Can they trigger an election? Would it change this if they did?
Theresa May's Conservatives
Jeremy Corbyn's Labour
Tim Farron's Liberal Democrats
Paul Nuttall's UKIP
2 people's Greens
Nicholas Durgeon's Scottish Nationalists
Satan's Sinn Fein
Dr Ian Paisley's DUP
Some other bunch of nonces
I'm foreign, but I wish I were an Englishman
Can they trigger an election? Would it change this if they did?
They’ve said they’ll stay even if there’s a no confidence vote so that’ll be interesting.
Isn't the idea of this to try and force a vote of no confidence, rather than some shitty legislative move to further push back the deadline (how does anything change if the date shifts to Dec 31st or March next year?) - with the gamble being fewer Conservatives will back a move to put Jez & co into government than would be happy to sign their names to some sort of pointless extension. And then, if the government is brought down by a vote of no confidence relating to Brexit, he can purge the unfaithful and fight an election with a clearly defined anti-'the progressive majority' position (presumably in league with Nigel)?
Yep. They want to enrage the remainers enough for them to flap their way into an election, which Boris (by dint of being the only leader with a coherent policy position) should win.
The only problem is if Brexit subsides into a world-ending shambles by then and the public develops cold feet maybe even as late as the last few days.
What odds can I get on us not leaving by 31st Oct?
https://www.oddschecker.com/politics...1-october-2019Originally Posted by Yevrah
1.9 from Smarkets (no idea).
Oh, those are shit odds. Think the bookies are reading it the way I do to some degree then.
I’m far from convinced Boris would win a vote of no confidence anyway, let alone on the back of this. Which is where the whole plan falls down.
I also don’t think Cummings is the genius some of you do, for me, Farage was comfortably the driving force behind Brexit winning.
So I guess we’ll see about that as well.
Hasn’t the simple problem all along been that rank choice voting on referendums with three or more choices doesn’t work? Nothing but a Leave / No will get any result but delay so you have to run out the clock.
He needs to be brought down by whatever means necessary. It's essentially a coup.
The alternative is knocking it back again and again until Farage gains enough support to become PM.
He'd have to win an election where people actually bothered to vote first. Only time he's ever won one is on a single issue vote that only half the electorate shows up for.
He'd lose a vote of confidence, then win an election.
Underestimate Cummings at your peril, that is what remainers did in 2016 and they're doing it again now. They have wasted three years bickering among themselves and now No Deal is a lock unless something unbelievably dramatic is arranged.
The 'lefts' ability to prioritise winning a fight amongst each other rather than their opponent is truly incredible. You do wonder what they could get done if they'd just line-up like the other side does. The Lib Dems saying they won't align with a Corbyn-led Labour but would someone else? Oh yes, I can just see the guy who's seen off two leadership challenges stepping aside because the fucking Lib Dems asked him to. Making their position, Brexit must be stopped at all costs unless someone they don't like is involved? Strong leadership.
I remember when I decided to FPTP the referendum vote and Leave walked it comfortably. All roads lead to Brexit because the Remain side haven't, in the last three years, put together anything to turn public opinion.
Remain hasn't been in charge so what are you expecting them to have done aside from vote against it in Parliament?
You don't need to be in charge to get TV time to plead your case.
All of 'remain' isn't the left. Half the fucking Labour party isn't even the left.
The Lib Dems are fucking Tories.
Also 'Remain' has been in charge. Where the fuck have you been?
Plead your case for what? There literally hasn't been anything for the public to be plead to? The only public vote since was a General Election that was barely about Brexit which they came out the loser?
And all of the right isn't leave, it's why this is all such a cluster fuck and should be dissolved.
In what sense has Remain been in charge?
If the Labour Party had any stones they would just come out for stopping the whole thing and dare the Doncasters and that not to vote for them.
Well the PM, the Chancellor, and the majority of the house of commons were and, in the case of the latter, continue to be on that side of the argument. Leave have only recently got their foot in the door really.
Yeah but the leader of the Labour Party thinks the EU's a capitalist cancer on the people so that's that ruled out.
.. the ... the European elections? The ... erm... the ... thing the Brexit party made big gains in? Are you .... feeling ok?
So we're saying is that for the last 3 years, the sitting government has been working to do the exact opposite of their public statements, up to and including negotiating an entire agreement, presenting that to Parliament (as they were court-ordered to despite fighting against) that was rejected by both Leave and Remain members of the house of commons. It was all just a secret plan to remain? Really?
I don't think that's relevant anymore. He would go along with anything if it got them into government.
The whole thing, from both sides of the negotiations, has been entirely aimed at collapsing/reversing the process (from our side probably through rank incompetence rather than any Machiavellian genius) from the outset.
The election where UKIP, the previous Brexit party, lost 21 seats and the new Brexit party gained 14. What a victory for Leave.
The Socialist Workers Party won a seat too but I don't think it's a sign that communism is sweeping the nation.
Maybe if it was just a two-party coalition with the Scots but I think he knows that Chuka and friends would do everything they could to make sure anything he tried would be thwarted.
How on earth is he going to win an election? And if that's the plan just call one in the first place.
It's fucking deranged Jim.
And I don't underestimate Cummings, I just think most here underestimate the impact Farage had, without which, there'd have been no referendum in the first place, let alone a vote to leave.
Oh and special mention to the Reverend J Corbyn, he's been absolutely fucking useless on this issue for 3 full years.
The remain lot really should have voted for the WA and they could have avoided this reign of terror type scenario currently playing out.
Extremist Hard Remainers. With their dark money and dodgy foreign contacts.
Farage was very influential in a broader sense, and in terms of making the referendum happen, but he didn't actually do the direct winning of it. That required an immense effort to sideline the various bad PR pricks (including Farage) who wanted to make it about them, and boil the Leave message down to something people would buy into.
As Farage's election results show, he has a strong but limited popularity. They needed to (and did) reach millions of people appalled by him.
Maybe if Scottish Labour weren't absolutely useless but I don't see how Labour win with Brexit splitting your party down the middle and not having Scotland be an easy 40 seats.
When he first came on the scene during that leadership election I mentioned to my dad I liked the cut of his jib. He told me that Corbyn used to be his MP when he lived in Islington, said he just surrounded himself with 'advisers' who talk a lot, do little and spent more time on opposing national/foreign policy issues (knowing they could have no effect on them) than the bin collection.
Now he's the leader of the opposition party and he's spent 3 years saying his position is that he could do whatever the other lots position is better. Fucking useless.
I suspect there'd be no outright majority and maybe not even the numbers for a shitty coalition to work.
Or one could say his election results show he's a one issue man that it would be pointless to make an MP. Ergo he doesn't get voted in.
A vote to leave Brussels causing our system to become as split and therefore inert as the Belgian Parliament would be a nice piece of irony.
How many people do you think changed their minds on whether to leave or not between February and June?
The 'leave message'. What the fuck was that exactly?
That many (source).
Seemingly either "We don't like the forrins" or "£350m a week mate, it's on the bus"
Everything will be exactly the same except we’ll have more money less regulations and less immigrants.
Leaving aside that those choices of answers are absolutely mental. I think we can quite confidently say that polling isnt quite the soothsayer everyone said they were prior to 2016 can’t we?
That poll even says the grouo of people who want to leave are almost 50% bigger than the people who want to stay which isn’t really saying anything is it?
If that poll is how I'm supposed to view the election, they converted more people who agreed with the sentence 'I fully support the European Union project' a few months earlier than people who wanted to leave but might not risk it?
They converted more of the don't knows (or don't cares) and enough of the reluctant waverers.
Take back control.
"We need to stop these trucks of paperwork aimlessly wandering around the continent."
It is staggering that Corbyn is still in charge of anything. How long has he been in now? I think he might have even been in when I was still in the UK, or at least not long after I left. That is a brilliant run for someone who has achieved nothing, and has been especially gutless on the defining issue of contemporary British politics.
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