Vettel thinking he can still make the apex there with another car along side him. Taking the car wider would have lost him a second maybe, as opposed to half a minute.
Vettel thinking he can still make the apex there with another car along side him. Taking the car wider would have lost him a second maybe, as opposed to half a minute.
50-50. Each was expecting the other to slot back.
All Vettel had to do was stay left and at worst, he's looking at a run with DRS in a couple of laps' time.
The mistake he made was being too tight in the first place and moving around too much on the way in.
It does make me wonder what his place in history will be. He started like a proper bright, young thing at BMW and Torro Rosso, won consecutive titles at Red Bull but all the fireworks and drama was from the likes of Webber and Alonso trying to topple him.
I was going to bring this up. Barring a dramatic 7 race win streak from Kimi or Bottas, we're looking at a 5-time world champion being crowned either way. This will move either one into equal 2nd with Fangio and only Schumacher ahead.
Would we stack either up against the best of the best?
Vettel will be 31 and Hamilton 34 at the start of next season too. You could maybe see Vettel matching the 7, but I think the two Championships Hamilton has lost/thrown away in the past have cost him that chance.
The feather in Hamiltons cap is that he's won with 2 different manufacturers with good foresight on the move to Mercedes too. Wheras Vettel hasn't come anywhere near yet without being in an Adrian Newey car.
I'd have Hamilton down as an all-time great. He's ridden some of the best and worst McLaren's had to offer. I think he's the type to push 40 if he's anywhere near Schumacher's stats, as well.
I would have Vettel in a box with Piquet as drivers who have probably won more championships than their talents commanded. Piquet at least was a lovable pantomime villain to go with it, Vettel has always just seemed like a petulant twat to me.
Hamilton is the greatest of this era (sorry Fernando) and stands up to anyone bar Senna, Clark and Fangio who I think are out on their own.
So where does Schu fit into this? He won multiple titles with more than one team too
Schumi gets special credit for moulding Ferrari into what it is.
Schumacher and Prost I have below the aforementioned three, and I think Hamilton is pretty much in their category.
If he waits until he's forty to retire nobody will take his rap album seriously, so you have to imagine it will be sooner rather than later.
But now he's found God. All bets are off.
I cant put any legend not from my time, above any legend from my time.
This was an interesting read.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/for...two-years.html
In F1 you definitely can, largely because it used to be dangerous to drive. Imola is the dividing marker.
Yeah it used to be if you went off at a certain corner you could be dead. Now it's just 5 or so seconds of lap time.
I think I'm broadly in agreement with that, Jackie Stewart winning three titles in an era when you raced on Sunday then went to a funeral on Tuesday merits him a spot if not in the top group then very close to it. In the eras that I've watched 'live' Senna stands out as the most talented. Prost had the better temperament and made the most of his opportunities but even in unequal machinery you'd bet on Senna everytime. Schumacher feels like a mix of the two, he had the uncompromising 'fuck you I'm coming past' attitude of Senna but he had some of the nous that Prost had out of the car. Once he had the team around him at Ferrari he was totally unstoppable, and that's coming from someone who without fail wanted other drivers (be it Hill, Hakkinen or whoever) to win every race. Vettel is a odd one, the question over him has always been his close racing ability and he hasn't done a lot to dispel that over the last year or two. Undeniably quick though, and he filled his boots when he had the car under him at Red Bull which is about all you can really ask of a driver.Originally Posted by Jimmy Floyd
Just watching the end of the race, lol at the small timers jeering and booing. Get a grip lads.
My Grandad, probably amongst a host of other reasons, hated me for liking Schumacher more than Hill/Mansell. He had a painting of Nigel Mansell as the literal entrance piece to his house the entire time he and I shared this planet so that put me in the bad books. I was also the only one that would watch it with him so I was still the favourite. I would read the teletext previews to him when his eyes started to go and had therefore earned the right to get more sweets than everyone else.
Prost bottled about five more titles because he was a pathetic French twat - he had the machinery to dump on Fangio's record. In Schumacher's case, I just can't divorce his legacy from all the cheating. He cheated when he came into the sport, cheated throughout his peak, and was still cheating to the bitter end in his Merc comeback.
The trouble is, even if you take away three titles for cheating (one Benetton and, cumulatively, a couple of Ferrari ones) then you end up giving probably two back when you take into account everyone elses cheating. Lets not forget who ran Renault when Fandango won his two titles. The truly shitty stuff (parking it at Monaco, putting Rubens into the wall in Hungary) was ultimately pointless or he got penalised for it at the time.
It's interesting when you look at Vettel and Hamilton's rise through the lower formulas. Hamilton hit the ground running. On his way to the F3 Euro Series title, he finished off the podium three times. One retirement, one DQ, one 12th. Took the GP2 title the following year.
Meanwhile, Vettel won a Formula BMW thing (18 wins out of 20 ... sheesh.) Finished second behind Paul di Resta in Formula 3 in 2005 (four wins to di Resta's five) and then was doing decent in the Renault 3.5 scene (four podiums in seven races) until Torro Rosso brought him in mid-season.
When you put their histories side by side, there's no contest. Hamilton's used to racing for wins, Vettel's been bred for a race seat. Also, Lewis is a legitimately special talent. One that does not come around often.
Last edited by Shindig; 03-09-2018 at 07:34 PM.
Hamilton's drive on Sunday is a good example of why he's the better driver. Had to drive a balanced race, sometimes pushing, sometimes being patient, and he had to nail the manoeuvres at the key moments.
The most spectacular thing I can remember Vettel doing is driving two seconds a lap clear off the safety car in Singapore once, which, whilst impressive, kind of sums him up as a driver.
I'm starting to wonder if Red Bull's system takes talent out of the feeder series too early. The only person I can see as a multiple champion in the current crop is Verstappen. If he'd been given a few years at GP2/3 or Formula 3, he'd have some proper wheel to wheel experience.
Speaking of which Vandoorne has been given the tin tack and Lando Norris is in. Barely old enough to have pubes.
They were forever dead to me the day they binned JEV.
I did lol at the weekend when somebody big time (can't remember who) did a pointed tweet about Vettel and Verstappen, they of the failed moves, having the same mentor.
Somehow I missed that Grosjean had been disqualified from his 6th place finish at Monza.
I think there was a mention of his passing someone under yellows. Had a look at Lando's record earlier. It's not wonderkid levels. Maybe I'm incorrectly looking at Vettel and Hamilton as comparisons but they fiddle with the feeder series too much. Even Verstappen's record doesn't look too hot when you consider six of his ten wins in his breakthrough season came at two weekends.
It's a graveyard. The old drivers hold on to the top drives with the youngsters consigned to a couple of years at the stragglers. And then retire at 25 or go into sportscars.
The guy that got black flagged in the Moto GP today has to be the stupidest man on the planet.
https://twitter.com/btsportmotogp/st...45017383301120
Wtf.
Genius.
There should charges for that rider. Attempted murder. No idea how he can explain that one.
Last edited by SincereTheRebel; 09-09-2018 at 04:07 PM.
I'm not surprised it's Fenati, to be fair. Points on his license and maybe a further DQ.
I can't stop watching it. You have to ve a psycho to behave like that.
I liked Fenati when he first broke into Moto3 (as much as you can 'like' someone from just watching them ride a bike) but he's demonstrated at every opportunity that he's a total dickhead.
It's always been this way though, the best make it and the rest have to make do as well as they can. Same with pay drivers and blatant favouritism in the face of terrible results (good evening Mr Ericsson), it's no worse now than in any era you care to mention.
The difference is there are only 20 cars now and not 26+.
I'm more optimistic than I've ever been about the grid going back to a decent size, our new hamburger overlords seem to be taking things in the right direction. Or in other words the teams are complaining so much about roughly the same things that they must be doing something right.
Caterham's gaffe is probably still in decent shape.
Oh, Fenati's punishment is in. 2 race ban and immediate sacking from his ride. I assume he'll serve that ban if anyone's daft enough to hire him again. Like Joe Kinnear. When the BT Sport guys mentioned he had previous, I had to catch-up.
What a proper, proper cunt.
Last edited by Shindig; 10-09-2018 at 06:55 PM.
He'll go on forever. Surely LeClerc to Ferrari now then?
Kimi in the young Mclaren days was a pre beast. He was one of the better drivers. But Ferrari should have sold him a while ago. He hasnt been good since he returned to the team. I dont know anything at all about LeClerc, but having a youngster wasteman it up over Kimi is better in my opinion.
If Ferrari let them race, I expect LeClerc to do to Vettel what Danny Ricciardo did to him at Red Bull. They wont, though.
Remember when everyone thought Perez was in line for a Ferrari seat? It'll be Mick Schumacher.
Perez is in the Hulkenberg zone of reasonably outdriving his car, but just not quite good enough to make it to the top.
Leclerc is confirmed, or at least I hope he is as I saw him gassing about it on twitter earlier.
I really like Leclerc as a driver, so it'll be interesting to see how quickly I start to hate him once behind the wheel of a red car.
Nah, you'll love him as soon as Vettel complains on team radio about him.
I liked the narrative that Kimi had 'defended' against Vettel at Monza and caused him to spaz it into Hamilton, and that this was the final straw for the suits.
If it were me the rest of the race would have made up my mind. If the roles had been reversed I think Vettel would have won it from that position.
I'm slightly more surprised that Raikkonen is going to schlub about in a Sauber, I know that's where he started (in the best looking Red Bull sponsored car to date) but I thought it more likely that he'd go back to rallying or turn up in jet ski racing or lawnmowers or something equally potty.
Yeah, I'm surprised he's still here. He must be getting something out of it. I'll agree on that Sauber although I preferred the 1999 one Diniz and Salo pottered around in. Kimi's year had a weird white nose which looked out of place.
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