This is very true. I'll take a modern day example: you can put on any random Okada vs. Tanahashi match and enjoy it, but you might not get the hype, especially as a non-fan. Watch the whole series in order (they must be up to about 15 now) and you'll get a completely different perspective and appreciation. Each match is like a chapter in a book.Originally Posted by Ian
And while I'm yelling at clouds, a match being long doesn't automatically make it better. I'm not sure if he was the first / biggest sinner on this front but I'll call it the Triple H effect. Bunging 10 minutes onto the match time without any idea of how to fill it doesn't automatically make it an EPIC.
I really do miss peak NXT black & gold.
Christ it was good.
I was actually thinking about that when we were talking about O'Reilly and Fish yesterday. A really good tag team and one of the best NXT had but they're not in any of those classic NXT tag matches that come to my mind. UE vs. Moustache Mountain was probably their best? Is there an obvious one I'm missing that you'd put up there with some of the DIY / AA / Revival classics?
Their fight with Moustache Mountain that was on NXT TV was an absolute belter and never gets talked about. It was better than their PPV fight for me.
Tyler Bate really is being fucked wasting languishing in NXT UK with his embarrassing uncle.
They never really got the spotlight in NXT compared to the other tag teams, their best stuff was in ROH.
Was it Orton and Edge that went for 3 weeks at Mania and was fucking shite? Tell the story and get out.
I can still remember channel flipping years ago and stumbling across a random Kurt Angle Vs Ken Kennedy match in TNA and being sucked in immediately despite not following TNA much at the time. Angle was one of those who just fucking got it and could tell a story in the ring with anyone at any time.
He is but then what else is there for him right now?
Jobbing to Tony D'Angelo on NXT (I have no idea if Tony is good or if this would happen, I haven't watched in ages) or jobbing to the "DIRTY DAWGS" on RAW/Insert other shit wrestlers from Smackdown.
Only 36 minutes according to Wiki, it felt so much longer though.
Some say they're still ambling about that gym even now....
Their dogshit 'greatest ever' wrestling match went on about a week as well and that was fucking pre-recorded. If ever anything needed a brutal edit.
Angle 2002-06 was absolutely untouchable. Shame he destroyed himself in the process.
Robby Bobby Roode is one who's way better than whatever they've got him doing, his team with Ziggler would be a top flight act in a parallel universe where they're not throwing custard pies at each other or arguing over Japanese shampoo commercials.
I rewatched Angle / HBK the other day. Still a banger. I need to watch more of his TNA stuff though.
When I was using the network to catch up on all the PPVs I'd missed after I first gave up on wrestling Angle obviously had a bunch of really good matches but the one that really stands out to me in some ways was the one vs. Rey Mysterio because you just don't see anybody who isn't a cruiserweight matching Mysterio for pure speed and yet Angle did it. Incredible stuff.
Again though, I had some investment in Angle. Would I have given as much of a shit watching those matches back if I hadn't already loved his early-2000s stuff? Impossible to know.
It's also what made the few matches he did in his last WWE run so tragic. He could barely move. And got retired by Jezza just to put the final nail in the coffin.
Vince just loves to fuck with good wrestlers. The likes of Molly Holly, Taka Michinoku and Al Snow were phenomenal workers but you wouldn't know it if you only watched WWE.
I got into a habit of watching the really old stuff on WWE network, my favourite was easily the early 80s Mid South shows, you could rocket through them as nothing lingers too long to outstay its welcome. It's weird how amateurish all these accomplished talkers were most of the time, and seeing people like Rick Rude as just a happy man with a moustache and Demolition Smash turning dirty commie with Nikolai Volkoff, magic.
Mid South is a good watch yeah, Bill Watts is fucking mental but knew how to book an old school territory and when Ernie Ladd is on commentary it's just gold.
I'm up to the point where Bill Watts is coming out of retirement for one more match, he's taken Jim Ross to see if they can get Junkyard Dog to come back to help him but he refuses and instead turns up but in a mask as someone else which I'm guessing was the main inspiration for the Hulk Hogan Mr America thing. Also the Rock and Roll Express have started appearing and the girls go mad despite them somehow always looking like old men even in their 20s. Lower standards for superhunks back then
It's mad they're still going today. They had a match with FTR a couple of months ago that was genuinely good. Shows you don't need athleticism if you know how to work a crowd.
I just watched this. And nothing else because the rest of Raw sounded shiiiiiit. That was a really fun match though. And possibly a well timed example of what I was talking about in one of my moany posts earlier as I enjoyed it much more than the three-way tag from Revolution but I have opinions on all these people. I'm quite pleased they've been more patient with RK-Bro than I thought they would be but given Orton seems to be having such a good time I wonder if he's just told them he doesn't want it splitting up yet. It's also just nice to see Gable in a relatively prominent spot.
Still had some of the annoying tropes though. Tower of Doom spot, people getting erections just looking at the Wrestlemania sign, etc.
And poor old KO getting reduced to a chat show segment at Mania so he can get battered by Austin.
Last edited by Ian; 08-03-2022 at 02:01 PM.
So that's really going to happen? Oh boy.
Yes but as part of The KO Show rather than an actual match by the sounds of it which is... better? Maybe? I mean I'll probably skip it anyway so it doesn't matter to me but I just wish Owens could get something worthwhile to do and let some other cunt listen to Austin bark out some catchphrases before eating a stunner.
All I ask is that finishers be protected. To the point where spots are designed around not getting hit by them.
I've not watched AEW since the beginning but Omega's OWA was the perfect example of how to protect a finisher for years.
Also the occasional win with a non-finisher out of the blue is excellent.
I don't think it's been kicked out of in AEW has it?
I have some respect for old Jezza Corbin for this actually. I think nobody has kicked out of the End of Days still which I assume means he just refuses to do it if he's not winning / the pin isn't getting broken up by a third person.
It's how it used to be. Hogan was seething that Sid kicked out of the leg drop at WrestleMania because Warrior missed his cue to break up the pin.
The Attitude Era ruined finishers really and the current generation turned it up to 11.
Yeah kicking out of one should be the exception rather than the rule. It's why I like guys who finish matches in different ways but then have their proper finisher which is the killer move which you only have somebody kick off on very special occasions.
Technically yes it has and no it hasn’t because Moxley put his leg on the rope but it was a no DQ match so that didn’t matter however it was in that match with the pathetic sparkler show at the end that gave Eddie Kingston PTSD and the explosion caused Kenny to let go of the pin.
I’m with Baz on the Bryan thing btw. I’m just not a fan of ‘technical’ wrestling.
A leg on the rope is fine. Like the time Neville (PAC) did the Red Arrow on Rollins but rolled him up so hard on the pin that his foot flopped over onto the rope.
Absolutely fantastic spot.
He’s barely a technical wrestler anymore. At least, not so far in AEW. Like back in the day I could watch Benoit vs Jericho vs Angle for days and buzz off the transitions and reversals that led to another move, and not just following away to do starjumps or flex your biceps.
I appreciate Bryan Danielson used to be considered the best technical wrestler, but his matches in AEW are mostly him avoiding stuff, like he’s playing WWE2K and just mashing the block/reverse and taunt buttons.
I don’t deny being a spot fest soyboy though, and there’s a reason Sammy Guevara, Jungle Boy and, to a lesser extent Nick Jackson, are my favourites, and i want Hook to get squashed.
I'm a twit
What happened to the little guy who was in Jungle Boy's gang, is he gone? Having him replaced with Christian was a huge upgrade but a weird one.
Kota Ibushi kicked out of it but it was years ago so everyone seems to pretend it never happened.
Marko Stunt. He was recently on poster with Joey Janela for GCW so not sure if they’re both in AEW anymore or what.
I'm a twit
It was a good match and the best thing about that spot is the way they did the pin it wasn't an obviously signposted WWE thing and the fans started to go absolutely mental thinking an actual mad surprise was about to happen.
Top moment.
I should rattle out more Rules of Wrestling (tm)
1. Protect finishers. They should be feared and the submission ones should be like an instant tap unless you really want to show the other guy's resilience.
2. No storylines go longer than 6 months. There's fuckloads of TV time now and you can get your build in easy.
3. The supporting titles IC/TV/Cruiserweight/etc should have some weight to them. Make them seem like a big deal. A promotion, a thing to fight for.
4. If you fuck a spot up, don't repeat it immediately. The chance has gone.
5. Wrestle through ad breaks. Properly. You have replays. Let the live audience get their entertainment.
6. Braun Strowman should win a Rumble by tipping the ring.
7. Make your characters feel distinct. If you're bringing in people with the same gimmick, team them up. Don't have them cluttering the singles pool.
8. Scripts shouldn't be followed to the letter. Commentary should be improvised, promos should also, to an extent. Just tell the talent what things to hit and what to end on.
9. Don't be afraid to build a feud up without having the guys fight for ages. Build the anticipation on the mic and then let them go all Don Frye at RoyalWrestleSummerSeries.
10. Surprise Rumble winners. It's okay to do them and you've got an immediate 'Well, they wouldn't put him there if they weren't going to put him over at Mania.' crowd waffle.
11. Too many cool heels. Cunt heels are better.
12. Someone get injured and kind of end the feud? Just put it on ice until they make a triumphant return. Simmer it in the background if you have to.
13. Sometimes the crowd is heel. Bastards.
14. The Canadian Destroyer is banned.
15. Pointing at the Wrestlemania sign is punishable by execution of you and all of your loved ones.
16. All tag team matches (playa) must be announced by Teddy Long
Oh god yes. Petey Williams had a beautiful finisher and the spot monkeys killed it.
Can the Super-Plex into Falcon Arrow result in a finish sometimes?
I do love the idea of forbidden moves that only get brought out in blood feuds.
I always thought Rollins should finish a lot of his normal matches with this and the Curb Stomp should be his "no seriously fuck you" finisher for big feuds or when he can't put somebody away.
17. Commentators saying "that could do it!!!!!" or similar for a move that hasn't won anybody a match in decades.
They've actually made Ziggler the NXT champion...
The brand is officially dead.
18. Don't put main roster talent on your developmental show.
19. If you have talent not doing anything, farm them out for indie dates. Y'know, so they get some work in.
Fucking hell.
I don't mind main roster runs generally, the early days when you had Cesaro throwing Sami Zayn around with one hand was great. Not sure they need to be the top champ though unless it's a full switch.
I assume the young Steiner kid that dropped the belt will move up? It'll be mental if Ziggler isn't just a placeholder to put over the next guy.
Also on the topic of Steiner, why the fuck is he not called Rex Steiner anymore? That's cool as fuck.
Ciampa ate the pin so Ziggler will just lose the belt back to Breakkkker next month on the Mania weekend show.
And he claims the name change was his idea. If so and he really picked "Breakker" somebody should have given him a slap and told him to pipe down.
They've changed Pete Dunne's name to "Butch"...
What the fuck is wrong with this company?
It's all about the Butch.
Are you really surprised by another terrible name change?
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