This is what I think has put off the other top clubs. It's a bit of a gamble following his ankle Injury.Originally Posted by GS
This is what I think has put off the other top clubs. It's a bit of a gamble following his ankle Injury.
He'll be taking that 'honour' from Kyle Walker. Not in any way a point in his favour.
He isn't as good as Alderweireld, so it looks like Yev is right.
The only one I've got massively wrong was Schneiderlin at United. I still can't get my head round he flopped there.
The others I've talked up have gone on to do well; Mane, Alderwierled, Lallana and Wanyama.
Wanyama shocked me. He's still a booking waiting to happen but any time I seen him he looked really good.
Why's he not as good as Alderweireld then? I've seen them both play loads and think Van Dijk edges it but if like to know your reasoning.
They're both top 5 in the world IMO so I'm not saying you're necessarily wrong just interested.
Him and Pochettino are just made for eachother.
Behave yourself.
What a sentence to put in a post arguing against the idea that you overrate your own club's players.
From what I've seen of both players I just don't think he's as good as Alderweireld.
We finished 6th that season, our best ever points tally and highest league finish.
Van Djik won all the end of season player awards.
That was supposed to say top five centre backs. Not that there's much competition at the moment.What a sentence to put in a post arguing against the idea that you overrate your own club's players.
From what I've seen of both players I just don't think he's as good as Alderweireld.
Anyway, I'm off to the pub. You'll have to continue this super exciting Southampton chat without me I'm afraid.
I got what you meant. In the last three seasons Southampton have had two of the five best central defenders in the world. It's still hilarious.
I'm guessing my point's been proven.
Who are the best centre backs in the world? Ramos, Bonucci and Boateng for sure. Godin has still got it. Who else? It's not exactly a vintage era.
I've no idea, but if Virgil van Dijk was one of them he wouldn't be going to Liverpool.
No it was a more general question. Early 2000s was a cracking era for centre backs.
Eric Bailly the young gawddddd
One realization I had recently was that, because most people generally only consider the players at the top, top clubs when they're doing their "who's the best player in X position?" analyses, it makes sense that a lot of positions seem to have few world class players around. If there's only 4, maybe 5 clubs to choose from when making these judgments then you're never going to have many options to choose from. In the early 2000s there were at least 10 consistently CL-challenging teams so it was easier
Like, people always talk about how there's no world class left backs anymore, name off Marcelo, Alex Sandro and David Alaba, and go "who else?" You're restricting yourself to the mega clubs so yeah, it's going to seem like peanuts
Maybe there are less clubs challenging for the CL title because there are fewer world class players?
World class is a relative term, so the number shouldn't change much.
Maybe, probably not though
If regular people were actually good judges of footballing ability, then you're right. But a world class player on a good-but-not-great team is gonna have a hard time convincing people of his abilities. You get people like Godin from teams like Atletico that'll sneak into the conversation, but is anybody going to mention Koke in a list of the world's best midfielders? I've barely watched him play but from all I can tell he definitely is, and that's Atletico Madrid. If you're on a smaller team your chances are infinitesimal. Alderweireld is probably top 5 CB in the world, but a lot of people would balk at that.
If I watched more football I'd probably have more examples, but there were more than 4-5 top teams 15 years ago and so more players who you'd feel comfortable rating highly
ramos isn't exactly a great defender is he. There's certainly none in Italy bar Juve.
Pontus Jansson?
It's easier to spot a fraud at a top team than a Diamond in the rough unfortunately. You have to wonder how many Mahrez types are stuck lumping long balls about in the Croatian 2nd Tier.
A total fraud yea, but if you have an incredible team you can put a 2nd tier player in and he'll look 1st tier. Part of the difficulty
Mok makes a good point. I've always found it difficult to judge defenders though. I can tell when a team defends well, but picking out individuals is tricky unless I watch them all the time.
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He seems to do the simple things really well. Plus being that athletic is gonna help in a fast, aggressive team. His touch is good though, I thought he was just a bully before seeing him play more last season.
There are fewer teams challenging for the Champions League on a regular basis because the better players are more concentrated into those few clubs, not because magic and all the other teams still have as many stars as they used to. There are still great players playing for the lesser teams, but not as many of them so it makes sense to consider the bigger clubs first, then look down the list.
You do have to look at those smaller sides if you're considering who the best in the world are though, and I did when dismissing Alderweireld and Van Dijk. I'd take Gimenez from Atletico before either of them, along with all the names already mentioned and Thiago Silva, Eric Bailly, Koulibaly, and Koscielny, and probably some others if I was to really sit down and think about it.
It isn't a golden age of defending, but that doesn't mean those two get in.
The best defender in Italy doesn't even play for Juve, bro.
Koulibaly
Going by the Serie A I watched last season, I didn't think the country had any defenders at all...
I would normally go for that argument, but in this case the only other teams who could afford him aren't particularly desperate for a sixty million quid upgrade (if he is one) on what they already have. I'm sure if he was going for the usual Southampton thirty-ish million more teams would have been interested.
All that centre back discussion and not one mention of Phil Jones. Is he not going to be a FEC anymore?
Not even a FEI.
Bonucci duh.Koulibaly
I wasn't aware that he had actually signed for Milan yet
Two weeks ago.
He didn't do the simple things well for the first 6 months. I think he's the sort of player who improves when he plays with better players as he's really kicked on again at Spurs.
Lol we're about to sign Negredo apparently.
These Fellainimania stories had best be shite.
Phew. It's a different Fellaini.
Happy days.
Matic expected to sign in the next few days.
ITKIKO
The problem at Celtic is the same as he could have at a top club in the Prem. He goes to sleep. His best performances came in Celtics tougher games when he was more actively called upon. Much like many keepers - Almunia for us was class against the likes of Barca and consistently fucked up against the dross. VdV is not that bad, and unlike an Almunia has the attributes to be amongst the very best in the world, but he suffers the same weakness.
United Twitter seems to be overwhelmingly anti-Matic, but I think it will be a really good signing.
It's not an exciting one.
There's other midfielders that I'd prefer ahead of him but he's probably the type of player that we actually need.
It's because he old and not very exotic, but I'm also hopeful that he will be the anchor to the midfield we've been very much missing (If he plays better than he did in Chelsea's disaster season, obviously). A 23 year-old Brazilian who plays for Monaco is always going to get the twitter fans going more than Matic.
Also been linked with Matuidi and Aurier again this evening. The former presumably as a Fellaini replacement which would be fine. The latter seems to be a truly enormous dong-end, but a talented fullback. Guess if he can behave himself he'll be good to have along with Valencia who's getting on.
It's going to be a proper physical/shithouse nineties United team. I think that makes Anthony Martial Lee Sharpe. Unlucky, mate.
Wonder what the average height of the 'spine' of the team would be. About 9 feet presumably.
I missed Fellaini going. Hadn't even seen rumours.
Fellainimania.
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