crowd are with Hayter here and so am I. And it starts like a proper wrestling match with tests of strength and working limbs, unbelievable. You can tell these two have worked Japan and the UK, they’re just miles ahead of the American women with their transitions and psychology. It’s stiff yet crisp. I’m not writing much because I’m really enjoying this. Strong offense and heel work from Hayter and great selling by Storm. Now Storm back on top with equally good work and then a wild headbutt spot which was excellent. Oh no we can do without this outside interference please. Unnecessary and Hayter tells her to fuck off anyway but now she will look silly if she doesn’t win. Oh and now Britt Baker involved too, seemingly with no ill effects of being drilled on her dome, twice, by Saraya earlier. Why do this Tony? This was a genuinely great match up until the interference. Hayter wins but it’s tainted now and there was just no need for it. Great match that would have been even better. Rematches forever please.
The Acclaimed vs. Swerve in Our Glory: the obligatory rubber match in the series but this feud has had its day already. Logic dictates The Acclaimed should dispatch of SIOG rather quickly and cement their place as the pinnacle of the division; the crowd want it and it will make whoever dethrones them down the line more important too. But we know Tony doesn’t book like that, he’d rather an epic match to gush about in the media scrum so strap in. Although I might forgive him if he breaks up the team and gives Swerve a singles run. Apparently Bowens’ shoulder injury is legit so this might be sloppy, especially if it goes long. Very quick transition from the last match so they’re obviously running out of time and don’t I fucking know it. Scissor Me Daddy ain’t my thing but they’ve got the crowd in the palms of their hands, Caster is so slick on the mic. Acclaimed are pretty green and basic still but they can do literally anything and be over as fuck with it (see also: New Age Outlaws, Dudley Boyz). If Bowens’ shoulder really is hurt then he’s got balls because it got worked over pretty well. Swerve in the crowd rearranging barriers as weapons while the ref does nothing. Pretty sure this isn’t no DQ so he looks an idiot too. Keith Lee sells fuck all for the babyfaces and is making sure he looks strong in (inevitable) defeat. This is going way too long already, nobody is buying a title change so why bother stretching it out? Babyface comeback from Caster cut off early because Keith Lee decides he don’t sell for these kids, brother. Swerve has to come back in so Acclaimed can bump someone for a near fall. They finally use the barricade that was set up 15 minutes ago for a random spot that adds nothing. Swerve looks good here, he’s ready for a singles run. Keith Lee’s breathing tells me this has gone too long already and that’s after he had a lie down for five minutes. He double teams Acclaimed even though he tagged out a minute ago so again AEW don’t do tag match rules. Here’s Billy Gunn to run off Swerve with the pliers and Keith decides he’s not about that at all so here is the split as he fucks off for a shower. Now it’s 2-on-1 yet we inexplicably carry on with a bit of chain wrestling so The Acclaimed look weak as fuck now. They finally hit their finish for the win. They could have done all that in 10 minutes.
Jon Moxley vs. MJF: the result here is obvious, right? Don’t fuck with us, Tony. They’ve been teasing Regal turning on Moxley to help MJF win and sometimes the predictable thing is the right thing. Really struggling for time now as I only had to skip 2 minutes to get to the ring introductions for this. Moxley wants to trade slaps and bites to start and MJF rightly nopes out of there and heels it up big time. New York crowd though so they’re pro-heel. Two minutes in and they’ve both established with the ref he’s got no authority over this one. For someone who wrestles about four times a year, MJF has this wrestling thing nailed. His pacing and positioning is really good. Moxley taking a lot of the offense but it’s plodding at best. MJF needs a fiery babyface to play off with his heel tactics. New York are seemingly big fans of back rakes and toe stomps from the heel. Moxley plays it up as a heel now but MJF is also doing heel shit still so it’s a weird dynamic. Piledriver through the table which inexplicably isn’t a DQ so the ref looks stupid YET AGAIN. Making your referees look competent is just basic stuff and AEW get it wrong every time. Top rope DDT looked bad but good positioning from MJF to stay near the ropes. Moxley has absolutely bossed this match for the best part of 20 minutes and now here’s Regal so the betrayal is telegraphed in big neon lights. MJF flips him off though as Regal doesn’t want him to cheat. One ref bump isn’t enough so here’s a second ref to get bumped immediately. Oh but now Regal DOES want MJF to cheat. Brass knuckles for the three as Moxley has a conversation through the pin. New champion thank fuck but that was a weak ending.
Final thoughts: Storm vs. Hayter was match of the night and it’s not even close. Thank fuck they put the belt on MJF. There’s been a billion matches on this card and yet there was no place for FTR? Pathetic. And Tony still wouldn’t release them for the NJPW tag league (where they are champions). Speaking of Tony, this company needs a proper booker desperately. There’s a lot of shite on the roster but that’s just my personal taste in some cases but there’s just no rhyme or reason to anything at the moment and that’s the real problem. Quite a few times in the show they had the right idea with where they wanted to be but got there in stupid ways. Yeah I don’t think I’ll be doing one of these reviews again in a hurry. I might make a comeback for Wrestle Kingdom or Royal Rumble.
wullie
24-11-2022, 08:49 AM
On their show last night either the Elite were just being shitmunchers to a Chicago crowd or CM Punk is coming back and they're going to do the sensible thing and monetise all the backstage nonsense
Wouldn't surprise me if it's the former unfortunately.
Jeff Jarrett and Sting wrestling in 2022 :drool:
Inject it
Dynamite highlighted AEW's problem. Coming off a major PPV, key players from that Jack Perry, MJF, Samoa Joe and Wardlow are nowhere to be seen. Tony seems to have this perception that once someone gets over, they're over forever and he can move onto his next project.
I love Ishii but there's no need for him to be taking up a TV spot here. They've got 100 guys under contract.
Gray Fox
27-11-2022, 01:59 PM
Watched WAR GAMES. (https://twitter.com/TripleH/status/1596647489733394432)
I'd not seen a WAR GAMES match before today so I wasn't really sure what to expect. Though a 5 match PLE card is an odd thing to see in a world where Wrestlemania is now going to last a week.
Womens Team Faces v Team Heels - Was alright. As said I didn't really know the premise but the first 10-15 mins of this is just filler until we get everyone in the ring. Some decent spots along the way. The camera guy being pinned up into the middle bit between the two rings seemed a bit lol but I suppose the only alternative is high mounted ones which would look shit.
Definitely felt like I saw a few times where there someone was waiting for a spot, but the previous one wasn't finished yet, so they were caught waiting as the camera turned to them. Decent finish off the cage, but it definitely felt like here that BIG TIME BECKS was a bigger deal than the actual champion.
Styles v Balor - Pretty good showcase of Balors in-ring work. They made him look like he'd done his homework too. We got the outside interference bollocks out of the way early on this one so we could just have a normal match after. Can't say I care much for a "how dare you not join my club" angle. It might have been better with Balor being usurped by AJ in the same way that Edge was.
Ronda v Shotzi - This was horrible. I get we're building to the inevitable face turn and going over of Baszler, but having the "baddest woman on the planet" needing back up is lol. Shotzi looked terrible and Ronda doesn't seem to care much these days beyond the paycheck(I have seen stuff about her wanting to be loved by the fans, but being genuinely pissed off that they dont). The one big spot of the match was odd too. It would have been much better if a superstar or NXT person was sat in the row of seats taken out and then got involved. There was one bad botch on a DDT to the apron, which looked more like Rondas fault.
Triple threat - The start of this was quite lol with the two main guys battering Theory out of the ring. Some good work in here and it was made to genuinely feel like we were just waiting for either of the two to get a chance to pin Theory. Well worked finish too.
I think this confirms that the failed cash in was more a case of having to get rid of the briefcase problem, than a burial of Theory.
Bloodline v team faces - This has been built superbly of late and more so on the night. Great storytelling in the ring too. Even with all that I did not see the low blow coming. Seems we now have Sami Uso. Though he still did well to look resentful after the match. I hope there more to come from this rather than just Sami v KO feud for the 50th time.
Proper reviews. :cool:
I might watch this at some point now I’ve read that.
Sir Andy Mahowry
27-11-2022, 02:53 PM
I've only seen the women's Wargames match thus far. It was alright but pretty sloppy.
Browning
27-11-2022, 03:47 PM
Supposedly they made rookie booking mistake 1.01 when it comes to War Games and had the heels have the disadvantage. Unforgivable if true.
Gray Fox
27-11-2022, 04:06 PM
Mens. Bloodline had Roman come out last.
Waffdon
27-11-2022, 05:23 PM
Is that not intentional though? All I’ve seen is his walk into the ring so no idea if he cleaned house when he entered but it seems typical Roman Reigns booking.
Sir Andy Mahowry
27-11-2022, 05:24 PM
I haven't seen the match yet but that works for me.
Have all the plebs fight for the X minutes it takes until Roman comes in and starts beating the shit out of someone.
Makes sense to have him come in as the very last man.
Disco
27-11-2022, 05:30 PM
It's dumb, you have the heel team outnumbered for most of the match.
Sir Andy Mahowry
27-11-2022, 05:33 PM
But you have big ticket Roman coming in last and that's all that matters, making Roman as MASSIVE as possible.
Disco
27-11-2022, 05:36 PM
Rubbish, you work against the match format for 90% of the time just for one entrance and he's not even the focus of the story you've written.
I'm with Disco. Renders the majority of the match pointless. AEW have a similar problem where they have all these 25 minute "epics" but don't play the face vs. heel game properly so it's completely irrelevant up until the final stretch.
Sir Andy Mahowry
27-11-2022, 06:09 PM
:D
Shindig
27-11-2022, 06:10 PM
Snapped right in half. :D Like Steve Blackman with some kendo sticks.
This was the first PPV I’ve watched since Mania and it was decent. I don’t watch all the womens dross but the triple threat for the US title was not bad. I don’t know what in the fuck Seth Rollins is anymore but he isn’t good. He’s a shell of his former self and works so soft it’s laughable. He’s turning into The Miz. Theory looks like a potential star but haven’t seen a lot of him.
The main event was nicely done. I’m fine with the heels being at a disadvantage because it fed into the Sami storyline quite well. The in ring action itself was pretty meh but the ending was nicely done and going off the air with Sami being hugged as a fully fledged member was good storytelling. I can’t believe what they’ve done with Roman. He was absolutely horrendous as the Cena clone but the tribal chief shit is great. They’ve struck gold on a perfect character here.
I don’t think I can stomach Raw and Smackdown but this at least gives me some hope that Haitch is resurfacing the Titanic, so to speak.
phonics
28-11-2022, 12:36 AM
Heyman wins again.
That's probably the best NXT or WWE Wargames they've done because it was basically an extended Bloodline angle so they actually found something to do with the fucking endless period Wargames has by design where nothing can happen because the match "hasn't started" yet.
Sir Andy Mahowry
28-11-2022, 09:54 PM
Finished Wargames tonight.
The ending to the main event :cool:
Apparently KO potatoed Roman? Because he flipped his lid backstage after according to reports.
Are there any reports with specifics ? The ones I'm seeing are pretty vague about what KOs actually supposed to have done, just that Reigns was complaining of a ruptured ear drum?
Disco
29-11-2022, 12:38 AM
Ben
You're going to love Man Scout, he's currently reading a book while running the ropes.
What are you tagging me for? :eyemouth:
He lost to fucking Cutler on Dark, so at least they know his level.
I watched the Men's War Games last night. Oh boy was that bad (because of the booking, not the workers). So there was the aforementioned babyface advantage which was obviously done so Roman was the man to enter last, but it completely derailed the entire match until he got in. The whole concept of War Games is for the heels to have the man advantage until the big babyface comes in to level it up, and that was taken away entirely so it was just a messy cage match. The overuse of weapons was ridiculous as well for two reasons; firstly, if you're trying to get over the War Games cage itself as a dangerous big time match then don't litter it with tables and chairs because you're telling the audience to focus on them rather than the fucking cage itself and secondly, I lost count of how many people went through tables and that killed the whole "oh my God" factor of someone going through a fucking table. The match also highlighted how nobody these days has any wrestling psychology; when it wasn't that person's turn to be the focus of the match, they were just laid on the apron selling a punch for minutes at a time. Go and watch and old War Games and see the difference, it's very noticeable. The whole Sami/KO angle at the end was great though but the 40 minutes that led to it was just dead.
Then I looked at Dynamite this morning to see if I should bother watching it. You might be surprised to hear the answer is no. First up is Danielson vs. Dax which just pisses me off; it'll be a great match in a vacuum no doubt but how can you ever get your tag teams over as a legitimate threat if they lose every fucking time they have a singles match (I think the only person he's ever beaten is Cash)? Dax is a great wrestler and Tony thinks him having a nice match against another nice wrestler is good booking. It fucking ain't mate. So I know that result already but they should get a few "this is awesome" chants from the crowd. Then I also saw Ricky Starks has a match against a jobber, why the fuck would you put your underdog babyface in a squash match where he can't display any of his underdog babyface qualities? Jesus Christ. Then Match 3 from the trios gang which is a hard skip for me now. I'll just catch the MJF promo on YouTube.
wullie
01-12-2022, 09:35 AM
Once you see the waiting around thing it really stands out. The more people in a match the worse it is, people sat ringside for the ladder matches must be bemused by someone just lying on the floor in front of them watching for a cue to pop straight back in for a seconds and then back out until it's their turn again.
I think my Full Gear review highlighted my seethe with multi-man matches and that's just one of the reasons, albeit a massive one. But it's definitely modern wrestling that exacerbates the multi-man problem in that no-one knows where to put themselves and having to go 40 minutes amplifies it. I'm sure WCW versions used to be more like 20 minutes so the guys in the background could just do some plodding brawling in the other ring for a bit which isn't a great spectacle but at least it's not phoney as shit.
Wargames is just a bad stip.
Then I looked at Dynamite this morning to see if I should bother watching it. You might be surprised to hear the answer is no. First up is Danielson vs. Dax which just pisses me off; it'll be a great match in a vacuum no doubt but how can you ever get your tag teams over as a legitimate threat if they lose every fucking time they have a singles match (I think the only person he's ever beaten is Cash)? Dax is a great wrestler and Tony thinks him having a nice match against another nice wrestler is good booking. It fucking ain't mate. So I know that result already but they should get a few "this is awesome" chants from the crowd. Then I also saw Ricky Starks has a match against a jobber, why the fuck would you put your underdog babyface in a squash match where he can't display any of his underdog babyface qualities? Jesus Christ. Then Match 3 from the trios gang which is a hard skip for me now. I'll just catch the MJF promo on YouTube.
I just did. MJF is brilliant. He cut an ultra heel promo so if any mark fans still want to cheer him, they're either beyond help or don't like wrestling. MJF reveals a new Burberry World title strap and then shits all over the company and any babyface who might challenge him before proclaiming he's fucking off in 2024 to make a shit ton of money out of Triple H. Speaking of Triple H, it seems Regal is going back there as his heel turn at Full Gear was seemingly a one-night thing after MJF punched him straight into an ambulance to write him off TV. If I was to nitpick, he did get a bit too carried away with burying people who the fans may otherwise get behind as the challenger but he probably needed to do it to get people booing him again.
Shindig
01-12-2022, 11:09 PM
"Tell 'em, Tri."
Sir Andy Mahowry
02-12-2022, 03:57 PM
1598346949467463681
:cool:
The Acclaimed vs. FTR on Dynamite this Wednesday. Tony is clueless. This is their best tag match and he’s throwing it on free TV without a storyline so the victor isn't in doubt.
Putting good work rate matches on TV without a reason just for Dave stars is not good booking.
Some decent stuff on Smackdown this week, and while Walter vs. Ricochet will be great (can't remember what match I've seen of theirs before.... PWG or OTT maybe) but it's a disgrace that they didn't bring back Shane O Mac to defend his World Cup title in the final.
Sheamus vs. Sami was solid as well, and I'm really keen to see what the next Bloodline development will be.
I've said it here before, but Ricky Starks is awesome. Great promo with MJF last night (shame it's only a one week build) and then Starks literally speared him out of his shoes. :D
Disco
08-12-2022, 02:36 PM
Spears is great, one of several I'd love to see him featured a bit more.
Sir Andy Mahowry
11-12-2022, 10:22 PM
https://whatculture.com/wwe/wwe-iron-survivor-challenge-innovative-new-nxt-stipulation-revealed
I'll give it the benefit of the doubt until I see it but this feels a bit busy.
And iron man match seems an odd choice for them to try and jazz up given WWE doesn't even do many of them.
So I watched NXT Deadline today which featured this.
I thought the IRON SURVIVOR matches were ok but a little flawed. Like most Iron Man matches only the final 5 minutes or so actually mattered.
There was some good wrestling though and I think the men's variation was done better. I liked them being dicks to each other in the PENALTY BOX and Grayson Waller was good value.
Outside of those two matches the Isla Dawn/Alba Fyre match was pretty shit but I did lol at the finish, New Day/Pretty Deadly was very fun and the main event seemed to just end a bit abruptly which was a real shame.
Browning
11-12-2022, 10:25 PM
I'm almost certain you've made up every name in that post.
I also watched the Iron Survivor men's match and while it has its moments and I liked the ending (and Axiom) I'm not sure it's actually better or more fun than just doing a Championship Scramble.
And yeah, New Day / Pretty Deadly was good too but not sure what the point of that really was.
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