Theresa May's Conservatives
Jeremy Corbyn's Labour
Tim Farron's Liberal Democrats
Paul Nuttall's UKIP
2 people's Greens
Nicholas Durgeon's Scottish Nationalists
Satan's Sinn Fein
Dr Ian Paisley's DUP
Some other bunch of nonces
I'm foreign, but I wish I were an Englishman
Whats the argument against the debates at this point? You could say 'This isn't America, we aren't electing a president' but then Theresa May is going up and down the country in a bus emblazoned with 'Theresa May for Britain' that doesn't even mention she's a member of the Conservative Party so that argument's out the window.
1/5th of the country watched the debates the first time round so surely that's a good thing?
Both the presidential thing (regardless of how individual candidates choose to campaign, we do NOT have a presidential system) and also it takes an unwarranted amount of attention away from actual campaigning. The whole thing is a horror show, spin doctors in the briefing room afterwards, everyone focused on spun out lines and who 'won' (no one ever wins) rather than actual issues.
Debates are television entertainment only, they have nothing to do with politics.
How does it take unwarranted attention away from campaigning? And what does it lose anyway, a good 90% of the country will never see or attend a political campaign rally/event.
You're setting the campaign up to be a pre-scripted soundbite fest on telly instead of anything that involves interaction with voters.
The clamour for them as far as I can see is entirely from SW1 media whose interests it most serves.
The strong and stable campaign sponsored by Theresa May for Britain would be reduced to meaningless soundbites? Can't have that, it'd destroy democracy.
The short answer is that we're a parliamentary system. You vote for a party on the basis of a manifesto.
You can "vote for Theresa May" if you want, but that's not how it works.
You're only saying that because (like me) you're a politics nerd who obsessively follows every story. To everyone else that stuff is mood music at best. They'll pick up their dosage via a (relatively) third party reporter in the paper or on TV news who will present both sides, unless it's the Sun/Mirror in which case lol. TV debates are propaganda straight to the people, backed up by more propaganda in the spin room.
The new Ipsos poll is hilarious. Tories on 49 (-), Labour 34 (+8), Lib Dem 7 (-6), Green 3 (+2), UKIP 2 (-2).
Seven percent. Two percent.
There isn't a paper in the land that does actual both sides reporting though is there.Originally Posted by Jimmy Floyd
From the last election totals, that is:
Con 49 (+13), Lab 34 (+4), LD 7 (-1), UKIP 2 (-11)
Labour are getting fucking slaughtered.
Yep. Seven percent means the Tory/LD swings are safe, with potential for gain. Eating the UKIP vote puts plenty of Con/Lab marginals into the Tory column in England.
With gains in Scotland, it could be a massacre.
There's a line in the Tory manifesto that they're going to scrap the FTPA.
It's almost like the Lib Dems never existed.
There are a lot of Labour held seats where the Labour vote could hold steady (personally I doubt it will) but the MPs will just get washed away by the 2015 kippers crossing over to blue en masse. UKIP aren't even standing in a lot of these seats.
Particuarly up north.
My GP friend has a very low opinion of how the Tories have dealt with the NHS (does anyone in public services have good things to say about them?). He sees it going down the road of heavy privatisation, starting with paying a fiver to see your GP, and eventually everyone needing insurance.
I was chatting to a doctor in February and I thought he was gonna cry when I brought up the NHS.
I liked the debates last time, but the 'This isn't America' argument holds up pretty well for me. Look at the shambles that US politics is. Shouting matches and one-upmanship wins out over reasoned policy statements every time. I for one am not ready for Prime Minister Piers Morgan.
Mate, have you seen PMQs?
It's not a debate on prime time TV with the aim of winning votes in an up and coming election. It's also nothing compared to some of the stuff that went on in the Presidential run in.
The 2015 debates were tragic. The seven way one was balls, and the one where Dave and Ted Miliband went up consecutively in front of a 'town hall' audience (fuck off again, Uncle Sam) was an atrocity. Mainly because of 'Hell yeah I'm ready!'
2010 ones were fun but mainly because of the novelty factor.
Whether they're good or not, they do have an affect.
The 2010 ones were really interesting, I thought. But that was the first general election I was allowed to vote, which probably helped.
They were interesting because of the aftermath. The first one was, anyway. By the second and third, they'd started to handle it better. The parties hadn't a clue how to handle it at the first debate, so you had Cameron embarrass himself with transparent anecdotes, Brown seething at Clegg for not just joining Labour to form a progressive alliance, and Clegg basking in publicity that Cameron should never have agreed to.
The fallout, such as it was, was great as well in terms of the Lib Dem vote.
Last time out the parties were wise to it, which is why Cameron refused to participate until there were so many people that it was a complete waste of time. You'll never have it be anything other than a painfully scripted, damage limitation exercise.
It also means that the left-left will interpret this as the platform for at least another crack, and possibly an even more leftist approach in future. If they can get closer to 2005 than 2015 the lines write themselves.
This Green Party broadcast is seriously the worst ever. What were they doing?
This debate is seriously embarrassing for everyone concerned. Grotesque incompetence from Sturgeon and Farron to take part (the others have nothing to lose).
The media on Twitter are incredulous that May didn't turn up. It's great.
Sturgeon would eat May alive.
Sturgeon has fucked up massively with her second referendum pledge and knows it. Scottish nationalism is over as of a month's time.
Their position is a complete mess. The numbers simply aren't there, and it's actually quite likely that there won't be a pro-independence majority in the Scottish parliament after 2021 either.
They've been trying to row back on it, but the Tory SURGE is important because it makes it very difficult for Sturgeon's "the Tories don't have a mandate in Scotland" to hold.
I saw earlier, in true Judean People's Front fashion, that there's now a Scottish Referendum Party because the SNP aren't pushing for it with enough gusto. You couldn't make it up.
There have been various independence parties popping up for a while now. My favourite is RISE, standing for 'Respect Independence Socialism Environmentalism'. They got about a thousand votes across the country in the last election, despite standing someone in every seat in Scotland, and have since become a truly hilarious circus.
In September 2016, RISE announced plans to make politics more accessible, including regular political-themed dance club events and a new website.
lol at '#IAgreeWithTim' being tweeted by about a dozen fannies.
The Lib Dems are in serious trouble as a 'brand'. Farron would need to go after the election if their performance is as the polls currently suggest - the big strategic decisions have been his.
There was a question about political party leaders born in the 20th century on Pointless earlier. Farron was a pointless answer.
Sounds about right.
It'd end up being Clegg again, which would be amazing.
Comrade Dacre doing his part to crush the saboteurs.
Sturmbannführer Dunt was saying earlier how everyone seems to have shifted economically left and culturally right. No, mate, you've just finally looked up from your mocha latte.
People have only been 'culturally left' because Blairism ultimately sought to shame them into being so.
Classic QT moment with Labour lady lambasting the Tories for cutting winter fuel allowance (for rich pensioners) only to be told by Dimbers that that very pledge was in the 2015 Labour Manifesto. Where do they find these idiots?
Probably a Tory councillor in disguise.
"Kez" suspended nine Labour councillors for forming a coalition with the Tories in Aberdeen, which is the whole point of local government.
I lol when people pretend she isn't useless because they need all the prominent not Jezza bodies they can find.
Thank god for Lord Portillo, perfect antidote to QT.
Only 1.66m bothered to watch last night.
Hopefully that finished them.
I'm voting Tory because I think it's our responsibility to eliminate the deficit by *checks notes* 2015... Wait no, *scribbles* 2017? Not buying it? How about 2020? Alright fuck off then, 2025 it is.
Wait I just saw the internet part of the manifesto. Fuck me. Mon Jez. Although reporting Magics posts here to PoPo could be a laugh?
The reaction to means testing the winter fuel allowance is about as intelligent as could be expected. Labour have gone with 'sick and sneaky', where as the SNP have called it 'robbing Peter to pay Paul', which is sort of the entire basis of taxation. Tim Farron also said something but nobody was there to hear it.
The Greens are running away with it here with the Tories in second and Labour's 20yo gimp in third. I'm in a tricky position here because I want to support Corbs, but at the same time I don't want to support this 20yo nonce.
I'm not voting for that. Fuck sake.
Why would you put him forward as a prospective MP? He must know zero about anything. Caroline Lucas may be wrong about everything but at least there's the base knowledge and experience.
What makes it worse is that the Greens pulled out of Brighton Kemptown so Labour could have a clean run at the Conservatives, and in return asked Labour to do the same in Brighton Pavillion. Labour told them to go fuck themselves (which is fair enough) but then they put forward this bloke? Ridiculous.
By the way, if the Tories did get through their proposed internet bill and what happened with Smiffy last week happened, this site would be shut down and one or more of us would have been under arrest. As he claims he reported posts from here to the Police and they could take the view that it was harassing the mentally ill. At the moment they don't have the power to do that unless you explicitly stated his full name, address and threatened to murder him.
It's an absolute nightmare of a law before you even get to the other stuff.
To be fair, it's sometimes difficult to get non-embarrassing sacrificial lambs for seats you haven't a hope of winning.
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