The Middle East and co (*sponsored by Mel Gibson*)

We all know what's gone down over the past few years, but things may be changing. The Russians have realised they can do what they want now (because what, we might put sanctions on them?) and have tipped a load of equipment, experts, and even complete bases into Syrian government strongholds. By all accounts the Syrians are loving this new equipment, and some Russian foreign affairs bod has claimed that the Chinese have sent a cruiser to join the anti-ISIS campaign with an aircraft carrier to follow. If that is true, then lol at whatever it is we've been trying to achieve there.

It's a shambles on the part of the west. As always.

The Xinjiang crew have no doubt hardened the Chinese resolve.

We (the West) are just soft as fuck nowadays. Iraq has broken us I think.

"The West" could easily wipe out ISIS, Al-Qaida and every/any other group that ever existed, but don't because it's nice to have bad guys as a threat to control their own populaces through fear mongering.

Is that common knowledge or a conspiracy theory?

They couldn't easily wipe them out so it's a nothing statement.

We couldn't wipe them out since it's impossible to destroy an idea, but if we went balls deep we could destroy ISIS as it exists now within a couple of months. We've taken whole countries in about as little time. They're properly backwards cunts. We just have no desire to go balls deep. Imagine the outcry when they started beheading British soldiers live on YouTube?

I'm no military expert, I'm Yevrah, but I think people seriously underestimate how hard it is to invade a country and wipe out a determined force of people.

Fucking lol @ the US trained rebels joining Al Qaeda. That's what happens when you deal with cowardly zealots. The ones that have the balls to fight aren't fighting for a greater good. The others are coming over to outbreed otherwise excellent nations.

Hitler was pretty determined.

What a shit example that took years. :D

Uncle Sam could roll them back into their strongholds within weeks of a proper ground invasion. It might then prove difficult to coax them all out of houses and cellars and stop roadside bombs popping up all over, as was the constant pain in the arse in Iraq, but if you were that bothered you would just flatten the settlements and (literally) take no prisoners. But we're not bothered. Plus we have our 'values' and can't really be seen doing that sort of thing.

It might sound simple (possibly deceptively so), but all you really have to do is kill enough people. It would hardly be unprecedented to just kill everybody associated with a group/idea in the name of establishing a secure state. ISIS themselves have done it.

But that's what I'm saying, I don't think killing enough people would be all that easy to do.

That said, watching uncle Sam have a crack would be something I'd probably pay to see.

Not normally a fan of war, but watching the tanks roll in pursuit of this particular brand of scum would be pretty satisfying.

Me too.

What are Turkey currently up to? Don't they(/we) have a pretty big army? Is Turkey part of "The West" yet? I'd like to see what would happen if they'd go balls deep.

No and it never will be. Are you really this out of touch on world affairs?

I haven't watched the news in years so yes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Multi

"The West" could easily wipe out ISIS, Al-Qaida and every/any other group that ever existed, but don't because it's nice to have bad guys as a threat to control their own populaces through fear mongering.

Is that common knowledge or a conspiracy theory?

---

A conspiracy theory.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yevrah

But that's what I'm saying, I don't think killing enough people would be all that easy to do.

---

Not for us, but the Syrians wouldn't have any issue with it. They have form there. Similarly, look how Saddam Hussein put down those rebellions (that we encouraged and left hanging) after the Gulf War.

We could probably turn a blind idea whilst Assad (supported by Russian ground forces) rolled them over. Trying to support "moderate rebels" is a waste of time.

This also demonstrates the utter fucking folly of stating your support for "the rebels" against an existing regime / state when you have no idea who they actually are. We shouldn't really be interfering in the internal affairs of another country in this fashion. It gets you nowhere, and merely limits later options.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Multi

Me too.

What are Turkey currently up to? Don't they(/we) have a pretty big army? Is Turkey part of "The West" yet? I'd like to see what would happen if they'd go balls deep.

---

Turkey are giving money/weapons to ISIS to keep the Kurds down. It's a mess basically.

What do the Soviets have to gain apart from making the west look stupid?

Access to the Mediterranean and a guy on their side in the Middle East.

In the shape of Assad and a nation that's had most of its citizens evacuated?

Its ripe for an annexing of the whole fucking lot to be honest. Enter Iran. :drool:

The Zionists are as bad as any Islamic threat.

It's a presence, the yanks have Israel up their bums so Comrade Putin wants his own puppet in the region. Syria is a good opportunity to get into a country that (pre-war) wasn't a complete clusterfuck shithole.

And Assad did love to buy a few weapons.

http://i60.tinypic.com/sb7lzt.jpg

Going "balls deep" would require wiping out much of the Sunni population of Iraq and Syria, which may appeal to some, but not to me.

There are other things that might be done, but "the west" doesn't really give a fuck, at least not as much of a fuck as they give about their priorities in the region, which mainly amount to controlling the oil supply by keeping the Saudi's and Israelis happy.

Why can't we just wipe the Shi'ites out too? Equality.

The Saudis chairing the UN Huiman Rights is proper lol. The UN is corrupt as fuck, just as everything else seems to be.

You don't have to wipe them out. You can just repress them. Failing that, I don't see why population transfers are never seen as a practical alternative. It certainty calmed Europe down in 1945 (we could do it safer now as well), and if you identify with your faith/ethnicity more than your country why is getting bum-rushed into Saudi Arabia such a big deal?

I'd love to see Obama and Putin in a 1-on-1 fight (for world supremacy or otherwise).

It's nice to see the Taliban back in the news. Say what you want about that mob, but they're well up for it.

I'd rather not have points for telling the truth so here we go: WELL DONE SAUDI ARABIA.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7f1_1443533612

Hit a wedding in Yemen and killed at least 131 people. Fucking clowns.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magic

I'd rather not have points for telling the truth so here we go: WELL DONE SAUDI ARABIA.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7f1_1443533612

Hit a wedding in Yemen and killed at least 131 people. Fucking clowns.

---

It's much better when we do it.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/gregorydjohn...ike#.uhl1olJle

Mohammed killed more than that at the Hajj last week.

The Saudi Army, recruited as it is from tents and ditches as a means of binding far-flung areas into the state payroll, has by all accounts been laughably shit throughout all of this. Whenever the goat herders they're bombing have got in their faces they've shat the bed and left their box-fresh American equipment behind, so they're probably better off hammering weddings.

The Saudi Arabian Foreign Minister sez: 'There is no future for Assad in Syria. There are two options for a settlement in Syria. One option is a political process where there would be a transitional council. The other option is a military option, which also would end with the removal of Bashar al-Assad from power. This could be a more lengthy process and a more destructive process but the choice is entirely that of Bashar al-Assad'.

Oof. OOF. If it goes up. :drool:

Russians have just wasted 34 civs in Homs.

Apparently they aren't even targetting IS targets, just ABA (Anyone But Assad).

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/9730954.jpg

Here's some Russian 'pin-point' bombing:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=1e4_1443635484

:cab:

Also incredible lol @ Putin telling the US it better not get in it's way, and even more lol @ them targetting the US backed rebels. :cool:

Word from Georgia and elsewhere is that the Russians are pretty shit as a fighting force these days, other than as usual having numbers on their side.

Word from everywhere. If there was an executive with balls in the White House the Ruskies wouldn't be anywhere near Syria.

Russia knows we're (quite rightly) not actually bothered. Why they are is another mystery entirely.

What's your take on why they are?

It's not as if they can even attempt to show the US up by attempting to end ISIS if all they're going to do is drone bomb civilians.

Isn't it the same story as ever with Putin? Showing 'strong leadership in the face of America' and shutting up whatever nutter is bothering him this week to stay in power?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yevrah

What's your take on why they are?

It's not as if they can even attempt to show the US up by attempting to end ISIS if all they're going to do is drone bomb civilians.

---

It will be claimed they're civilians whether they are or not. Unfortunately I don't think the Russians will care as much about that nonsense as most of our soppy cunts do.

It's obvious why they want to protect Syria. It gives them a satellite in the Middle East/Mediterranean. I just can never get my head around why they think they need one of those. They don't need oil. They don't need gas. The Americans are slowly pulling out of it all, so they're not undermining their interests like they were during the Cold War when you could bung a crate of AK-47s to some idiots and cause all sorts of mayhem. What is in the superpower game for them?

You're such a fucking twat.

edit: Out the way @Lewis. I'm trying to have a dig here.

Again, as at least the Saint can see, you add nothing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

It's obvious why they want to protect Syria. It gives them a satellite in the Middle East/Mediterranean. I just can never get my head around why they think they need one of those. They don't need oil. They don't need gas. The Americans are slowly pulling out of it all, so they're not undermining their interests like they were during the Cold War when you could bung a crate of AK-47s to some idiots and cause all sorts of mayhem. What is in the superpower game for them?

---

It makes even less strategic sense as it involves actively annoying Saudi Arabia who helped us put Russia's economy into a tailspin. There is the upcoming great Iranian Hezbollah weapons weapons bazaar for them to make a mint in, but both the Saudi's and Iranians depressing the price of oil and Chinese desperation to secure cheap oil as their economy slows will put a dent in those profits.

You are a historian, so tell me if I am completely wrong. I've always thought that we miss part of what the Putins are up to because of differences in legitimacy. Foreign policy in democracies is often captured by institutions instead of politicians because there are no votes in it. Diplomats and militaries prefer stability and can win the backroom argument because handling Syrian refugees well won't keep you in power. However, one Willie Horton loses you the election. Unless there is an external shock policy tends towards inertia and long term rational strategic positions. The opposite is true for Putins because their legitimacy questions end with grainy trial footage and executions. Leading to politicians capturing foreign policy and pursuing it for their own ends instead of pure national interest. It works ok, until they pull a Saddam and over calibrate.

At least that is what I keep telling myself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

It's obvious why they want to protect Syria. It gives them a satellite in the Middle East/Mediterranean. I just can never get my head around why they think they need one of those. They don't need oil. They don't need gas. The Americans are slowly pulling out of it all, so they're not undermining their interests like they were during the Cold War when you could bung a crate of AK-47s to some idiots and cause all sorts of mayhem. What is in the superpower game for them?

---

It makes even less strategic sense as it involves actively annoying Saudi Arabia who helped us put Russia's economy into a tailspin. There is the upcoming great Iranian Hezbollah weapons weapons bazaar for them to make a mint in, but both the Saudi's and Iranians depressing the price of oil and Chinese desperation to secure cheap oil as their economy slows will put a dent in those profits.

You are a historian, so tell me if I am completely wrong. I've always thought that we miss part of what the Putins are up to because of differences in legitimacy. Foreign policy in democracies is often captured by institutions instead of politicians because there are no votes in it. Diplomats and militaries prefer stability and can win the backroom argument because handling Syrian refugees well won't keep you in power. However, one Willie Horton loses you the election. Unless there is an external shock policy tends towards inertia and long term rational strategic positions. The opposite is true for Putins because their legitimacy questions end with grainy trial footage and executions. Leading to politicians capturing foreign policy and pursuing it for their own ends instead of pure national interest. It works ok, until they pull a Saddam and over calibrate.

At least that is what I keep telling myself when I think "Why are they?".

Mikem taking his 'Best New Poster' tag from the old place and running with it :cool:

I prefer the argument that Saudi Arabia was actually after your shale margins to remind you that you needed them more than the Iranians. Had they been after Russia it seems to me that they would have started flooding the oil markets before they did. Besides, isn't Russia more gas dependent? I did like that theory that the Qataris' involvement in Syria was down to the regime blocking their proposed pipeline to Europe that would have cut Russia out.

I would have it the other way around. I think there are votes in it (or at least the politicians think there are), and whilst institutions in both systems of government have control of foreign and defence policy-making, certainly in relation to its implementation, I would have thought autocracies provide a more stable environment for long-term ('rational' if you will) policy preferences (which can also be a negative, particularly in other areas [economic policy?]). It might just appear that autocrats can use it for their own ends because they don't have to spend months getting it through Congress and watering it down. So this stuff in Syria for example seems to be well and truly 'owned' by Vladimir Putin, but it does make sense according to their senseless wider policy.

I'm not even Yevrah, I'm just mikem. I remember oil prices dropping at roughly the same time we cut Russia off from the US banking system, so I assumed the moves were roughly in concert. However, I don't follow that closely enough to know if I have that timeline right. If we are in bed with anyone other than the Saudis we are not being very pragmatic. For the foreseeable future they will have the power to shift oil prices. Our shale oil is mostly a cyclical boom bust industry that happens at higher ends of the price band. It is not a solution to anything. If it was the US would be run on oil from Canadian tarpits - they have truly obscene levels of oil that is simply too expensive to process.

I was trained as an economist, so I don't really think that our legislative or executive branches set the level of economic activity. The Fed does that, our politicians really only affect the composition. I get where you are coming from on foreign policy, but I think the votes are in the image instead of the details. I think you only lose votes on the details, particularly if those details are put in place. But that could simply be because politicians never do what I want.

From what I was reading I got that the shale industry was taking a bit of a kick-in, but the major start-up costs are all out the way these days, and technology is getting better at a ridiculous rate, so all it was really doing was consolidating things a bit and making it (being a new market and hit 'n' miss) all even more efficient. Ambrose Evans-Pritchard has written some good articles on it if you've got a bit of time to kill.

What do you do, mikem? I vaguely remember you mentioning something in the PE/VC space?

I'm off to read about the shale business. Good night.

Well done Harold, getting up to date on largely no longer relevant economic stories.

That's why you're known as 'Moronics'.

And yet somehow more informed than you. Can't wait for you to copy/paste a few articles about this in a month or two.

I shale let you know why you're an idiot tomorrow.

@Luca

I am the juniorist of junior partners in a privately held venture capital fund. I run the Southwest US region. So I spend a week every month in wonderful places like Albuquerque, Provo, Dallas, and Santa Fe.
@Lewis
Interesting. I know they always used to pop up at a certain price point and then fell off after a certain price point, but if they truly solved the price equation, then they have something.

Isn't the whole point in the Shale Wars that anything below $65 a barrel is a loss for them, hence the cut to 60?

@mikem - that's really cool. I founded a startup last year as part of a competition, and our mentor was a partner at a VC firm, and learning from him has led VC to become an area I'm pretty interested in long-term. I'm a ways away from you, but I'd love to pick your brain sometime.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mikem

@Luca

I am the juniorist of junior partners in a privately held venture capital fund. I run the Southwest US region. So I spend a week every month in wonderful places like Albuquerque, Provo, Dallas, and Santa Fe.
@Lewis
Interesting. I know they always used to pop up at a certain price point and then fell off after a certain price point, but if they truly solved the price equation, then they have something.

---

Provo is pretty idyllic if you ignore the population. Come to Salt Lake much?

How long before a US/British/French special forces unit is hit then?

Iran are preparing a ground offensive to work with the Russian carpet bombing.

Time to leave and see how it pans out.

At least if Iran get involved it's getting sorted out in some way shape or form and there's no reason for the west to get involved.

Either that or it's the start of a new Cold War.

Benjamin Netanyahu told the UN earlier that Iran are looking to nuke Europe and America. Don't go full retard, mate. This was good though.

Yes but the Saudis want Assad removed, by force if necessary. They might be the joker in the pack. I don't think Assad and the rest will win, he'll never be a legitimate leader so he'll just constantly have a divided, warring nation. They need to sort their own shit out.

Geezer on the top left is trying to keep from making eye contact with anyone, because he looks primed to burst out into laughter.

@Luca

Sure, anytime. I'll never be a regular poster due to work and kids, but .... Congrats on the competition. University incubation program?

@ Spoonsky

I'm from Louisiana and live in Arizona - the people could be worse. Much worse. I only end up in places where we have a project running, so I have not been in Salt Lake City for a while. Utah is not so bad, but a strange culture clash. The first time I went I asked why "Elder" was such a common Mormon name because of the name tags.

@ Lewis

You dismissed my last political theory, but I have another. Male politicians with aggressive combovers like Trump and Bibi make for extra lunatic politicians because their delusion that they have hair makes them susceptible to other kinds of delusional thinking. This one I am sure is a winner.

I was in Arizona for about 5 minutes when I visited the Grand Canyon. :cool:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mikem

You dismissed my last political theory, but I have another. Male politicians with aggressive combovers like Trump and Bibi make for extra lunatic politicians because their delusion that they have hair makes them susceptible to other kinds of delusional thinking. This one I am sure is a winner.

---

Similarly, the actual balds (Putin) have nothing to lose because nobody respects them anyway. Nailed it.

These military actions constitute a further escalation and will only fuel more extremism and radicalization. We call on the Russian Federation to immediate cease its attacks on the Syrian opposition and civilians and to focus its efforts on fighting ISIL.

Signed: France, Germany, Qatar, Saudi Arabia(!), Turkey(!!), Britain, and America.

It's hard to know where to start with that one. Maybe with the argument that supporting unpopular regimes 'will only fuel more extremism and radicalization'. Is that the official line now? Because, lads...

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YllyBr_4Kxk/hqdefault.jpg

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34448942

Time to get suited and booted, lads. Let's hope they don't chuck us untrained losers in first.

I'm sure they'll have non-combat roles for engin... Oh.

My colleague was an ex-fibre engineer in 'stan. He was also a gunner on Humvee patrols. :cool:

Bit slow here, but I now understand why Russia are doing this.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34448942

For the lols and to demonstrate that no-one can, or is prepared, to stop them.

Meanwhile, America is standing up to Putin by bombing a hospital.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/04/wo...nduz.html?_r=0

Air strikes really are total shit.

They had full knowledge of where the hospital was, having been repeatedly informed, and conducted a sustained 90 minute attack on it from the air.

Their justification seems to have shifted from the usual "collateral damage" to the claim that Taliban were active within the premises (denied by staff and irrelevant anyway since it's still against the Geneva Convention to attack a hospital).

I'd speculate that the hospital was treating Taliban members and the US/Afghan authorities wanted to send a message that they weren't going to allow that.

Calls for an independent enquiry have been predictably rejected, so instead we get to have another case where the perpetrator investigates itself.

I found this to be an interesting look at the Syrian conflict:

http://i.imgur.com/TieZz93.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yevrah

Bit slow here, but I now understand why Russia are doing this.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34448942

For the lols and to demonstrate that no-one can, or is prepared, to stop them.

---

To be fair, neither NATO nor the US+friends should probably be bothered about "stopping" Russia over a mess like Syria. If we're going to try punching Putin in the nose, best to do it over something the West actually has an interest in.

This says Israel is going to provide intelligence to Russia so it can bash people in more effectively. The Israelis love Assad really. They always have.

And it's yet another shot at Obama from Bibi. Although considering Iran and Russia are on the same side of this, maybe not.

Russian ships hammering people from the Caspian Sea (thousand miles away) is pretty cool as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

Russian ships hammering people from the Caspian Sea (thousand miles away) is pretty cool as well.

---

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=e42_1444222522

:drool:

It's getting increasingly lively in Israel. People always want to declare the 'Third Intifada', but then they're worried about looking daft when it dies down.

It's all a bit like my historic victory on immigration. Being right meant a worse country, being wrong meant not being right.

The Palestinians did warn against forced multiculturalism to be fair.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

It's getting increasingly lively in Israel. People always want to declare the 'Third Intifada', but then they're worried about looking daft when it dies down.

---

The Third Intifada looks likely here. As you say, "lively" is the word.

Erm...apparently Turkey have shot down a Russian jet on a bombing run because it violated it's airspace.

That's a bullshit twitter thing.

The Russian effort continues to be pretty massive. 64 raids yesterday alone:http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...-isis-24-hours

They've really putin the effort.

So...how long before one of these long range Russian rockets takes down a passenger jumbo?

When's your next flight?

:yn:

Sorry mate I wouldn't venture outside Europe. Too tight.

The Kurds are committing war crimes. Ethnic nationalists in settling scores shocker. Wake up, lads.

There's Malware on the site I got it from so I'm just going to quote it.

Quote:

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Saudi Clerics Call For Jihad Against Assad, Russia and Iran in Syria

By Jack Moore 10/6/15 at 5:35 PM

Russia opens door to bombing Iraq

MiG-29 jet fighters of the Russian aerobatic team Strizhi (The Swifts) perform during the MAKS International Aviation and Space Salon in Zhukovsky outside Moscow, Russia, August 30. Russia began airstrikes against targets in Syria last week.Maxim Zmeyev/Reuters
Dozens of Saudi Arabian clerics and academics released a statement on Monday, calling on the world's Sunni Muslims to "hurry" to Syria, to fight jihad against the Syrian government and its Russian and Iranian allies. They also called on Sunni governments to "give all moral, material, political and military" support to the effort to defeat the Syrian leader.

Fifty-two Saudis issued the joint statement, demanding that all able-bodied Muslims from both Saudi Arabia and elsewhere, answer the call of jihad and fight alongside Sunni extremist groups in Syria against Assad's regime and the Iranian and Russian forces. Iran follows the Shiite strand of Islam and is competing for influence in the region with Sunni superpower Saudi Arabia.


"This is a real war on Sunnis, their countries and their identities," said the statement. "The holy warriors of Syria are defending the whole Islamic nation. Trust them and support them... because if they are defeated, God forbid, it will be the turn of one Sunni country after another."

The statement also issued a call for Syrian rebel fighters to "unify their front" against the Syrian regime and the foreign forces.
The clerics who issued the joint statement are not affiliated with the Saudi Arabian government in Riyadh, Reuters reports, although the Saudi regime has been a key backer of the Syrian rebel groups fighting the insurgency against Assad.

Russia confirmed last week that it had begun an airstrike campaign against militant group ISIS in Syria, although later admitted it was also targeting other opposition groups in the country. Iran, another key ally to Assad, has been steadily building up its military force in Syria in recent months, and reportedly deployed hundreds of troops last week to fight alongside the Syrian army, Lebanese sources told Reuters.

The clerics' statement was released on the same day that 41 Syrian rebel groups issued an appeal to regional states to form a coalition, in order to defeat what they called "the Russian-Iranian alliance occupying Syria."
The statement released by the rebel groups read: "Russia jumped in to rescue the Assad regime after it was clinically dead, in order to prevent it from suffering a sweeping defeat. Civilians have been directly targeted in a manner that reminds us of the scorched earth policy pursued by Russia in its past wars."


The umbrella group of the Free Syrian Army (which is backed by the U.S.), the Islamist Ahrar al-Sham (The Free Men of Syria) group, and the Jaish al-Islam group that is part of the wider Islamic Front coalition fighting the Assad regime, all signed the joint statement. The U.S. does not currently list Ahrar al-Sham or Jaish al-Islam as terrorist organizations.

---

What a mess. The Chechens are Wahhabi aren't they? Could see a lot more of their attacks on Russia.

Oh I forgot to mention. It's from Newsweek so reliable, it wasn't malware so to say but you have to register for their site to see the article.

The Americans reckon they have killed twenty-thousand ISIS bods, but the group manages to replace them easily enough. Maybe the plan is to just keep this going forever and churn up the world's mentals.

Military-aged males they mean.

Seen quite a few of them being welcomed around Europe lately.

Turkey have shot down a drone, which the US reckons is Russian.

As you were.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrPY8OCGASY

The reporter, Ayman Mohyeldin, is an Arab-American.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sa2rUsrzlNA

QE

That is a quite excellent hair piece.

Netanyahu's a clown. He's presumably still seething about the Iran deal despite his own security services roundly OKing it.

Netanyahu is a fanatic and a mass murderer. The negotiations that he takes part in are a sham.

I haven't yet seen any condemnation from Henry regarding the multiple Palestinian cunts stabbing people and then pretending they were 'just innocent children being executed'.

Most of the Palestinians killed in the unrest have in fact been innocent.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Henry

Most of the Palestinians killed in the unrest have in fact been innocent.

---

I have no idea if that's true or what you have to back it up, but the same (and probably more) could be said of Israelis.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q60yBQG8XI

Fuck sake didn't embed properly. Absolutely awesome Russian drone footage of fighting in Jobar.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by QE Harold Flair

I have no idea if that's true or what you have to back it up, but the same (and probably more) could be said of Israelis.

---

Of course it could. It's almost as if demonising an entire people is a bit wrong!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Henry

Of course it could. It's almost as if demonising an entire people is a bit wrong!

---

It's almost as if nobody demonised an entire people. Don't you regularly demonise Tories?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magic

Fuck sake didn't embed properly. Absolutely awesome Russian drone footage of fighting in Jobar.

---

You're a Live Leak nutter - did you watch that one yesterday of a drug gang torturing some sap? They cut his ear off and scooped an eyeball out. I didn't have the stomach for it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsLPt7SZj18

http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/...in-west-daraa/

ISIS claim they have an Israeli pilot. If true, can't see it ending terribly well.

This is yet another lol at Saudi Arabia piece worth reading. It would be 'interesting' to see what happened if the whole region fell to bits. Beyond keeping the oil flowing, you would probably just have to call it quits and wish the Israelis luck.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Henry

Netanyahu is a fanatic and a mass murderer. The negotiations that he takes part in are a sham.

---

Isn't that the same logic he uses to criticize the Iran deal?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Spoonsky

Isn't that the same logic he uses to criticize the Iran deal?

---

Maybe; so what?

lol at 'Jihadi John'. I expect they will rush a greatest hits out before Christmas.

I saw the other day that the Americans are against the Kurds 'developing some kind of semi-autonomous zone' in Syria (like the kind they enjoy in Iraq). Get on the phone, Assad, mate.

According to one report that I read, he was "evaporated".

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...ies-kerry-says

That's positive - an agreement for:

A ceasefire between the government and moderate groups.
Elections and plans for a new constitution.
Smashing the fuck out of ISIS.

That means Syria/Russia has got six months to kick the 'moderates' about a bit more.

The Russians outmanoeuvring the Americans again, I see.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...Cameron-terror

It would be interesting to see China get properly involved (as one of the linked articles suggests). They could do with an excuse to project their power abroad and show what they're about, and what better excuse than something like this that nobody can object to?

Remember when GS said we should just get The West + everyone else in the world up against them and it'd be over within a month and I said it would take less than a month for one of them to bomb the other and have it go tits up?

Turkey just shot down a Russian jet that Russia claims wasn't even in Turkish airspace.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-midd...e=news_central

It needs to be coordinated. No one sensible would advocate we all pile in and bomb each other, but it is quite clear that we could 'win' handily if we really wanted to.

Hopefully Russia take time out to lol at NATO meeting in a city completely locked-down because of ISIS. Anyway, this was the serious breach of Turkish airspace. Why bother?

GS is right in that we could mop this lot up with time to spare before Christmas. We won't, obviously.

Putin is going mental here.

I see Putin has taken this well.

A US official is saying the incursion lasted seconds.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alan Shearer The 2nd

A US official is saying the incursion lasted seconds.

---

At max speed it would take them 8 seconds to fly across, but a more reasonable guess seems to be 20-30 seconds.

Go Al-Qaeda!

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/11.../?intcmp=hpbt3

The State Department wheeled out some twat to answer questions about Turkey and about how it and its rebel friends have the right to defend themselves, and the following exchange happened:

QUESTION: I’m trying – I mean, do you think that everybody has the right to defend themselves?

MR TONER: We’ve said very clearly that people have the right to defend themselves.

QUESTION: Right? Including the Assad regime?

MR TONER: No.

Mate.

:D

The whole thing such a fucking clusterfuck. It'll end in world war 3.

Russia has banned Turkish poultry imports because of 'bacteria'. It's all going off.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/...8492064412.jpg

:drool:

'New'

The Turkish president has accused Moscow of slander for claiming they buy oil from ISIS as the fallout over the downed fighter jet continues to escalate with 39 Turkish businessmen deported from Russia.


Bit harsh?

Not really, the US did the same over the plane the Russians shot down.

That's a point, have the Russians forgot they shot down a passenger jet in a country, they weren't actually at war with, less than a year ago?

Deporting successful, contributing businessmen? Why don't they deport a few Turk scumbags? Sure they won't be hard to find.

Are you being deliberately thick to antagonise people or would you like it explained why Russia has kicked them out?

I'd like it explained please.

You annoy the businessman, who was making lots of money in Russia, into pressurising the Government to change it's policies so he can continue to make lots of money in Russia. Normally they will be government officials or people with ties through relatives/relationships with people in power. Why would President Erdogan give a fuck about a few peasants being kicked out? But 38 probable millionaires who could finance his opposition? That's who you listen to.

The quickest way to change anyone's behaviour is by hitting their wallet. Always.

His policy on shooting down foreign bombers invading Turkish airspace?

This is the sort of stuff you do if you've been sanctioned. Won't be effective and just hurts the Russian economy imo.

Wikileaks has released a massive load of Saudi Arabian foreign policy documents. :humb:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jeremy Corbyn

[T]he PM did not set out a coherent strategy, coordinated through the UN for the defeat of ISIS. Nor has he been able to explain what credible and acceptable ground forces could retake and hold territory freed from ISIS control by an intensified air campaign. In my view, the PM has been unable to explain the contribution of additional UK bombing to a comprehensive negotiated political settlement of the Syrian civil war, or its likely impact on the threat of terrorist attacks in the UK. For these, and other reasons, I do not believe the PM's current proposal for air strikes in Syria will protect our security and therefore cannot support it.

---

I'm becoming a right Jezza mark. I posted something in support of him on my friend's Facebook wall the other day and it attracted a load of supportive 'Likes', so I had to clarify it by calling him a communist wank.

You just love the 80s.

I reckon a decent number of the shadow cabinet will go over Syria, which will isolate Corbyn further. Apparently they're SEETHING because this letter he sent to MPs was before the shadow cabinet had even met to discuss it. Top, top work.

Toggle Spoiler

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They're on it today.

This is the easiest, don't do anything and we'll look amazing in 6 months move of all time and half the shadow cabinet cock it up by having their feelings hurt. lol.

I though Hunt had it right in asking whether our intervention was actually needed. What exactly are we going to be able to do that the US/Russia/France aren't already doing?

Get your jets out for the lads.

Germans have just approved military action. Any chance of a stray missile hitting Israel? :baz:

ISIS in Yemen have put a video out (I haven't watched it) where they put some blokes on a boat, push it out into the water, and then bomb it. Waste of a boat, lads. They must be running out of ideas.

My mother has just asked me whether I had seen 'that story on the internet' about a Muslim woman dropping her bag in Sheffield and then telling some geezer who helped her to pick it up to stay at home on Boxing Day. You stupid twat. THIS IS WHAT ISIS WANT!

There are reports that 'coalition' aircraft hit Syrian Army positions, and that ISIS managed to stage an assault on those same positions amidst the confusion. If they're British planes... :harold:

This is interesting. Who challenges Russia to a suffering contest?

Brent at $37 is crazy. I wonder what the floor is. I read somewhere that production costs for OPEC is around $10 a barrel and US fracking sits around $30, so if the goal really is to kill that industry I guess they can push it even further. But then again, OPEC has to prop up entire states with their margins.

That's going to be good news for that curent climate conference in Paris.

This is good on Putin's popularity.

Quote:

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[T]he Kremlin is one of only three institutions that more Russians trust than distrust (the army is at 64%, and the Church and other religious organisations are at 53%). Fully 80% of respondents said they 'completely trust' Putin.

How should this be understood?

Mainstream Western media usually cast Putin's popularity as the result of Russians' heavy reliance on government-controlled television, i.e. 'brain-washing'. But such a one-sided view may misrepresent the relationship between power and public opinion. Tellingly, only 34% of Russians say they trust the media.

---

Mental. It seems them sanctions are working. Twats.

I remember when I did 'comparative politics' in my degree (what a load of arse), Russia and its satellite republics, particularly the central Asian ones, were the only states in the world where 'Democracy' has a negative rep in the populace. They really are masochistic fuckers.

Those numbers suggest that the Soviet Union doing a China would have been the best result for the population. Probably for everyone else as well actually, provided we still got East Germany back.

Well you could see in the likes of Poland and Czech who was up for a bit of ballot casting during, and at the end of the Cold War. In Russia it was more a case of carving up what was left and off we go again. The geographical dividing line must be the same one that means people in Kiev want McDonalds and people in Donetsk want zakuski and a lemon to suck.

http://news.sky.com/story/1605822/ob...raqi-territory

It would be funny if they were defeated and the entire Republican rhetoric during this campaign was rendered null.

So, the Saudi Wahhabi scum have conducted mass executions upon their political opponents, and displayed their crucified bodies in public to intimidate others while at the same time renewing their attacks on Yemen.

Barley a murmur of protest from official channels in the west who continue to support them, of course. But shit is getting real with Iran.

#TeamIran

Go on, lads. Once Syria is sorted blow Bahrain up and troll the Americans.

Thought the Douglas Murray Spectator on this was quite good.

Cameron's response today to that ISIS video was absolutely laughable.

Britain will never be cowed

Until it comes to continuing day to day activities where anything resembling a large crowd gathers...

I don't claim to be an expert in this field, far from it, but it's absolutely hilarious (and not in a good way) watching someone who's probably the least active pound for pound PM in my lifetime (time served vs. stuff done) try and get into the mind and under the skin of ISIS members.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ambrose Evans Pritchard

Most of Saudi Arabia’s 10.3m barrels a day (b/d) of output passes through the Shia heartland, now seething with fury. While global crude stocks are at record levels, there is no spare capacity outside Saudi Arabia. A disruption lasting more than a few days could cause oil prices to spike violently – possibly to $200 or more – triggering a worldwide economic crisis.

---

Shit yerselves and panic buy.

Add that to China shitting the bed and we've got ourselves a cheeky global economic collapse :drool:

Iran is apparently having its sanctions lifted this weekend. I hope they tip those unfrozen assets straight into Syria for a laugh.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-35449107

Fucking hell. Horrible cunts.

Why don't they give up then? The pro-Assad Twitter accounts I follow (heroes them lads) reckon the Islamists in charge have stopped people leaving and nicked all their food, but THE MEDIA DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT.

It was a collective term. Apart from the civilians who, as per usual, are the ones to suffer here. Pity the UN who have the terrible task of trying to negotiate with absolute lunatics on all sides to try and supply civvys, but no doubt it's all going to the fighters.

The government has been making some serious ground in the north since before Christmas. The idea seems to be to close off as much of the Turkish border as possible before the 'peace talks' get underway, and then they can just tell them to do one if they feel like it.

If we let 97% non-European Turkey become European, we're all doomed.

We're not doomed, but it would be a significant mistake given their complete inability to control their own borders, their persecution of the Kurds and their current president's apparent desire to rebuild the Ottoman Empire.

The Ottoman empire wasn't that bad to live under.

Yes, as long as you completely agreed with it or submitted to it.

They actually allowed other religions and cultures to exist and develop as they wished.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magic

They actually allowed other religions and cultures to exist and develop as they wished.

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Other religions had limited freedoms, but non Muslims were still treated as second class citizens.

Not even an "according to Wikipedia" when copying it word for word. :D

I never visited wikipedia.

The Kurds are absolute legends. You've got to think they should have a chance at getting their own state out of all this.

They'd probably just end up gassing all the non-Kurds.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Henry

The Kurds are absolute legends. You've got to think they should have a chance at getting their own state out of all this.

---

Syria is a failed state, and Iraq a borderline failed state. It requires a solution recognising the gravity of the situation in Syria. You're never getting a unified country given aggrieved minorities in what now constitutes Islam's equivalent of Europe's Thirty Year War. Partition is needed, even if the historical landscape is littered with the wreckages of past failures of this the world over.

A Kurdish state would seem entirely reasonable, although one suspects the Turks will vociferously whinge about the prospect of having a Kurdish state on their borders. It would just make it more difficult for them to continue persecuting the Kurdish minority in Turkey.

The government has cut Aleppo off from Turkey (or 'Erdogan's tentacle in the North' as Shia Twitter would have it). Oof. We might have to end up just backing ISIS at this rate.

Air strikes massacring civilians in the besieged towns.

Good stuff Russia. There will be no 'pro-government' population left at this rate.

Biased reporting exposed.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4fc_1454537234

This government offensive for Aleppo is mental. They'll be no one there soon. Awful.

Saudi Arabia offering to invade Syria to fight ISIS (lads...) was good, as was the Revolutionary Guards actually lolling at them.

Peter Oborne goes to Aleppo:

Quote:

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'This was not regime change, it was invasion. And why was it taking a religious theme? Why does it have a beard? We are not ready to replace a secular society with a religious one.'

---

Sounds like a great holiday.

Well that was thoroughly depressing and once again Turkey somehow come across as the biggest bastards involved.

Utterly desperate scenes now with Assad claiming he won't stop until the rebels are crushed, no matter what the cost. Just seen a video of some really young kids running about in rubble after a shelling shouting for their mama. My heart felt like it's been ripped out. Fuck it.

I like how the BBC have described it: 'Iran, Russia and Lebanon's Hezbollah movement are propping up the Alawite-led Assad government, while Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar back the more moderate Sunni-dominated opposition, along with the US, UK and France'.

That sounds about right.

Turkey has started shelling the Kurds.

And the lol EU want them to become part of Europe. It would be a disaster.

Pics coming out from the besieged towns near Aleppo, fucking horrendous. Can only imagine if social media was around during WW2...

Russia deliberately attacking hospitals too.

Well lads, what's the suggestion for fixing it?

I believe I've outlined it before. Support the Kurds, join forces with Iran and tell/force the Saudi's and Turks to stop helping the wrong people.

Let the Russians get on with it. They know what they're doing, presumably because they lost the Cold War and had to wise up.

This article on Saudi Arabia's filthy involvement in Yemen is interesting. In short, they want to run an oil pipeline through it.

Philip Hammond has seen 'disturbing evidence' of the Kurds co-operating with the Syrians and the Russians, which makes him 'distinctly uneasy about the Kurds' role in all of this'. Mate, The Sunday Times interviewed Assad in December and he said the government gave the Kurds weapons, and where did you think they were getting them all in the first place? They can't possibly be that stupid (they are, but my 'This is why you're ineffective' job application was possibly a mistake), so this may be the start of blowing them out for the Turks. Way to go.

Syrians retake Palmyra

Great news, all but ignored in the media because it was the Syrians (with Russian help). This is a major blow to ISIS in the place where they'd done so much to wreck ancient heritage sites.

Sorry how has it been ignored? I've heard frequent updates on the radio and in The Guardian.

It was the main story on the BBC website for two days. :D

Shia Twitter was gloating over the BBC referring to 'Syrian government forces' rather than 'Assad's orc legions' (or whatever it was before). They're loving it.

Yeah that was even on TV news the other day. Think it was ITN I saw it on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

Shia Twitter was gloating over the BBC referring to 'Syrian government forces' rather than 'Assad's orc legions' (or whatever it was before). They're loving it.

---

Do the Shias like Assad then?

They can't get enough of anything that kicks Saudi Arabia in the bollocks.

Well he's an Alawite so... Then again he bombs his own people so...

It's a blow to ISIS's prestige certainly, but it hardly ranks as their Stalingrad.

Speaking of which, the Russians have donned this on every level haven't they? And all for less money than the Americans have spent waging a proxy war against themselves (which I believe is a world first).

Yep. And they've fucked Europe as well with their own throbbing, pink, liberal dick.

They have, really. Even prior to their formal intervention, they ran rings around the Americans on the chemical weapon issue.

The one thing you would say about the Russians is that, whether you like their strategy or not, they've at least had one with a clear end game. The west have, as usual, waded into something they don't really understand, thrown around moral judgements and then watched as said judgements have forced them to try and defend stupid or illogical positions. It's been quite the lesson from the Russians on how to get what you want.

How are the sanctions holding up over Crimea? I see the oil price has rebounded, which helps them but some of the analyses I read a while back suggested they would probably go bankrupt by the summer so fuck knows what the actual state of affairs is.

I was trying to think of a major Russian foreign policy failure post-1941 the other day, and even with Afghanistan you could make the case that they were actually right, so there is clearly something to be said for basing your entire national psyche on expected suffering.

Isn't that what Scotland do?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

I was trying to think of a major Russian foreign policy failure post-1941 the other day, and even with Afghanistan you could make the case that they were actually right, so there is clearly something to be said for basing your entire national psyche on expected suffering.

---

Huh? Russia and Karmal lost big time to Pakistan and the US. Otherwise you're right, but that foreign policy blunder along with all of the domestic blunders led to the biggest empire collapse ever, so it's p important.

How were they right on Afghanistan?

Their empire collapsed because communism is a shithouse way to run an economy. As for Afghanistan, they would have been better letting it rot; but on balance they probably had a better idea of what to do with it than their opponents did.

We got someone else to start fighting a war we did not want. To do it they starved out a city and bombed hospitals in a way Isreal or the US would get crucified over. In the US print media at least, there was barely a sound. Russia and Iran are now on the hook for the cleanup and any resulting insurgency which will take up a good chunk of their mischief funds. How easy will it be to get out of Syria? We are getting much what we wanted except Assad. How much did we really care? It doesn't look all bad.

I have no doubt that the Americans are secretly okay about the Russian intervention, insofar as they can pretend that the danger of a 'hostile incident' with them renders any deeper involvement unwise. That said, the American policy in Syria has been incredibly muddled by trying to support one of the three major factions whilst bombing a second of the three factions and actively campaigning, albeit they've stopped now, for the removal of the third faction from power. This all stemmed from their wading in and recognising the 'opposition council' without having a fucking clue who was actually behind it, getting themselves into diplomatic knots and not wanting to row back from their stated public position.

I don't think Obama has ever aimed for anything other than containment and views the region as a wasteful time sink. If you can't win, then the trick is to not be left holding the mess. Everyone has the same three sides dilemma and the Atlantic stops the refugee issue from being ours.

Perhaps, but if that's the case then you shouldn't go and officially recognise the opposition's ill-formed political body or make a huge deal about "red lines" which you're not prepared to enforce.

His argument (not necessarily mine) has been that they stopped using them after he drew the line. And that Putin is truly weak because he can't just say it - to enforce it he has to level the place.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

Their empire collapsed because communism is a shithouse way to run an economy. As for Afghanistan, they would have been better letting it rot; but on balance they probably had a better idea of what to do with it than their opponents did.

---

I was under the impression that the empire collapsed mainly because Gorbachev eased up on things. It's not like the economy was that much better under Stalin or Krushchev (or maybe it was, I'm just getting to Gorbachev in my history class so not extremely informed).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spoonsky

I was under the impression that the empire collapsed mainly because Gorbachev eased up on things. It's not like the economy was that much better under Stalin or Krushchev (or maybe it was, I'm just getting to Gorbachev in my history class so not extremely informed).

---

They'd probably have held it together in some form if Gorbahev hadn't implemented his reforms.
But the economy was performing better under Stalin and Krushchev. Their system was very good at rapid industrialisation, less so at providing consumer goods and so forth.

I've always had it that they developed rapidly whilst there was still spare industrial capacity, but once they had all the steel they needed they started failing, which was why Leonid Brezhnev had to turn a blind eye to the black market (the 'Little Deal') to keep things ticking along until their oil crisis pushed them over the edge and made those reforms necessary. They could probably have kept going regardless, but they would have either had to give up the Cold War or starve half the population.

I only recently read the story of Boris Yeltsin and the Texas supermarket. That's pretty funny if you've got a few minutes.

http://i.cdn.turner.com/cnn/.e/inter...cle_2_1100.png

:face:

:D

That's superb.

Evidence of why wading in early doors to back "the rebels" against Assad - and compounding it by DEMANDING he step down - was a fucking stupid idea.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GS

Evidence of why wading in early doors to back "the rebels" against Assad - and compounding it by DEMANDING he step down - was a fucking stupid idea.

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http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/multim...97_739757b.jpg

"No problem mate"

I don't even know what that means.

Then you have an incredibly short-term memory.

The bombing campaign was a separate issue, as it was designed to 'punish' Assad for chemical weapon use.

The issue of Assad stepping down being a condition for anything - indeed, the rebels being recognised by certain parts of the international community, no less - was a far more stupid decision with more profound consequences.

The battle for Mosul has begun. This quote from the Iraqi PM is all kinds of :drool:

Quote:

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"Our dearest people in Nineveh province, the victory bell has rung, and the operations to liberate Mosul have begun. I am announcing today the beginning of these heroic operations to liberate you from the brutality and terrorism of ISIS. God willing, we will meet soon on the ground of Mosul where we will all celebrate the liberation and your freedom."

---

US just launched a chunk of missiles at Syria.

And Trump ... delivered ... a speech ... at one ... or two .... words ... per minute.

Shia Twitter was bricking it last night about Damascus being flattened (Iran had supposedly evacuated its diplomats), or their entire air force being taken out, so this seems like a bit of a gimmick 'Don't do that again!' attack at the moment. As for the actual chemical attack, I don't want to get into FALSE FLAG territory, but it seems a bit convenient. The day after the Americans shift policy, and the day before a UN meeting, the government decides to drop some of the chemical stocks it had previously agreed to destroy (and had officially done so) in order to avoid an American intervention on a village of no consequence when it is winning on all fronts and just as the major opposition counter-offensives grind to a halt. Whatever you make of these people, they clearly aren't absolute idiots.

Indeed. You have to question if it was government ordered or not. It seems rather stupid if it was.

It would also be the crappest gas attack in history if it knocks off a few dozen kids. My guess would be some sort of 'incident' occurring as the place was being bombed, probably not involving the chemicals claimed, and everyone just assuming what they wanted to assume. The problem is that once you start to express a degree of scepticism you're thrown in with the 'the Clinton Foundation sold Libya's sarin to ISIS' brigade.

As an aside, I've never quite understood the revulsion that chemical attacks generate. Biological warfare is nasty business, but why are nerve agents worse than being blown to pieces? I suppose there is the slow, agonising death argument; but then why are they worse than the sort of blockade-induced starvation deaths currently being caused by Saudi Arabia?

People in the office looked at me funny when I said that no-one would have cared if they'd just shot those kids with bullets.

It's a pretty recent thing for everybody to be appalled by it. Idiots like to claim that even Adolf Hitler thought twice about using it, but 1) only because he would have got it back ten times worse; and 2) are you sure about that mate?

Hitler being famously reticent about gassing people.

Not a lot about the chemical attack or the response makes a lot of sense.

Why would Assad bother with this now when he was already winning the war and has Russia and Trump on his side?
Why would Trump do a u-turn on this issue of all issues when he's supposedly in thrall to the Russians?

Oh wait, some fo you have already pointed this out. Bravo.

Nothing about the attack makes sense.

This is about symbolism. There are lines you can't cross because America WILL fuck you. I don't know how I feel about it all, but I appreciate us swinging our dick around on the global stage again, I don't see German cucks coming to the rescue of any Syrians / upholding international law.

Are you banned from saying "cuck"?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

It's a pretty recent thing for everybody to be appalled by it. Idiots like to claim that even Adolf Hitler thought twice about using it, but 1) only because he would have got it back ten times worse; and 2) are you sure about that mate?

---

We were preparing to launch chemical weapons at the Germans if they'd attempted to invade in 1940, I believe. Churchill's view was that "we have the right to do what we like with our own territory".

That would have been a moment of supreme national emergency, obviously.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Henry

Are you banned from saying "cuck"?

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...yes, but this was an emergency

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GS

That would have been a moment of supreme national emergency, obviously.

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Whether that justifies it or not, a 6 year civil war is probably seen in a similar kind of way by Assad.

He floated gassing the v-weapon launch sites in January 1944, and there were plans to use it in Japan in the event of an invasion. In the end it all got mothballed until they needed it to poison millions of Vietnamese people.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mert

...yes, but this was an emergency

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Supreme national emergency.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C80s9geXcAIHdCY.jpg

lol he even dressed like him.

Then went on to list every fucked up CIA op they did in Bolivia. I do like when the token Security Council country uses it to lol at the rest of them.

Heroic effort. The NARRATIVE is already in place for the next one. 'What if they just do it again?' Well then they are the stupidest people alive and the entire region wants doing over.

Stupid people I know were praising Trump today. Shows how the common pleb thinks though. This does him good.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Henry

Stupid people I know were praising Trump today. Shows how the common pleb thinks though. This does him good.

---

His base is furious. So you have that as a consolation.

View Tweet

Fun.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by John

View Tweet

Fun.

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It's not 2013 and being flexible to adopt to changing conditions is the hallmark of a good leader.

But yeah.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mert

It's not 2013 and being flexible to adopt to changing conditions is the hallmark of a good leader.

But yeah.

---

What's changed?

If anything, ISIS were stronger and Assad was weaker, it made more sense then than it does now and it didn't make any sense then.

None of this makes sense from any which way.

Assad is doing ok, why authorise a gas attack? Isis are in decline, why give them propaganda? The US and Russia had an agreement (which Russia have paid lip service to) why launch a load of missiles? I mean, at least Russia pretend.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spikey M

What's changed?

---

Annexation of Crimea, agitation in Ukraine, greater potential for conflict with China in South China Sea, effects of refugee crisis being felt in Europe, etc.

A lot of things.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spikey M

None of this makes sense from any which way.

Assad is doing ok, why authorise a gas attack? Isis are in decline, why give them propaganda? The US and Russia had an agreement (which Russia have paid lip service to) why launch a load of missiles? I mean, at least Russia pretend.

---

To test America and to terrorize the local community and deter them and other local populations from cooperating with Rebel groups. It's flimsy, but people can be stupid. I refuse to believe that there is some "Jewish/Neocon conspiracy" within the intelligence community to fabricate evidence (which it's claimed to be is very strong) or deliberately mislead the President.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mert

Annexation of Crimea, agitation in Ukraine, greater potential for conflict with China in South China Sea, effects of refugee crisis being felt in Europe, etc.

A lot of things.

---

Germany won the World Cup. A Brit went in to space. The Rock returned to WWE.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mert

To test America and to terrorize the local community and deter them and other local populations from cooperating with Rebel groups. It's flimsy, but people can be stupid. I refuse to believe that there is some "Jewish/Neocon conspiracy" within the intelligence community to fabricate evidence (which it's claimed to be is very strong) or deliberately mislead the President.

---

Iraq have WMD's.

Think I just found the best tweet

View Tweet

You didn't.

I can only imagine the horror of what passes for average.

You have to respect the art form.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spikey M

Iraq have WMD's.

---

Fair enough. But sometimes people acting in good faith make mistakes, the best you can do is make a rational decision based on the information available.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mert

Fair enough. But sometimes people acting in good faith make mistakes, the best you can do is make a rational decision based on the information available.

---

incredible. You couldn't make this post with a straight face in 2007 let alone a decade after it.

I think rationality went out the window years ago.

The Islamic State have blown the[ir] mosque in Mosul up. The one where they first announced their loser caliphate.

'Going down, going down, going down...'

Which probably means more mentally ill Norwegians kicking off in Europe, but oh well.

Why would they blow that up?

They only hold the area immediately around/near it, so they're just being wankers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAqIFtlH_hA

The White House last night put out a press release saying Assad is about to use chemical weapons again. CENTCOM says they haven't seen any signs of this but that hasn't stopped the UK saying that we're ready to back the US in anyway possible.

We're about to get dragged into the Worlds Dumbest War.

The Syrian Army is about to completely take back Deir ez-Zor, which could potentially lead to securing the Iraqi border, so they either like making life difficult for themselves or the Americans are worried about that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mert

Nothing about the attack makes sense.

This is about symbolism. There are lines you can't cross because America WILL fuck you. I don't know how I feel about it all, but I appreciate us swinging our dick around on the global stage again, I don't see German cucks coming to the rescue of any Syrians / upholding international law.

---

Why are you giving it the big 'un? You do realise a fully united and re-armed Europe would stomp the US into the ground militarily.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

Why are you giving it the big 'un? You do realise a fully united and re-armed Europe would stomp the US into the ground militarily.

---

The fuck? How do you know what a fully reunited and re-armed Europe would look like?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

Why are you giving it the big 'un? You do realise a fully united and re-armed Europe would stomp the US into the ground militarily.

---

It really wouldn't.

It's only a matter of time until we see the Fourth Reich, so we'll find out.

A Europe v America war would be great fun. Let's get it going.

It would be interesting to see which way the Muslims went.

We can be like the Stanley forces at Bosworth. Wait it out, pile in on the winning side and sweep up at the end.

We could reclaim the Angevin Empire, or the whole of France depending on how quickly they surrendered.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Henry

The fuck? How do you know what a fully reunited and re-armed Europe would look like?

---

The German war machine has taken most of the rest of the world to stop twice. Crank it up once more then pitch in the military might of a fully mobilised United Kingdom, the French and the burgeoning Polish army and watch the Yanks quake.

Imagine thinking Europe, a section of the globe full of self-entitled, self-proclaimed kingdoms, nationalists and lunatics, could ever be united in a war. :harold:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

The German war machine has taken most of the rest of the world to stop twice. Crank it up once more then pitch in the military might of a fully mobilised United Kingdom, the French and the burgeoning Polish army and watch the Yanks quake.

---

This is remarkably stupid, even for you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Henry

This is remarkably stupid, even for you.

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Why is that Henry?

I respect your opinion but I'd like to know what you are basing it upon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

I'd like to know what you are basing it upon.

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100 years of economic and military development/divergence.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bernanke

100 years of economic and military development/divergence.

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Harold isn't 100 years old.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

Why is that Henry?

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Because it has taken decades for the US to achieve its current position, with the advantage of a relatively isolated geographic position, a single centralised polity and a conscious policy of not allowing rivals to develop.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

Why are you giving it the big 'un? You do realise a fully united and re-armed Europe would stomp the US into the ground militarily.

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Lol. 2-0 undefeated in World Wars, we would make Europe our little bitch while your emasculated male population cowered and whimpered for mercy hiding behind their feminist woman leaders for protection.

And forget about any sort of amphibious assault, our good ol' boy redneck gun wackos would make the Russian winter look like a promenade down the Champs-Elyeeses.

http://starecat.com/content/wp-conte...se-farmers.jpg

As a reminder: the GDP per capita of the U.K. would make it the 49th poorest state in the US, just ahead of Mississippi. You are poor nation, that would get lol wrecked by a mobilized US, not to mention the cultural deficiencies.

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Originally Posted by John Arne

http://starecat.com/content/wp-conte...se-farmers.jpg

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1. Not a war
2. We didn't technically lose

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mert

1. Not a war
2. We didn't technically lose

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1. Yeah, it was.
2. You got involved to stop the spread of communism... The North overran the South and Vietnam is still a communist country. You lost.
3. Lol.

That should be 'undefeated in five years of World War'. Put another way, as many as France.

Korea was a bit of a fuck up, too. Although they stopped the North's invasion of the South, the US then completely failed to advance the South into the North. Score draw.

They won in Grenada though, good work lads.

I'm surprised nobody's got stuck into his use of "we" there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mert

Lol. 2-0 undefeated in World Wars, we would make Europe our little bitch while your emasculated male population cowered and whimpered for mercy hiding behind their feminist woman leaders for protection.

And forget about any sort of amphibious assault, our good ol' boy redneck gun wackos would make the Russian winter look like a promenade down the Champs-Elyeeses.

---

I think youre a bit misguided son, US is a big decadent mess and the peoples think they're hard but are not a warlike race like those of Europe.you would be monced, utterly into bits.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

I think youre a bit misguided son, US is a big decadent mess and the peoples think they're hard but are not a warlike race like those of Europe.you would be monced, utterly into bits.

---

Get outside of the degenerate coastal areas (who dominate our (((popular culture))) as perceived by those outside our country) and it's a sea of deep red patriots. I'd take a Kansas farm boy over any nationality or culture yall could throw at us.

You're straight delusional. Have fun living in a totalitarian state without basic freedoms, and fantasizing over the sort of standard of living taken for granted by our lower middle class.

Good luck camouflaging a mobility scooter.

I'd take a Kansas farm boy

Mert, 2017.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mert

Get outside of the degenerate coastal areas (who dominate our (((popular culture))) as perceived by those outside our country) and it's a sea of deep red patriots. I'd take a Kansas farm boy over any nationality or culture yall could throw at us.

You're straight delusional. Have fun living in a totalitarian state without basic freedoms, and fantasizing over the sort of standard of living taken for granted by our lower middle class.

---

Kansas farm boy might be right up your channel but here we have real men with farm strength who can pull tractors. If you genuinely believe what you're saying then I think you need a quiet sit down and reflection period. Were talking Poles, we're talking German war machine, we're talking Scotch special forces. Come on now son, US would be horaced to within an inch of its life.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Haystacks Horace

Kansas farm boy might be right up your channel but here we have real men with farm strength who can pull tractors. If you genuinely believe what you're saying then I think you need a quiet sit down and reflection period. Were talking Poles, we're talking German war machine, we're talking Scotch special forces. Come on now son, US would be horaced to within an inch of its life.

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You mean the guys who got fucked by the guys we fucked? Lol. Get a grip. We are about 20-30 years ahead technologically regardless. There's no martial spirit in Europe, in America soldiers are exulted. The only thing that comes close is Turkey, and they are just terrible at everything else. Have you spoken to the average limp wristed European numale? No chance.

Deal with it. Europe is 30-years away from being full third-world status, and inhabited by a bunch of has been losers who are allowing their entire civilization to be annihilated. You are inferior in every way imaginable to the United States of America.

Just pull them out and measure them, guys. Save us all having to read the insecurity.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mert

You mean the guys who got fucked by the guys we fucked? Lol. Get a grip. We are about 20-30 years ahead technologically regardless. There's no martial spirit in Europe, in America soldiers are exulted. The only thing that comes close is Turkey, and they are just terrible at everything else. Have you spoken to the average limp wristed European numale? No chance.

Deal with it. Europe is 30-years away from being full third-world status, and inhabited by a bunch of has been losers who are allowing their entire civilization to be annihilated. You are inferior in every way imaginable to the United States of America.

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You must be trying to wind me up now with this nonsense, good try! There is a guy at my local who can carry one of those silver barrels of cider on each shoulder (not sure if full or empty) and blokes like that are rife in the countryside and would break every bone in a candy ass kansas farmboy's body.

Can anyone explain to me why everyone seems to be against Kurdish independence?

Whether it's Turkey, Iraq or whoever else, no-one seems to like the Kurds, they've at this point liberated half of Iraq from ISIS, they don't want to get involved in anything that isn't defending Kurdish land so you don't have to worry about them becoming a regional power like Iran.

Even 'The West' seems to be against it even though we've been plowing money to them because they're the only ones who take our bribes and actually spend it on what we ask them to.

I don't get it.

Because Iraq, Iran, and Turkey don't want to lose half of their territory, the Kurdish bits of the former two have lots of oil in, what's left of Iraq would even more overwhelmingly Shia (and therefore even more decisively in the Iranian orbit), the whole concept of Syria as a nation depends on not having the different sects being overtly separate (lol), and any hard-won Kurdistan would presumably look to China and Russia for support and weapons. It's a bit of a perfect storm really. You could see them getting something out of Iraq and Syria simply because those two countries could do little about it if they established a state across the borders, but it's hard to see them getting anything out of Iran, let alone Turkey.

It's honestly more surprising to me that governments like Sudan allowed separatist movements to foment and eventually referendums to be held that split their country in two. Nobody wants to lose their territory, right, so why let it happen (assuming you don't give a shit about abusing and torturing civilians)

I dunno, I'd willingly let anywhere west of the Bann go.

I get the broader point but allow seems a bit off when there are over a million Sudanese refugees in Uganda and an estimated three million internal refugees.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by phonics

Can anyone explain to me why everyone seems to be against Kurdish independence?

Whether it's Turkey, Iraq or whoever else, no-one seems to like the Kurds, they've at this point liberated half of Iraq from ISIS, they don't want to get involved in anything that isn't defending Kurdish land so you don't have to worry about them becoming a regional power like Iran.

Even 'The West' seems to be against it even though we've been plowing money to them because they're the only ones who take our bribes and actually spend it on what we ask them to.

I don't get it.

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Stability, innit? They have a bigger claim for their own state than Israel do (probably) but it won’t happen because if you take land off Turkey, Syria and Iraq it will chuck further fuel on the smouldering shithole.

It must be quite shit to be around from 2500 years and not actually have a state.

But that’s enough about Scotland.

how come everyone hates Israel except us? Serious question.

Yes I could google it but you guys know I'm not smart enough to digest all of that information in the amount of time that I'm going to actually be interested in the answer. After a paragraph I'd give up.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bruhnaldo

how come everyone hates Israel except us? Serious question.

Yes I could google it but you guys know I'm not smart enough to digest all of that information in the amount of time that I'm going to actually be interested in the answer. After a paragraph I'd give up.

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Well, it’s a Jewish state and people hate Jews. Why people hate Jews is the next question and I can’t answer that.

The Jews have been hated pretty much throughout the entirety of human history haven't they?

Even the fucking Pharoah's had it in for them.

Through no fault of their own, of course.

They wanted a place to defend and go so the holocaust couldn't happen again. So they carved land from other counties to create it and thus created pure hatred from the Arabs.

I like the whole HOW CAN PEOPLE BE SO CRUEL or WHY CAN'T WE ALL GET ALONG. Well if you bother to do research and look in to history everything can be explained. Not agreeing with the actions but the logic is there, even if its completely ridiculous and warped.

You can see why the Israelis attract so much dislike, and also why they shouldn't give a shit; but there is definitely a Jewish element to some of it in the West. There are plenty of border disputes to moan about, and yet the professional whingers just so happen to obsess over the only one involving Jews.

Isn't that due to West support?

Most of the serious moaning targets Israel itself, rather than our supporting it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magic

So they carved land from other counties

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"Right guys, where do you want your new nation to be?"
"A quiet corner of Cumbria would do nicely, Jeff"

There's certainly a distinctive tinge of anti-semitism in much of the criticism directed at the Israelis.

I really know nothing about that conflict. Still take their money.

The 'rabs are possessive little twats at the best of times.

We have better hats. In Europe, part of the problem is that we never integrated. Not simply because we were not always welcome, but pre-Napoleonic bargain European Jews didn't largely view ourselves as both / and. That is the fundamental question at the heart of the Reform / Zionist movement split. And the Holocaust really ended Reform in most of Europe. All of that history and tension is large avoided in the new world. We've always been welcome here in ways we simply are not in Europe. At least in my personal experience.

There were a couple of Jews at school and they were treated as anyone else was. That said, they didn’t have the ridiculous sideburns or the weird hats. I still remember being shocked as a kid when I saw a barrage of hate chucked at some Jewish kids when I was staying with my cousin for the Summer Holidays in North London. I Just don’t get it. It usually comes from Christians and Muslims as well, which is weird because without Judaism you wouldn’t have either of them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

Most of the serious moaning targets Israel itself, rather than our supporting it.

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If by serious moaning you mean moaning about bygones. Unilateral support for Israel in anything their heart desires is the one political issue that simply does not exist as a 2-sided debate, and if you try to take a critical lens to it you're labelled anti-Semitic. Which makes you think to yourself, hmm, who's controlling the message...

True. It's a bit like how the foreign policy/terrorism discussion gets shut down (largely by the same people), and probably due to the need to take sides in it ('The only democracy in the Middle East...').

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spikey M

There were a couple of Jews at school and they were treated as anyone else was. That said, they didn’t have the ridiculous sideburns or the weird hats. I still remember being shocked as a kid when I saw a barrage of hate chucked at some Jewish kids when I was staying with my cousin for the Summer Holidays in North London. I Just don’t get it. It usually comes from Christians and Muslims as well, which is weird because without Judaism you wouldn’t have either of them.

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I wish we could round them all up and you know the rest.

I think we should have some evidence of Jews having the best hats, the orthodox guys maybe but the little bald spot warmers the rest of you have are rubbish.

These are the best Jew hats.

http://www.peterpalms.com/shtreimel/silk%20coat.jpg

Yemen is going well as ever.

The ex-president who caused the war in the first place came out and said he would ally with the Saudi's 3 days ago. He's dead now.

Given your track record with breaking news I'm going to assume he actually died 6 months ago.

I hear Gattuso is in the frame to take over.

Chamberlain is back and declared peace for our time. War averted.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Mr Hitler won't be as bad as some claim. A healthy Germany is good for all of us.

Them Houthis are hardcore. He must have known this was coming.

President Donald J. Trump recognising Jerusalem as the Israeli capital (complete with embassy relocation) is going under the radar a bit. The Muslims will go ape shit.

Didn't he already sign the 6 month waiver?

Trump just smashes the status quo. It might end up a positive thing to change the paradigm.

Wot.

The Christians are getting on him about it now so expect a u-turn.

edit: wrong thread

:drool:

Recall parliament? Nah. Just bomb Syria.

If anyone asks, France started this.

Well, I can’t see any way in which raining missiles down on them can fail to improve the situation.

You say raining but Russia's anti-air measures are in effect.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shindig

You say raining but Russia's anti-air measures are in effect.

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So raining then.

I don’t know who wrote Trumps speech, but it was actually a decent effort.

Just watched it myself and it's comfortably the best thing I've seen him do.

It sounds like a pretty tame effort for all the big man talk through the week.

It was diplomatic, which is pretty fucking ground breaking.

I just don't get what one set of air strikes does. That said, we either go balls deep and fuck it up the same way as Iraq or Libya or we do nothing and convince Russia to annex Georgia next week.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Byron

I just don't get what one set of air strikes does.

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Apparently these ones are different because they were targeted. Which makes one wonder what the fuck the others were doing.

The strikes appear to have been phony - to give the appearance of having done something. But not enough to piss off the Russians.
Still stupid and obviously unlawful of course.

Last week the Saudis killed a large number of civilians in Yemen with American weapons. And nobody gives a fuck about that.

Watched this recap on BBC:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-43771840

And what gets me there are the (non-Trump) Twitter quotes.

Has Trump effectively managed to turn Twitter into the International forum for Diplomatic communications now? :cab:

How does May get to give the go ahead for something like that without parliament, when she has a minority government?

https://i.imgur.com/Ll4wpJN.png

"Use often!" is so funny for some reason.

I don't think it really is a military term outside of Steven Seagal films and Call of Duty.

Use often.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spikey M

How does May get to give the go ahead for something like that without parliament, when she has a minority government?

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Cos she's the PM innit. Before the Blair/Cameron shite years they never used to go to Parliament for any of this stuff.

There was a pretty lol poll somewhere this morning which had the British public backing Theresa May over any other recent PM for trusting to take the country into a military conflict. Only St Maggie T beat her.

I get that, but surely you can’t be running tings like Idi Amin when you have a minority government? I thought they had to hold a vote on everything and that’s why they needed that mental Northern Irish lot on side.

There is a case for the government being allowed to act where necessary without talking it out, but I struggle to see how adding a token presence to a pointless bombing raid qualifies.

It was about a week after the chemical attack as well. It doesn’t exactly scream emergency action to me.

The PM is head of the executive branch of government which can do all sorts of things without consulting parliament. Whether killing people with bombs is one of those things is another matter.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Henry

The PM is head of the executive branch of government which can do all sorts of things without consulting parliament. Whether killing people with bombs is one of those things is another matter.

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I understand that in a majority Government. I was unaware she can swan about doing whatever she likes in a minority one. If that’s the case, why is having a minority an issue anyway?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Henry

The strikes appear to have been phony - to give the appearance of having done something. But not enough to piss off the Russians.
Still stupid and obviously unlawful of course.

---

"We shouldn't intervene!" ... "Huh, this intervention had no impact. MEANWHILE, ANOTHER THING HAPPENED SOMEWHERE ELSE!"

I'm not even sure what you want.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spikey M

I understand that in a majority Government. I was unaware she can swan about doing whatever she likes in a minority one. If that’s the case, why is having a minority an issue anyway?

---

For legislation, budgets and stuff.

You do understand that the legislature is different from the executive, right? Even if in the UK the legislature (effectively) chooses the executive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shindig

"We shouldn't intervene!" ... "Huh, this intervention had no impact. MEANWHILE, ANOTHER THING HAPPENED SOMEWHERE ELSE!"

I'm not even sure what you want.

---

Eh? I wanted them not to attack Syria. I also want a radical reorientation of policy towards the middle east. What confuses you?

The fact they are gassing their citizens and you don't want any action, probably.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magic

The fact they are gassing their citizens and you don't want any action, probably.

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Demonstrate to me that "action" achieves anything positive other than allowing leaders to posture and I'd change my mind.

What alternatives do they have? Sanctions. Is force not advised in response to chemical attacks?

It depends how you define ‘works’, I guess. I mean, they wanted Saddam Hussein and Bin Laden gone, and, well, it worked. They’re gone.

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lol what's the point?

It's mad how crap Theresa May is.

They're out in force today claiming this and Kosovo are the same thing.

If they are, why has it taken you 7 years to address this 'extreme humanitarian crisis'.

Nothing to see here just an official government saudi account photoshopping a canadian airliner flying into a tower. I'm sure they mean nothing by it.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dj7Eq-HVsAALDiQ.jpg:large

Infographic ksa is a voluntary non-profit project. It is managed by a group of Saudi youth.

Simmer down Moronics.

Nice of the Saudi youth to see the error in their ways and go back and repost the tweets without the airplane in them, I suppose.

Phonics posting fake news shocker.

THey've since apologized saying the plane was meant to represent "the ambassador returning to Canada"

Is that little saying why their expensive army is being donned shitless by barefooted mooks in Yemen?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magic

Infographic ksa is a voluntary non-profit project. It is managed by a group of Saudi youth.

Simmer down Moronics.

---

Hahahaha, good one. The IRU is just a youth project as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by phonics

They're out in force today claiming this and Kosovo are the same thing.

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A slight sidenote, but Trump's been running his mouth over Kosovo now. I don't care if he wants to run the country that voted for him into the ground, but couldn't he go all out with the isolationism and leave the rest of us alone?

MBS fucking up a free run to do literally whatever he wants by offing a journalist no-one had ever heard of is hilarious.

Also funny that you can commit a genocide in Yemen, kidnap dissidents from foreign countries, arrest anyone that says you smell funny and that's okay but kill one journalist and the media suddenly discovers a backbone. Weird that.

View Tweet

The Saudi Intelligence Services are famous for doing things without the crowns permission.

Is it symptomatic of the disregard they have for the consequences that these tinpot security agencies are so spectacularly useless at these operations these days? Or is it just impossible to be fully dark in the modern age unless you're a proper ninja? At least these idiots got the killing part of the plan right, even if they managed to broadcast it onto the internet.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by niko_cee

Is it symptomatic of the disregard they have for the consequences that these tinpot security agencies are so spectacularly useless at these operations these days? Or is it just impossible to be fully dark in the modern age unless you're a proper ninja? At least these idiots got the killing part of the plan right, even if they managed to broadcast it onto the internet.

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The entire Saudi military complex is just a place to shove your most retarded prince.

1 of the 15 Saudi security forces that turned up at the consulate died in a traffic accident today. Specifically the one that can be heard on the audio tape the Turks leaked. What a crazy coincidence. Nothing to see here.

What leaked audio?

The stuff leaked to the Post. Where the ‘I reccomend listening to music’ quote while he saws the guy, still alive, into pieces comes from.

It wasn't leaked to the Post. The Post are reporting it from some Turkish paper. I thought you meant that the actual audio had leaked. Where is Magic and his Liveleak connections....

It does sound absolutely savage, perhaps unsurprising for a country that routinely amputates limbs (and heads), blinds, stones and apparently crucifies people.

With so many links back to the top it'll be interesting to see how they weasel their way out of this. They really need to be erased. [/tolerance]

They still crucify people? Fucking hell.

I know they sort of had to do it, but surely coming out and saying "err, yeah, he died in a fight" is only going to lead the Saudis further down the rabbit hole?

In that version of events, presumably his body is easily accessible and (reasonably) intact . . .

A swift cremation was respectfully provided.

It happens though. You get into an argument and all of a sudden 18 of you are sawing him into bits and dropping him in the back of a van.

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Originally Posted by Spikey M

A swift cremation was respectfully provided.

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I don't think Muslims do cremation.

So they do?

Fucked up. Fixed it now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Boydy

I don't think Muslims do cremation.

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To cover up state-sponsored murder I reckon they’d make an exception.

They don’t do sex outside of marriage either, but it doesn’t stop them using rape as a punishment.

Unless it's white kids lol.

https://i.imgur.com/7fy6cXz.png

This'll end well I'm sure.

Anyone else slightly worried we’re about to do Iraq again except this lot aren’t competent enough to do it with a straight face?

View Tweet

Hang on...

Big up the blue checkmarks suddenly discovering that 'Turkish-backed militias' are a bunch of Islamist maniacs as well. Who knew?

"These will be truly wonderful sanctions, some of the most beautiful sanctions we've imposed."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lewis

View Tweet

Hang on...

Big up the blue checkmarks suddenly discovering that 'Turkish-backed militias' are a bunch of Islamist maniacs as well. Who knew?

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I'm confused at what's going on in this post.

You realize the tweet isn't from a blue checkmark, surely?

The blue checkmarks are all the journalists and think tank wankers who are always wrong about everything.

That's not Donald Trump. That's what I'm saying.

lol at me. :gs:

Oh shit, Lewis donned by Bruh. That's it, close the website down, we're done lads.

Not before we crown Bruh 'winner of the new board'.

End of an era.

https://i.imgur.com/jwKrX01.png

I donned myself.

Slight name change because I can't think of a thread that it would fit.

I just remembered Kashmir is still under an information/communications blackout. It's been 8 months. One of the most famously controversial border states that has had people worried about potential nuclear war, and it never comes up?