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View Poll Results: Who will receive your vote?

Voters
44. You may not vote on this poll
  • Theresa May's Conservatives

    10 22.73%
  • Jeremy Corbyn's Labour

    23 52.27%
  • Tim Farron's Liberal Democrats

    3 6.82%
  • Paul Nuttall's UKIP

    0 0%
  • 2 people's Greens

    1 2.27%
  • Nicholas Durgeon's Scottish Nationalists

    1 2.27%
  • Satan's Sinn Fein

    0 0%
  • Dr Ian Paisley's DUP

    0 0%
  • Some other bunch of nonces

    2 4.55%
  • I'm foreign, but I wish I were an Englishman

    4 9.09%
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Thread: UK General Election 2017 - 8 June

  1. #8601
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Floyd View Post
    When those (I have refrained from saying 'we') who worked through the pandemic, and didn't get furloughed, end up getting charged through the nose for everything in recovery - this is a good example - there will be some kind of culture war vs the work from home slob layabouts who are getting into the 'cyclist' mentality now when it comes to self-righteousness.
    I assume your wage is pretty decent from what you do, but I agree with the broad point, if those on minimum wage ever realise on mass that they had to put themselves at risk and contribute towards paying for it all afterwards there could be a genuine riot. It's probably handy for the government that a lot of them are busy with conspiracy theories, FREEDOM marches and other such diversionary nonsense.

  2. #8602
    Administrator Kikó's Avatar
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    10% tax increase which is falling on the poorest hardest is a pretty turd move.

  3. #8603
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kikó View Post
    10% tax increase which is falling on the poorest hardest is a pretty turd move.
    Not that I disagree with the point, but where do you get 10% from?

  4. #8604
    Administrator Kikó's Avatar
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    Percentage increase from 12 to 13.5%.

  5. #8605
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kikó View Post
    Percentage increase from 12 to 13.5%.
    Good point, well made. It's worth pointing out that it's much more than 10% for those earning more, but once again we stop at this mythical £100k figure which presumably leads everyone to untold riches once hit.

  6. #8606
    Administrator Kikó's Avatar
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    Dom is our new leader. Long live the Dom.

  7. #8607
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    Why not? It's just one tax mechanism. Why does it matter that they picked that one?

    Unless you're going to say the wealthy (and I mean actual wealthy, not the 5%, which is a con trick the devil would have been proud of) should be paying it/paying more? To which my answer would be, "yes, that should apply to many things".
    Because it exclusively targets working people. Not landlords, people living off dividends, or whatever other income stream.

  8. #8608
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spikey M View Post
    Because it exclusively targets working people. Not landlords, people living off dividends, or whatever other income stream.
    Aren't they doing dividends as well or did I dream that?

  9. #8609
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    Aren't they doing dividends as well or did I dream that?
    Possibly, I've heard rumours but nothing official. Either way, it's pretty shitty that landlords are unaffected but Debbie working in Next is getting stung. It's deliberate too.

  10. #8610
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spikey M View Post
    Possibly, I've heard rumours but nothing official. Either way, it's pretty shitty that landlords are unaffected but Debbie working in Next is getting stung. It's deliberate too.
    The landlord thing is an absolute disgrace, but a disgrace that I've no idea how you rectify. There must be so many of them that if you make it unviable to own and rent multiple houses the market would be affected to the point where your average Joe is also fucked.

  11. #8611
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    Of course, but what would you do with all these people who need the care (which will be you and I one day)/how else would you fund it?
    If it has to be paid for by everybody then just put income tax or VAT up. If you want the people using it to pay have a 'Dementia Tax' that homes in on their assets (and increase that window where people can give their houses away prior to needing care). Everything ultimately comes down to housebuilding effectively having been outlawed over the years. Pensioners only have all the assets because of that. Fix planning regulations and you solve half the problems shitting the country down.

  12. #8612
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    VAT would be far fairer, but then you get melts moaning about poor people being more affected by that. Ultimately there is no "fair" way of doing this, just more and less unfair - and using NI definitely falls under the former.

  13. #8613
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    At least the triple lock has been suspended. They will moan about that as well. 'I've paid into the system all my life'. Why doesn't the system have enough money then you cunt?

  14. #8614
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    Isn't house building deliberately broken Lewis? In that supply has to be managed in the way it is to stop millions being plunged into negative equity. I mean, changing regulations and actually building more houses would surely be a piece of piss to do if the motivation was there.

  15. #8615
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewis View Post
    At least the triple lock has been suspended. They will moan about that as well. 'I've paid into the system all my life'. Why doesn't the system have enough money then you cunt?
    Indeed. Any moans about that from anyone who has actually looked at the numbers is taking the complete piss.

  16. #8616
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    Isn't house building deliberately broken Lewis? In that supply has to be managed in the way it is to stop millions being plunged into negative equity. I mean, changing regulations and actually building more houses would surely be a piece of piss to do if the motivation was there.
    Yeah, it could easily be resolved from an addressing the shortage/sensible house pricing point of view; but, as you say, good luck winning an election on hello voter in the South East I would like to talk to you about reducing your asset worth by thirty per cent.

  17. #8617
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    It's amazing when you think of it.

    They're not building houses to allow prices to keep growing.

    Then they tax people so that retired people can have care without selling their houses, causing a further lack of housing to be available.

    Then they specifically pick the tax option that has no affect on the old cunts that own all the houses to fund it.


  18. #8618
    Senior Member Lofty's Avatar
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    Is this a specifically southern problem because they are throwing the fuckers up round here, to an insane degree. £500,000 'detached' houses with a gnat's bollock between plots, sticking thousands of homes on several new estates around an existing town without accounting for the increased amenities needed to accommodate the population explosion.

  19. #8619
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    You've identified the problem with the pricetag. They won't have anything built that brings values down.

  20. #8620
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    What's your rationale?
    Others have covered a lot of it since I posted but I also wasn't aware until the other day that on earnings over 50k your national insurance drops to 2%. They could have upped that upper earnings limit a bit/increased the percentage over the upper earnings or just removed it altogether.

    I'm also not sure what the big deal about people having to sell their houses for care really is? Are we now asking low paid people to subsidise the inheritance of those with better off parents?

  21. #8621
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    This is where the MANSION TAX was a missed opportunity. All the crying about 'what about some pensioner who...' If you can't afford to run the house - and taxes are a part of that - why should you keep it? It's the same logic as the BEDROOM TAX. Where they fucked it was saying that they would tax 'mansions' extra, rather than just making council tax - which claims to cover 'adult social care' - sensible enough for me and my sad little flat not to be paying a third of what the million pound houses ten minutes away are.

  22. #8622
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    Council Tax has always baffled me. I literally pay only a few hundred quid less than someone living in a mansion and only 25% less than the 8+ people living next door to me do jointly. I don't know the details of the Poll Tax, but it must have been going some to be more unfair than that.

  23. #8623
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    I think the boundaries/amounts have just barely changed since it was introduced. I would like to see a model of if it was something like 0.5% of the house value. I think mine works out at almost two per cent of the value, which is just laughable compared to the million pound houses.

  24. #8624
    Senior Member niko_cee's Avatar
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    Defining value is the problem though.

    I think we do it on a square foot/size basis here, which whilst probably regressive in some other way seems fairer in principle. I never really understood the UK band system.

  25. #8625
    The Artist Formerly Known as Taz
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    They're currently based on house prices in something like 1990, just update the fucking values to begin with.

  26. #8626
    Senior Member Lofty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewis View Post
    This is where the MANSION TAX was a missed opportunity. All the crying about 'what about some pensioner who...' If you can't afford to run the house - and taxes are a part of that - why should you keep it? It's the same logic as the BEDROOM TAX. Where they fucked it was saying that they would tax 'mansions' extra, rather than just making council tax - which claims to cover 'adult social care' - sensible enough for me and my sad little flat not to be paying a third of what the million pound houses ten minutes away are.
    They helped bin that off by putting Miliband on tv against Mylene Klass where whatever he rebutted her with would be seen as negative. Obviously that wasn't why he lost the election but I think that put paid to the idea as a whole.

  27. #8627
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    When you legitimise Myleene Klass as a political opponent you should know you're in trouble...

  28. #8628
    Senior Member Lofty's Avatar
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    'You can't just point at things and tax them' was the peak of her argument.

  29. #8629
    Man(c) of the People igor_balis's Avatar
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    Let the councils pay the council tax, I pay the Igor tax.

  30. #8630
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    Can someone explain this policy to me as someone who’s moving back from a country with obligatory private health coverage.

    I’ve just seen a headline say something that I understood to be a tax on working people described as ‘a kick in the teeth for pensioners’ and I highly doubt a Tory policy has screwed over pensioners to help young people.

  31. #8631
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    It's probably ending the pensions triple lock which was described as that (don't ask me what the pensions triple lock is). Social care being funded by a national insurance rise is the opposite.

  32. #8632
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    That was rather unhelpful.

  33. #8633
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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  34. #8634
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phonics View Post
    That was rather unhelpful.
    I don't really understand the triple lock, but basically it's a guarantee that state pension will rise each year matched to economic performance. However, because of the economic recovery after lockdown this would have given the pensioners a big rise this year. So they've said its a quirk of the system (which it is to be fair) and they're refusing to honour it. So fear not, only poor pensioners are being affected. Tories are still Torying.

    On the other hand, they've decided to increase funding for social care and have done so by increasing National Insurance. This means normal working people (earning between £9000 and £50000 per year) will see their NI increased by 12%. Meanwhile Tory voters (the old, the rich, landlords etc) are unaffected because only working people pay NI.
    Last edited by Spikey M; 11-09-2021 at 07:49 AM.

  35. #8635
    ram it up your shitpipe Giggles's Avatar
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    Colour me shocked.



  36. #8636
    ram it up your shitpipe Giggles's Avatar
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    I really want the antibbctvlicence guy in the replies to be Jimmy.


  37. #8637
    Senior Member Lofty's Avatar
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    The government is bringing back imperial weights and measures for fruit and veg as well, for some reason.

    Edit: just realised the tweet covers that, was mid way through pushing a turd and just thought it was the crown pint glass shit.

    Is it this easy to trick idiots into thinking this is a major victory? Is this what was promised?

    I was arguing with some tit the other day who completely refuted that the current issues in haulage are at all influenced by Brexit. 'The haulage industry has been struggling with driver shortages for 15-20 years' he lectured me. 'Funny how there was plenty of drivers working last summer when Covid was rife' I countered, no reply offered. Even my Brexit supporting father in law who works in haulage concedes it's all Brexit.
    Last edited by Lofty; 16-09-2021 at 09:30 PM.

  38. #8638
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    That's traitor talk, Lofty. To the gallows with you.

  39. #8639
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    It is a major victory if you think that 'Get things back to how they were when I had a libido and a future' should be the basis of all policy, which is basically how boomers think and vote.

  40. #8640
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    Joke's on them, there won't be any food to weigh in imperial measures anyway.

  41. #8641
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Why isn't lorry driving generally a more desirable career? It can't ever have been easier with automatics and satellite navigation and all the rest.

  42. #8642
    I used to be funny.
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    Probably the fear of getting 12 years because some Vietnamese climbed onboard.

  43. #8643
    The Artist Formerly Known as Taz
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    It's usually night hours rather than usual working hours, right? That, the isolation and the sitting about must wreck your mental and physical health.

  44. #8644
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewis View Post
    Why isn't lorry driving generally a more desirable career? It can't ever have been easier with automatics and satellite navigation and all the rest.
    Long hours, boring, lot of time away from home.

  45. #8645
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    And it's probably getting harder and harder to get away with the murders.

  46. #8646
    I used to be funny.
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    And the rape.

  47. #8647
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewis View Post
    Why isn't lorry driving generally a more desirable career? It can't ever have been easier with automatics and satellite navigation and all the rest.
    Even if Waitrose came knocking and offered me their £50k per year I'd be thinking twice.

    Driving for hours on end, in a vehicle too big for the roads, targets that don't allow for traffic, laws that prohibit you from driving more than x hours to catch up and sleeping in your cab at service stations for however long it takes to get Cat food from Turkmenistan to Bolton.

    Fuck that.

  48. #8648
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    I can't think of many worse jobs.

  49. #8649
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    If The All New Jobs Thread is anything to go by then most jobs are boring and shit. Lorry driving, now that the pay is on the up, sounds miles better than random office dickhead. Sitting there holding the traffic up, tunes on the go, talking to yourself. All in a big lorry.

  50. #8650
    Senior Member niko_cee's Avatar
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    I had no idea the crown thing wasn't on pints anymore, or do we just get all the non-compliant rejects/old stock over here?

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