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Thread: U.S. Presidential Election 2016 (Sponsored by Betty Croker's Hamburger Helper)

  1. #5701
    Senior Member Pepe's Avatar
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    And by 'they' I mean Obama of course.

  2. #5702
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    Iranian Nuclear Deal is a completely unenforceable joke that empowered the number 1 sponser of terrorism in the world.
    Iran is?

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    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    It's a pretty pointless definition. First, the likes of Hamas and Hezbollah are designated 'terrorist' organisations by most countries, but are so embedded in their respective political processes (as open standing armies, rather than just IRA-like backroom links) that calling them non-state actors is basically pedantry. Second, Iran-backed non-state (terrorist) organisations run on similar lines are currently doing all the heavy lifting for Uncle Sam against Islamic State in Iraq under cover of the same American air support that used to bomb their safehouses. Third, the Saudis and Qataris have been showering Syrian terrorists with money, so it can't even be true anymore, and why even make the 'state sponsor' distinction when those countries turn a blind eye to prominent citizens funding other people that actually pose the greatest threat to American interests?

    The entire Iranian complex is deranged.

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    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Between him being the most insecure man alive, and the Japanese all being degenerate gamblers, some serious shit might be getting sorted.

  5. #5705
    Senior Member Boydy's Avatar
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  6. #5706
    Better Than You Henry's Avatar
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    Senior policy advisor Stephen Miller did a pretty good impersonation of an SS officer on various interviews on Saturday.

    "Our opponents, the media, and the whole world will soon see … the powers of the president to protect our country are very substantial and will not be questioned."

    "We will have unquestioned military strength beyond what anyone can imagine."

    "It is a fact, and you will not deny it, that there are massive numbers of non-citizens in this country who are registered to vote."

    And laughably "I'm not going to make a comment on that. I don't have any information on it. I do want to say that Sean Spicer as always is 100% correct."

    Trump tweeted "Congratulations Stephen Miller on representing me … Great job!"

  7. #5707
    Better Than You Henry's Avatar
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    Oh, and the National Security Advisor just resigned after 3 weeks in the job and 7 hours after Trump declared his full support for him.

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    Yeah, it was pretty North Korean State TV.


  9. #5709
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Trump is FINISHED.

  10. #5710
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    Quote Originally Posted by niko_cee View Post
    Hasn't he stuck everything in a 'blind trust' to get around that? It'll be a fudge of monumental proportions, but I doubt it'll sink him. His reaction to the supreme court lolling his executive order(s) out of existence could though.
    Pro Publica was tracking filing activity in the legal districts needed to complete the trust. It hadn't been filed on inauguration. Not sure if they have kept tracking.

    The Emoluments clause is broad in scope: It includes any title or item of monetary value from a foreign government.
    Shame we don't have a President who collects rent or hotel fees, or gets tax incentives on foreign construction, or has loans from state backed banks, has brand / copyright protections filed in multiple countries, or anything else on a fairly long list. There might be a violation or at least years of investigation targets if we had that sort of President.

    I'm glad most of the left has finally realized that he is not getting impeached and real investigations are unlikely until the midterms. I think some individual R senators and congressional reps are struggling because there are no good optics for them with Trump. Two years of bad constituent meetings killed the ACA's image more than anything. If the D base stays full Tea Party (who exactly goes to a 200 person protest in Lexington, Des Moines, or Harrisburg on the day of the Super Bowl?) and hubris from safe R's demands that they walk into fights on Social Security and Medicare? Next week's recess constituent meetings should be fun.

  11. #5711
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    The Sean Spicer Show starts shortly...

  12. #5712
    Better Than You Henry's Avatar
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    Trump's in a bind about this Russia thing, I think. I'm not sure that there's much to it, but if the intelligence services have something on him or his team then he can neither tolerate the investigations that are ongoing nor can he shut them down since there are obviously people willing to leak damaging information.

  13. #5713
    Better Than You Henry's Avatar
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    Now we have a large number of tweets from Trump attacking the FBI and NSA for leaking information. LOL.

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    The real lol will be when the next head of the NSA has to work his schedule around his parole meetings. And why exactly do you need to meet with a parole officer again?

  15. #5715
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry View Post
    Trump's in a bind about this Russia thing, I think. I'm not sure that there's much to it, but if the intelligence services have something on him or his team then he can neither tolerate the investigations that are ongoing nor can he shut them down since there are obviously people willing to leak damaging information.
    An incoming member of the administration spoke to Russia officials during a period of escalating tensions to assure them vaguely that the new administration would take a softer stance on a number of issues. Okay, probably shouldn't have lied about it...but...what's the story here? Seriously? Trump got rid of Flynn (a Democrat) because Flynn was always a bad choice and they came to realize it. Bad politics, but it happens.

    Oh and let's not forget:

    http://www.breitbart.com/jerusalem/2..._medium=social

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    The real story is the intelligence community undermining our democracy through coordinated illegal leaks targeting specific official within an administration they disagree with (reportedly because he was going to embarrass them by revealing the secret agreements within the Iran deal). That's what a police state looks like, Democrats would be wise to condemn the entire affair.

  17. #5717
    Respect the point. Byron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    An incoming member of the administration spoke to Russia officials during a period of escalating tensions to assure them vaguely that the new administration would take a softer stance on a number of issues. Okay, probably shouldn't have lied about it...but...what's the story here? Seriously? Trump got rid of Flynn (a Democrat) because Flynn was always a bad choice and they came to realize it. Bad politics, but it happens.

    Oh and let's not forget:

    http://www.breitbart.com/jerusalem/2..._medium=social
    I'd imagine that the story is that it's illegal for someone who at the time was a private citizen to conduct diplomacy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Byron View Post
    I'd imagine that the story is that it's illegal for someone who at the time was a private citizen to conduct diplomacy.
    Except it happens all the time and the Logan Act doesn't apply here. It's a legitimate non story.

  19. #5719
    Better Than You Henry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    An incoming member of the administration spoke to Russia officials during a period of escalating tensions to assure them vaguely that the new administration would take a softer stance on a number of issues. Okay, probably shouldn't have lied about it...but...what's the story here? Seriously? Trump got rid of Flynn (a Democrat) because Flynn was always a bad choice and they came to realize it. Bad politics, but it happens.

    Oh and let's not forget:

    http://www.breitbart.com/jerusalem/2..._medium=social
    Trump got rid of him because it was all over the media. He already knew what he had done and didn't care.

  20. #5720
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    The real story is the intelligence community undermining our democracy through coordinated illegal leaks targeting specific official within an administration they disagree with (reportedly because he was going to embarrass them by revealing the secret agreements within the Iran deal). That's what a police state looks like, Democrats would be wise to condemn the entire affair.
    What's stopping him from doing this now? I'd be surprised if there was anything damaging in it, given that there were 5 other countries involved in the deal, and the full text was released at the time.

  21. #5721
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    The real story is the intelligence community undermining our democracy through coordinated illegal leaks targeting specific official within an administration they disagree with (reportedly because he was going to embarrass them by revealing the secret agreements within the Iran deal). That's what a police state looks like, Democrats would be wise to condemn the entire affair.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame

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    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    With all this Russia paranoia in the air, Capt. Netanyahu floats in under the radar and plays him like a fucking fiddle (complete with photo in that weird gold flat he has).

  23. #5723
    Custom User Title phonics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewis View Post
    With all this Russia paranoia in the air, Capt. Netanyahu floats in under the radar and plays him like a fucking fiddle (complete with photo in that weird gold flat he has).
    If Netanyahu holds on for another 4-8 years I think we're genuinely looking at the end of the two state solution.

  24. #5724
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Realistically, it ended the minute the IDF set foot in the Old City. People just have to pretend otherwise.

  25. #5725
    Senior Member GS's Avatar
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    Indeed. No Israeli Prime Minister is going to agree to give up East Jerusalem, and the IDF would almost certainly win any war that the surrounding states may care to start over it.

  26. #5726
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    On top of which it's just wholly impractical now. There are about four-hundred thousand settlers in the West Bank, and a similar amount in East Jerusalem, so your two state options would be 1) remove them all; 2) leave them and wash your hands of them; or 3) formally annex where they live before anything gets decided. The third option strikes me as the only goer, but where does that leave the other lot?

  27. #5727
    Senior Member GS's Avatar
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    There's precedent for dismantling settlements - they did it in 2005 when they unilaterally pulled out of Gaza. Maybe a balance between dismantling some, and then compensating the Palestinians with current Israeli land in pre-1967 Israel for the rest of it.

    Not that it matters, because I can't imagine they're particularly amenable to it and they can enforce any policy decision they want. It's not as if a UN resolution criticising them matters a fuck given they've been breaching international law since '67.

  28. #5728
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    There were a few thousand of them in Gaza, and hauling them out was the biggest pain in the arse (politically-speaking) imaginable. Where do you even start planning to forcibly deport eight-hundred thousand Zionist headbangers in such a way as not to arouse sensitivities regarding certain historical population transfers?

  29. #5729
    Senior Member GS's Avatar
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    It was, but if it was tied into part of the final peace deal (rather than just wishy-washy 'goodwill' gesture) then you might have more political capital to draw on to enforce it.

    That said, you're probably right. I assume you'd need to hold 'strong views' on the subject before you'd be volunteering to live there, so I can't imagine they'd go quietly if they saw their own IDF tanks rolling in to evict them and bulldoze their homes.

    But as I said before, this is all abstract discussion. I can't envisage any scenario at all which is going to see the Israelis pull back, and I can't see how you get a two-state solution without the Palestinians effectively having to concede the point across the board. The surrounding Arab states probably wouldn't let them either, as a bit of sabre-rattling against the Israelis is the go-to if they want to deflect attention away from more mundane, everyday activities like high-level government corruption and unethical haircuts.

  30. #5730
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry View Post
    Trump got rid of him because it was all over the media. He already knew what he had done and didn't care.
    When has Trump caved on anything because of media pressure? Don't be naive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Arne View Post
    What's stopping him from doing this now? I'd be surprised if there was anything damaging in it, given that there were 5 other countries involved in the deal, and the full text was released at the time.
    Maybe he hadn't gotten access to it yet. It's an open secret that there are plenty of secret and embarrassing concessions made by the Obama administration.

  32. #5732
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    Quote Originally Posted by GS View Post
    It was, but if it was tied into part of the final peace deal (rather than just wishy-washy 'goodwill' gesture) then you might have more political capital to draw on to enforce it.

    That said, you're probably right. I assume you'd need to hold 'strong views' on the subject before you'd be volunteering to live there, so I can't imagine they'd go quietly if they saw their own IDF tanks rolling in to evict them and bulldoze their homes.

    But as I said before, this is all abstract discussion. I can't envisage any scenario at all which is going to see the Israelis pull back, and I can't see how you get a two-state solution without the Palestinians effectively having to concede the point across the board. The surrounding Arab states probably wouldn't let them either, as a bit of sabre-rattling against the Israelis is the go-to if they want to deflect attention away from more mundane, everyday activities like high-level government corruption and unethical haircuts.
    The two state solution is a fantasy and the Palestinians won't accept it anyways. The Arabs should have been less shitty at war or cut their losses when they had the chance. Israeli will eventually displace the Arabs in those areas and remove them or absorb them into greater Israel.

  33. #5733
    Respect the point. Byron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    Except it happens all the time and the Logan Act doesn't apply here. It's a legitimate non story.
    Well according to what I can see, there have been four instances where people were accused of having breached the Logan Act in the is history with one indictment (one of those accused but not charged was Donald himself)

    Seems like a fairly big deal in the greater context of 'what did Trump know about Russian involvement in the election prior to him winning?'

  34. #5734
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    Always enjoy a social media mishap


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    Oh god, this Trump press conference is a train wreck. Still blaming "dishonest media". Ignore the fucking media, you clown.

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    His goggle tan line really is fucking stupid.

  37. #5737
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    Jesus.... he pretty much just said "we are repealing Obamacare... it's filled our hospitals with type of people who shouldn't be there (poor??).. they shouldn't be there... they aren't republicans".

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    Why is the President of the US still referring to the "Failing New York Times" as such? He sounds like a childish little kid.

  39. #5739
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    I saw the article about a Republican judge talking about how he should be impeached. I loved the turn of phrase, when talking about some of Trump's antics, "dazzlingly illegal."

  40. #5740
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byron View Post
    Well according to what I can see, there have been four instances where people were accused of having breached the Logan Act in the is history with one indictment (one of those accused but not charged was Donald himself)

    Seems like a fairly big deal in the greater context of 'what did Trump know about Russian involvement in the election prior to him winning?'
    FBI has cleared Trump and Flynn of any legal wrong doing. Even NYT admits that.

    This is literally a made up story.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    I saw the article about a Republican judge talking about how he should be impeached. I loved the turn of phrase, when talking about some of Trump's antics, "dazzlingly illegal."
    Link?

  42. #5742
    Senior Member Bernanke's Avatar
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    "The whole Russian thing. That's a ruse. THAT'S A RUSE. By the way, it would be great if we could get along with Russia."


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    The guy from the Beeb laying down smackdown on him
    "We can banter back and forth all day, Mr President"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    Link?
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...=facebook-post

    *Former Republican judge.

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    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    The fact that supposedly serious people still ascribe some genius media strategy to him is deranged. I saw that he only spoke to conservative journalists the other day, which is apparently how the Holocaust started. Lads, he is merely the most insecure man alive. Nothing more, nothing less.

  46. #5746
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    So a bitter senile irrelevant never Trumper. At least we have the honesty to have internal opposition among conservatives.

  47. #5747
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewis View Post
    The fact that supposedly serious people still ascribe some genius media strategy to him is deranged. I saw that he only spoke to conservative journalists the other day, which is apparently how the Holocaust started. Lads, he is merely the most insecure man alive. Nothing more, nothing less.
    I mean he was considered a branding / marketing genius before he became president. Maybe the secret to success is to be super insecure and overcompensate nonstop for it?

  48. #5748
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    They have to ditch him. You cannot govern on this. It's been four weeks and he's already brick-walled and lashing out. America cannot take four years of legitimate stagnation.

  49. #5749
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewis View Post
    The fact that supposedly serious people still ascribe some genius media strategy to him is deranged. I saw that he only spoke to conservative journalists the other day, which is apparently how the Holocaust started. Lads, he is merely the most insecure man alive. Nothing more, nothing less.
    Here is a piece on Bannon you will enjoy:

    https://lawfareblog.com/bannon-washi...ompetence-evil

  50. #5750
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    The three week delay can only be explained by the Brookings Institution being an idiotic hivemind.

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