Are you seriously confused as to how science and religion has conflicted? And you claim to 'lol' at my take on history......
It doesn't counter the fact, it helps explain it.
Are you seriously confused as to how science and religion has conflicted? And you claim to 'lol' at my take on history......
It doesn't counter the fact, it helps explain it.
I'm well aware of how science and religion conflict. But whatever half dozen lines or so that you're remembering from The Portable Atheist doesn't explain all of human history.
The main point being that neither Islam or any other religion is monolithic or unchanging. The Islam of the 8th century caliphate is wildly different to the Islam of the 18th century enlightenment (when science arose) which is again wildly different from the 21st century faith, and there are many currents within each. The fact that you don't like some of the more extreme modern ones in particular in no way entitles you to apply what you think of them to the previous fifteen centuries.
It's like saying that the Roman Empire collapsed because Jehovah's Witnesses waste their time going door to door.
And no, insisting that it's backwards doesn't help explain why Islamic civilisation once led the world.
Between the Crusaders and the Mongols the Islamic world took a battering, and then it all ended up under stagnant and insular Ottoman control. The end result being that Europe got busy killing itself and came out the other end with innovative systems of government and economies. It was a very similar story in China, and they weren't particularly Islamic.
Never read it. Don't make assumptions.Originally Posted by Henry
Well this is just what I was saying earlier. You refuse to see the obvious distinction between religions. Islam claims to be the final word, it will never have a 'New Testament' as it claims to be perfect.The main point being that neither Islam or any other religion is monolithic or unchanging. The Islam of the 8th century caliphate is wildly different to the Islam of the 18th century enlightenment (when science arose) which is again wildly different from the 21st century faith, and there are many currents within each. The fact that you don't like some of the more extreme modern ones in particular in no way entitles you to apply what you think of them to the previous fifteen centuries.
It's like saying that the Roman Empire collapsed because Jehovah's Witnesses waste their time going door to door.
That's just you not being able to read. I said it once was because at that time it was ahead of the other backwards religions, which have since evolved a lot more, leaving behind the barbarism of Islam. The enlightenment escaped the Islamic world.And no, insisting that it's backwards doesn't help explain why Islamic civilisation once led the world
ZOk, take it out.
However, you still don't see people from Indonesia, Malaysia or Qatar (or Pakistan, or Bangledesh....) clambering to get to Europe - what complete nonsense.
I suspect there are about 0.73 people who actually care, but here's a piece challenging the view that the SNP - and it's removal of tuition fees - has harmed access to university for young people from the poorest backgrounds:
http://tomforth.co.uk/uniaccess/
Yet another criticism of the SNP government that has blanket acceptance in the media and from the opposition, and yet it's the SNP that are supposedly running a one-party state without proper scrutiny.There should be never complacency in education, but combining Scotland's strong position in the table above with the evidence from my first graph showing its recent improvement I would argue that current criticism of its higher education system is unfounded.
(I'm going to end up sounding like Sebo if I keep harping on about it, which I don't want to because I don't even support the SNP that strongly as a party.)
Interesting piece on us buying our energy commitments from foreign states.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...-privatisation
Take Hinkley, which at £24.5bn will cost as much as the London Olympics, Crossrail and a new terminal at Heathrow put together. Osborne will proudly blare that taxpayers aren’t chipping in a penny towards the costs. True enough, but his civil servants will quietly admit that we are guaranteeing up to £17bn of the total cost. In the screwy logic of Britain’s renationalised capitalism, the public assumes the risk while the corporations get to scoop the profits.
Because rest assured, there will be profits – all of us will be making sure of that. To secure EDF as a builder, Cameron guaranteed a fixed price for electricity from Hinkley of £92.50 per megawatt hour. That is around double the going rate for electricity on the wholesale markets, a price so high that equity analysts term it“financial insanity”. Change your supplier as often as you like, you and everyone else in Britain will be paying for that de facto subsidy in your electricity bills for decades to come. Britons will in effect be paying more for their energy so that French households can pay less. Indeed, so generous are the terms of this deal that the government of Austria is currently taking Britain to court on the grounds that it’s handing out state aid to EDF.
Of course you haven't. Silly me.
Do you know what a Shi'ite is?
You say wrongly, because you don't understand history, or anything else about this.
Yeah, but it's Tories so they know what they are doing with the economy.
Security security security.
I'm sure the Chinese will look after the nuclear power very well.
I'd say David Cameron should raise the issue of human rights with them, but with the way things are going, maybe it should be the other way around.
Bwahahaha.
So you will retract your silly assumption, then? Thanks.
Yes, Scoobs in bed. Glen isn't much better.Do you know what a Shi'ite is?
You asserting things does not make them so. Try and make the point by showing me where I'm wrong.You say wrongly, because you don't understand history, or anything else about this.
I did show that you're wrong, but you turned it into a jibe about "Scoobs", so what's the point?
It's coming. That's also not true of Pakistan. Pakistani-borns are the third highest immigrant group coming to Britain, after India and Poland.
No, you didn't. You asked if I knew about the Shi'ite. Well yes, I do. Explain what that has to do with my correct assertion that Islam has rather stood still in its progression compared to other religions? Iran is the most famous Shia-run country in the world - who gave the order to kill Salman Rushdie? Who said the following?:
Where do you think it is still acceptable to be punished for 'swearing at the Prophet'? Or leaving the faith?
It may well be that it's 'progressive' compared to the worst form of Islam but that's not my contention. My contention is that Islam, in all its guises, is much less progressive than any other religion has been and is necessarily so.
A 30 second Google shows that 14,500 Pakistanis went to the UK in the past 12 months.... That's a mind-boggling 0.000075% of the Pakistan population. They don't exactly seem desperate to head to the UK to me.
If you knew what Shia Islam was, then you wouldn't make comments about Islam being the "final word" that can't be added to. HINT: They've done just that.
And no, the Iranian political system isn't very nice but that's not what we were discussing.
Well ask yourself how many Europeans are going to those countries in comparison. It's something of a one-way stream, you'll find.
No, they haven't. They interpret things a bit more but, like I said, there is no new testament equivalent and there never will be. The Iranian system is based on Shia Islam, which is the official state religion. Those punishments I gave examples of were based on Shia Islam. What progress!
Apparently in 2010 Pakistan had 4.2m migrants, plus another 1.6m asylum seekers (most in the world).
80,000 of the migrants were British (2010). Unfortunately, I couldn't find any country-by-country/year-by-year breakdown.
Interestingly, emigration-wise, the most population destination for Pakistani's (in 2010) are;
- UAE (Muslim)
- Bahrain (Muslim)
- Kuwait (Muslim)
- Libya (Muslim)
- Malaysia (Muslim)
In fact, 96.5% of Pakistani emigrants end up in the Middle-East
https://www.budapestprocess.org/comp...s/download/167
It seems like they are heading from shithole to shithole.
Nope. Do some reading. TTH isn't school.
Here's some reading for you:
http://www.al-islam.org/articles/tho...m-mahdi-azizanThe Jurists of the Shia faith have divided the apostate into two categories – Milli and Fitri. The ‘Murtad-e- Fitri’ is the one who is born into a family in which either one or both parents are Muslims and after he/she reaches to the age of maturity and willfully accepts Islam, then leaves the faith. However, the ‘Murtad-e-Milli’ is the person who was born into a family in which neither of his parents were Muslims and after reaching to the age of maturity and willfully accepting Islam then leaves Islam to another tradition.
In regards to the ruling for being an apostate, the Jurists of the Shia differentiate between the male and female apostate. As for the woman who apostates – whether of the ‘Fitri’ or ‘Milli’ – if she repents, her repentance will be accepted and the penalty for apostasy will be removed from her. However, if she does not repent and recant, then she is to be flogged and imprisoned.
However for the man who apostates – either the Fitri or the Milli - there are different rulings. The most well known position of the Jurists is that the repentance of the Murtad-e-Fitri is not accepted and thus his ruling is that he is to be executed. However the Murtad-e-Milli can repent and recant his statement of apostasy and if he does so, he will not be subject to the death penalty.
Progress!
Why do you insist on appeasement of Islamic barbarism? Why do the left always do this?
I fear this is following a predictable pattern of me actually presenting evidence and being met with opposition and no evidence to back that up.
Why are you trying to pretend that we're arguing about whether the Iranian theocracy is a nice place to live? We already agree that it isn't, so you've no need to be producing "evidence" of it.
The issue that you're trying to get away from is your understanding of the history of Islam.
The whole point of Shia Islam is that the Koran is not the final word, and that the writings of Muhammad's successors (the Imam's) also apply.
See here.
And to per-empt your repetition of your previous points, this is not to argue that Shia Islam is nice and cuddly - just to point out that it's an evolution and that things are not as monolithic and final as you keep proclaiming.
These stories about Seamus Milne becoming Labour's Director of Communications makes me think it's all some sort of performance art.
That clip of Dave and Jeremy having a chat earlier is quality. They both look properly into whatever the conversation is. Gardening, perhaps, or manhole covers.
Guido Fawkes has cum in his pants.
By 'British' I think you'll find they are largely Pakistani/British, probably either going to training camps or visiting their fucked up relatives.
How many 'refugees' have you seen saying their dream is to reach Pakistan?
That Theocracy is directly based on Shia Islam, which we are talking about. You will not deflect this, I'm afraid.
Even if I agree with you, which I don't, then it would beg the question - why is a faith open to progression not progressing much? Why is homosexuality still punishable by death, as is apostasy? And so on.The issue that you're trying to get away from is your understanding of the history of Islam.
The whole point of Shia Islam is that the Koran is not the final word, and that the writings of Muhammad's successors (the Imam's) also apply.
See here.
All those refugees in Pakistan are Afghans (obviously). Unless that number is people leaving Pakistan? In which case they get snapped up as migrant labour in the Gulf. I would guess that there are many, many more Pakistanis in the UAE than Emiratis.
Since this hero was banned from speaking in Britain recently, let's indulge ourselves in the sound of many of his well aimed strokes of the hammer hitting that nail firmly on the head, from a few years ago:
You can get barred for telling the truth, it seems.
He sort of sounds like a Dutch Jose Mourinho.
Luca, why have your countrymen elected a total cuntweasel?
Actually, I'd be curious as well. Not the cuntweasel part but more what is Trudeau like? Only thing I've heard is that he's the son of the politician regarded as the 'father of Modern Canada'
I should have included you in my ranting PM to Lewis. To paraphrase:
Idiots got caught up in a wave of YOUTH VOTE HYPE, CHANGE, and STRATEGIC VOTING. Harper has, in truth, done plenty of boneheaded things (muzzling government scientists, Patriot Act lite) to distract voters from the things (the economy) that people usually vote on, leading to plenty of backlash, especially from swing voters.
I voted Conservative, obviously (to ensure strategically that they'd be the opposition, and not the fucking NDP), but I'm glad Harper has resigned. He's the sort of religious-right type of Conservative that we could use less of here. Unfortunately, the collateral damage includes Joe Oliver, who would probably have been the best choice for leader. If it's Jason fucking Kenney (Harper v0.8), I'm going to rage at the idiocy. In summation, Harper has lost here by doing what Labour did over there; ie. try and govern from one hard side and not from the centre. Kenney would just be more of the same shite.
'JT' won't change anything (he's a drama schoolteacher, for fuck's sake), but he takes selfies, so people like him.
This is a pretty good summation of how I feel.
So Twitter won? Oh dear. Here, or in England at least, Twitter always loses.
He's got the looks and the charm of his father, that's for sure. He's been an MP for about 7 years now. Some of his main platform positions include include shifting tax benefits from the upper class/corporations to the middle class, electoral reform (moving from FPTP to STV), and marijuana legalisation (fair play). My issue is that he's full of piss and wind, even relative to the general level of shit that politicians talk, and constantly flip-flopping his opinions.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/w...kplace-pension
And that 'striking physical embodiment of the workplace pension looks like...A new character is introduced to Britain’s television screens this evening (Wednesday 21 October) with the launch of a campaign which aims to change the country’s perception of pensions in the workplace.
Workie, a striking physical embodiment of the workplace pension, will be seen visiting people in all sorts of work environments over the coming months, asking them not to ignore him.
Toggle Spoiler
I bet they spent thousands on that. Johnny Vegas and Monkey would have done it for petrol money and a crate of beer.
Thousands? Try fucking millions. £8.5 million.
'a striking physical embodiment of the workplace pension' has probably topped that sausage roll shite as a new low for politics.
The worst bit is that the thrust of the argument itself is clearly just that pensions are the "elephant in the room" that nobody wants to talk about, but they clearly felt too smart to just use an elephant.
These Government contractors... It's absolutely fucking embarassing. We can't even get a quote from someone without spending a few hundred thousand pounds.
Imagine what happens when TPP comes in and any corporation can sue us to shit for the last idiots guff. Eight point five million pounds. That's so depressing.
It's the bill to ban 'legal highs'.A Conservative MP who was famously tricked into condemning a made up drug called “Cake” has been put in charge of scrutinising the Government’s new drugs policy.
David Amess appeared on the satirical television programme Brass Eye in 1997 where he was filmed referring to Cake as “a big yellow death bullet”.
As a result of the encounter he asked ministers a real life question in Parliament about the made up drug.
It was announced this week that Mr Amess will chair the bill committee for the Government’s Psychoactive Substances Bill.
That picture is Floyd's life.
But with hair.
Mr Xi looks a lot more convincing in a pub than some.
He's got the 'I've been cornered by the pub bore' face down to a t.
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