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Thread: The UK Politics Thread [Wot did Jez do now...]

  1. #4201
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    Oi Kiko, get Lee to give us an NHS update.

  2. #4202
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    It's all fucked.

  3. #4203
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    If only Boris had become PM instead of SkeleWitch, it would (genuinely) have an extra £100 million a week. Although I'm not sure money will actually solve much.

  4. #4204
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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  5. #4205
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    More classic Melvyn Bragg And That thinking. If I like something, it's because it's right; if you like something, it's because it's populist. If I don't like something, I'm standing up for my principles; if you don't like something, you're being divisive.

    Also, all this talk about 'plans' is absolutely stupid. No one has ever had a 'plan' about anything. You can't 'plan' a country. You steer it.

  6. #4206
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    The best (and obviously most under-reported) bit of that endlessly quotable Dominic Cummings blog was the extent to which collective gayness powered the remain vote.

  7. #4207
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    Generally the better educated are more prone to irrational political opinions and political hysteria than the worse educated far from power. Why? In the field of political opinion they are more driven by fashion, a gang mentality, and the desire to pose about moral and political questions all of which exacerbate cognitive biases, encourage groupthink, and reduce accuracy. Those on average incomes are less likely to express political views to send signals; political views are much less important for signalling to one’s immediate in-group when you are on 20k a year. The former tend to see such questions in more general and abstract terms, and are more insulated from immediate worries about money. The latter tend to see such questions in more concrete and specific terms and ask ‘how does this affect me?’. The former live amid the emotional waves that ripple around powerful and tightly linked self-reinforcing networks. These waves rarely permeate the barrier around insiders and touch others.

  8. #4208
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    It's the gift that keeps on giving, and it's almost worth having it sabotaged just to see what sort of SEETHE Nigel Farage can mobilise.

  9. #4209
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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    I'm not sure you can really argue that leave voters were asking 'how will this affect me?' in terms of money.

    Thus is quite good on why remainers and leavers don't really get each other, I think: http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad....-politics.html

  10. #4210
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    I would like to have been there when he came to that startling realisation. I bet it was prompted by somebody turning down a glass of wine.

    'I spent forty-five minutes picking this out. The man in the shop said...'
    *sulks on it all weekend*

  11. #4211
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    'Consequentialist' is an even worse way of declaring yourself the superior being than 'progressive'.

  12. #4212
    Senior Member Alan Shearer The 2nd's Avatar
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  13. #4213
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    I saw that earlier, and it's the David Brentesque 'Well' at 5:22 that sets it apart.

  14. #4214
    Senior Member Alan Shearer The 2nd's Avatar
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  15. #4215
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    Tristram Hunt quitting to become director of the V&A. How perfect is that. Stoke by-election incoming.

  16. #4216
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Remember that brief period where all of our cultural institutions being in Labour hands was seen as a big deal (until the coalition came into being and started taking it up the arse)? Hopefully once the Brexit Revolution gets underway, and we start catapulting foreigners out, UKIP activists will break into museums and universities and batter remain supporters to death.

  17. #4217
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    Prominent Remainers having to barricade themselves into crap London museums on £200,000 a year is too good to be true, really.

  18. #4218
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    It's easy to see how Team Jezza gets paranoid when ITV News makes out that they have lost a future Prime Minister. Who ever thought that other than himself? The story should be how a middling academic with ten minutes of wholly-ineffectual political experience is qualified to run one of the biggest museums in the world.

  19. #4219
    Senior Member niko_cee's Avatar
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    For quite a long time I thought Tristram Hunt was a made up satirical figure and short of a high ranking role at the bbc this seems to fit that imagined narrative quite well.

  20. #4220
    Senior Member Disco's Avatar
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    You're thinking of Tristram Shandy, which what I do every time I hear his name.

  21. #4221
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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  22. #4222
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    I don't think Mrs Brown's Boys is as bad as people say it is, so I must be a true Briton.

  23. #4223
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    It's alright. But then I could just be making myself like it because that's what Clement Attlee would have done.

  24. #4224
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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    Stop lying to yourselves.

  25. #4225
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    Leaving the single market, leaving the customs union and leaving the ECJ

    We are donning it so hard.

  26. #4226
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Brexit means Brexit. In other news...

  27. #4227
    DEATH TO THE WEIRD Raoul Duke's Avatar
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  28. #4228
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    And bear in mind that there is still the £350 million a week to come.

  29. #4229
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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    I wish there was someone in the Labour Party who was similarly-minded to Corbyn but had some charisma and a sense of humour. Is that really too much to ask?

  30. #4230
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    John McDonnell?

    Or Diane Abbott.

  31. #4231
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    The communist sense of humour died with Tito.

  32. #4232
    Senior Member GS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Floyd View Post
    Leaving the single market, leaving the customs union and leaving the ECJ

    We are donning it so hard.
    Hammond has an interview in the German press today where he's tacitly threatening to turn us into a European Singapore to ensure our competitiveness if the EU seek to limit access. Barnier has also acknowledged privately that the Eurozone will require some sort of the deal with the City to ensure the stability of the financial markets.

    Heavy pro-Brexit votes in these by-elections would be timely to continue the generally positive narrative.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boydy View Post
    I wish there was someone in the Labour Party who was similarly-minded to Corbyn but had some charisma and a sense of humour. Is that really too much to ask?
    Bit rich complaining about his incompetence when you voted for him. It's not as if this wasn't always going to be what happened.

  33. #4233
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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    He's still better than any of the other useless twats who stood.

  34. #4234
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    I imagine long term it'll involve them morphing into a shit version of the French Socialist Party, which is itself fucking shit and at the point of death. Well done, Miliband.

  35. #4235
    Senior Member GS's Avatar
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    It's quite interesting reading the reaction to the pre-released quotes of May's speech tomorrow - it's as if they haven't paid any attention whatever to what she's said over the last few months.

    This is also an interesting poll, somewhat torpedoing the myth that the people are incredibly worked up about 'inequality' and the 'gap between rich and poor'. They're not, because they're more interested in the absolute as opposed to the relative. Another win for the Corbyn camp, there.


  36. #4236
    DEATH TO THE WEIRD Raoul Duke's Avatar
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    That seems an extremely narrow range of questions. Something like 'Trying to raise the income of the poorest at the expense of the richest' is closer to the purported consensus?

  37. #4237
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    It's an either/or question, they're not trying to nail down the nuances of what people think, but seeing which they prefer of two polarised options.

    Also 'at the expense of the richest' is a fudge.

  38. #4238
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    Can't believe people chose a 'Would you like a massive pay increase' over 'Would you like a smaller pay increase'.

    I'm flabbergasted. The gap between a Yes/No vote in some poll (Scottish ref IIRC) was about 500 quid a year. THEY'RE ALL COMPLETE BOLLOCKS.

  39. #4239
    Senior Member GS's Avatar
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    I would understand it as a question over which metric is the appropriate one to focus on i.e. whether you care about the relative gap or the absolute level of the bottom X%. The latter is clearly the only sensible metric upon which to base policy. The former, to paraphrase Thatcher, suggests you'd accept the poor being poorer if it meant the rich were less rich.

    @Raoul.

  40. #4240
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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    If we all just keep working at making the rich richer it'll trickle down eventually.

  41. #4241
    Senior Member GS's Avatar
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    More people might have jobs if you encouraged business and innovation, which wouldn't be a bad starting point.

  42. #4242
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    Encourage business and innovation Do they send you the PR booklet for the week? Do you realise how devoid of meaning that phrase sounds?

    It's like Steve Hilton is in the building.

    edit: Unless you'd like to give me a few Tory policies that ENCOURAGE INNOVATION, of course.

  43. #4243
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    It's still true (for the most part), and hopefully Tax Haven Brexit goes some way towards proving it.

  44. #4244
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    How?

    edit: Specifically this conservative government encouraging business and innovation?

  45. #4245
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    Only as meaningless as all the tat Ed Miliband wrote on his policy obelisk.

    That obelisk has a lot to answer for actually.

  46. #4246
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    The remain tears on twitter are pretty spectacular tonight. The scenes when Pret a Manger starts closing outlets.

  47. #4247
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phonics View Post
    How?

    edit: Specifically this conservative government encouraging business and innovation?
    Oh, right. I didn't mean to defend the current bunch of communists (or the last bunch of communists), who I don't suppose really did all that much for it. But 'trickle down economics' is a meme based on nothing, and innovation is clearly more likely to emerge with proper incentives.

  48. #4248
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Floyd View Post
    Only as meaningless as all the tat Ed Miliband wrote on his policy obelisk.

    That obelisk has a lot to answer for actually.
    And that guy is rightfully thought of as a punchline. How is the high bar of Government fucking Ed Miliband?

  49. #4249
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    I've no problem whatsoever with people earning silly money, but when they're paying their staff peanuts while creaming in it then they're taking the fucking piss and we really shouldn't be standing for it as a civilised society.

  50. #4250
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    I've no problem whatsoever with people earning silly money, but when they're paying their staff peanuts while creaming in it then they're taking the fucking piss and we really shouldn't be standing for it as a civilised society.
    Cant wait for you to hear GS' answer to this. It's an absolute cracker.

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