Still remain for me. Purely for the money.
Theresa May's Conservatives
Jeremy Corbyn's Labour
Tim Farron's Liberal Democrats
Paul Nuttall's UKIP
2 people's Greens
Nicholas Durgeon's Scottish Nationalists
Satan's Sinn Fein
Dr Ian Paisley's DUP
Some other bunch of nonces
I'm foreign, but I wish I were an Englishman
Still remain for me. Purely for the money.
I voted remain because I thought it was a bad idea before but I'd vote remain this time safe in the knowledge that our political establishment is clearly not up to the job of getting it done anyway.
That as well. Even the pro-leave guys shat themselves.
Labour conference has come around and there's already been a proposal to replace Google with a state-owned search engine. Love Labour conference, it's the absolute best.
I would be interested to know what these cranks don't think the state should run. The state-subsidised 'public interest' journalists was another good one.
I suppose (close that down), but they seemed to be thinking more along the lines of taxpayers bailing out those Canary spastics.
Inspiring. Give it to the inanimate carbon rod.
I wonder when the Labour membership will realise they actually need to replace Mr Corbyn with a plausible leader. I genuinely think Angela Rayner would piss it.
He's setting up some woman I've never heard of to be his successor by installing her as deputy. I'm sure she's well balanced and totally normal.
The various women on that wing of the party are some of the thickest thickos in public life.
Fair, but the lunatics have been running the asylum for long enough now that it may be structurally impossible for that to happen. The left hate the 'Blairites' just as much, if not more than they hate the Tories. Yet to win, they need the votes of all those people who voted for Tony but aren't all that sold on revolutionary Marxism.
We're experiencing an odd reversal similar to what happened in America decades ago whereby Labour have completely lost the white working class.
Ed West was predicting the Americanization of British politics (one side for queers and minorities, the other for white people) for as long as I've known who he was, but, obviously not seeing all of the referendum/communism stuff, he thought it would be a gradual drift. Only Steve Hilton can save us now.
Depends when the next election is.
If it happens before we leave the EU (I suppose before next year) and Labour have to have an actual position on the issue (rather than no to a deal, no to no deal) and the position is in "People's Vote" territory then good old Theresa might end up getting the Ukip swing murdering she thought she was going to get last time. But there are any number of factors against that happening.
The most lol thing I saw out of the conference today was some div going on about how Jez and co were out of touch with the young new membership of the party on this issue. It's as if they have no idea who he is.
I would say Jez and co are actually quite astute on that particular point, because by positioning yourself as Remain at this point all you're doing is alienating 52% of the electorate. The New Party tossers would do well to recognise this as well.
Yeah, having a position other than ‘They’re fucking this right up’ would be pretty bloody stupid.
- Back ‘remain’ and alienate the 52%. Most of which aren’t Labour voters already, but you may have been able to swing off the back of Tory uselessness.
- Back ‘Leave’ and haemorrhage your core vote.
Non-specific speeches and avoiding questions won the last election for Tezza. Seeing as nothing good has ever come from Corbz opening his mouth, he should be studying that blueprint.
Well yes, but I don't think you could contest an(other) election called on the basis of brexit without some sort of defined policy on the matter.
I assumed that was what the snap election murmuring from team Theresa (which must be her, her husband and that civil servant who apparently runs everything) was about. If you make 'no deal' a general election issue (ie if it is looming and very real) you can't really stand on the basis of "well, we'd get a better deal". Although, saying that, that's probably not as fanciful as half the other shit which would be getting promised, so maybe the UK needs a good dose of Corbynomics to make the pall of the 1970s seem less remote.
Enjoy your nationalised everything.
Not that we wouldn't be too.
The People's Half, where all new threads and moderating decisions have to be run by the newly-created 'Internet Ombudsman', who has no online presence other than a Hatfield IP address.
If Keir Starmer got the leadership I might bother to re-register to vote.
Starmer is a horrible man.
He has also just made a huge political error.
That's exactly what was being said in the discussion above. The nonsense fudge is their best bet as it doesn't alienate anyone.
Yeah nothing that's happened over the last 2 years has left anyone else alienated. That's for sure.
People need to stop treating everyone below them like they're thick. They already see the fudge.
You are very out of touch. If we did the referendum again, even in a best case for Remain, there would be a 45% leave vote. That's a fuck of a lot of voters for a major party to ostracise, especially when a lot of them are in its traditional heartlands.
You can't read the mood in the UK via twitter.
But you pretend that every last % of that vote prioritizes leaving the EU over absolutely everything else which just simply isn't true. 'Look I'll live in a ditch with bread and water for supper as long as I got muh freedom' is Lewis and about 5 other people. Remain lost because there was absolutely no argument for it, just arguments against not being in it.
"We'll make your lives better and if we didn't have to spend the whole time over Michel Barniers barrel, it'd be a bit easier to do it" isn't a hard argument to make.
I would agree with that in isolation, insofar as the so-called Labour heartlands would, in a straight choice, vote for them even if they promised to join the Euro and make it the law that you had to be bummed by at least one immigrant a year (hence why the Liberal Democrats putting it all on remain was a waste of time); but I also think that voiding a referendum would be your best bet to shatter those sort of assumptions.
Whilst I agree with that analysis, it is the same sort of thinking that has seen Labour all but wiped out in Scotland, where they were previously beyond dominant.
The danger (from the perspective of the witless intelligentsia) in a second referendum isn't that you lose it again (this time it splits 49 remain, 35 deal, 16 no deal which won't be the clusterfuck it logically should be) - it is that in 5 years some Trumpian figure rises and galvanises the downtrodden white vote into one cause and causes all manner of havoc.
To use the parlance of the times, you can't have your cake and eat it with regards to ignoring the outcome of the original referendum.
I come at it from my Mums side of the family that are as working class/Brexit as it gets.
From Erdington, my Uncle was in the TA and spent years needing a hip replacement (injured in Kosovo) and not getting it on the NHS, my Aunt is the definition of a single mother who married a bloke who walked out on her and her 2 kids (I later found out he was forcibly walked out by the police for selling heroin next to a school), one of those kids (younger than I am) had one child of every race before I'd turned 24.
The only thing they care about is subjects that begin with 'I don't mean to be racist bab but...' and end in 'There's too many Poles and everyone else who doesn't look like us'.
The only thing you can offer these people that isn't putting everyone who doesn't pass the smell test on a boat is prosperity. Outside of that you're just arguing the % that gets shipped out. Which leaves everyone unhappy.
The issue Niko/Lewis raises is the only thing, fail to deliver prosperity and you'll have the Brownshirts running the asylum not far after.
"We can't enslave them but we can trap them here for life with our service industry and retail jobs."
How that for a pitch?
I do enjoy Phonics Anti-Brexit rage, from his ivory tower, in a hugely rich country, that isn’t even in the EU. Take it to Twitter you cunt.
Switzerland is effectively in the EU. Far more aligned than Britain was pre-Brexit at least. But to put it in perspective our deal with the EU is still being negotiated despite negotiations starting in 78. So they just sign bilateral agreements agreeing with whatever the EU does.
I've changed my mind on how I'd vote.
I was conflicted before and convinced by the undemocratic scheming of the EU to suggest a LEAVE vote.
I've now decided that it should be REMAIN even if that means a second referendum, the idea of which I detest. I will admit that there are personal considerations because of my geographic location.
You’re probably the best reason to leave going at the moment.
A kid that was forced to emigrate abroad (but within the same region like the ROI) for tax reasons, didn't do well at school and used the inbuilt advantages of growing up in that country/school system to out-earn 90% of the populace of the country he originated from?
Yeah, terrible example.
If your reason for leaving is 'How they treated Greece', you could sit comfortable in the fact that you'd never be treated like that because you're too important to them unless you left, in which case they'd treat you like they did Greece for daring to leave. By voting leave out of that belief, you've caused the situation you wanted to avoid.
My Dad was a painter and decorator working on building sites his whole life.
My Mum was born to a Dad who was sold to a hotel as a baby for shillings and my Nan who was adopted, the family grew up in an orphanage that my Nan was a nurse at. My family on my mums side is from Erdington and I've already explained involves a member of the TA and an aunt who was married to a heroin dealer. She's literally the definition of the 'working class done good story' she worked her way up from Boots Makeup Girl to Vice-President of Beauty for P&G. I'm not sure how that would affect my views.
I went from being one of the best off people in my school to being one of the poorest when I moved here. I am at the lowest tier of well-off and understand that privilege and wouldn't throw away those possibilities for others. None of these things are the reason I'm pro-EU though.
Right, so you're the son of a VP with a worldwide company that counts its revenue in the tens of billions. I'm sure it was the inbuilt benefits of the EU and those alone that helped you out.
I couldn't be less interested in your views, but that little biography you've offered up is about as disingenuous as anything ever posted here.
No I grew up the son of a woman that worked at Boots. When I moved she was a mid-tier sales person for Oil of Olay. Our house in the UK when we moved cost the same as Baz' did (factoring in living in Surrey not St Helens). That she retired as a VP by the time I'm 30 doesn't really affect my opinion.
Instead of demeaning the incredible achievements of my mother you could ask what my reason for being pro-EU is considering I said that my experience isn't the deciding factor.
So you didn't go to the same fancy private school as Mert then?
@Henry, when you say scheming, do you mean in general or specifically with the brexit negotiations? Or both?
Oh, I see. You're a regular Oliver Twist then. Not sure how you've coped with such hardship.
Jesus Christ. I'm not sure how much more clear I can be that I am infinitely grateful for everything that's been afforded me and the circumstances that gave me those opportunities and think they need to be available to all.I am at the lowest tier of well-off and understand that privilege and wouldn't throw away those possibilities for others.
Is the Oxbridge graduate digging in for a class war?