U.S. Presidential Election 2016 (Sponsored by Betty Croker's Hamburger Helper)

[Henry]

Jeb Bush appears to be getting desperate, what with his gun tweet. From his point of view at least it has him in the news.

[Davgooner]

He's been desperate for about six months; it's been wonderful to watch and even more wonderful to think of the reaction of his donors after they realised they'd pissed away millions on this chump. It's difficult to pick a best moment, but I reckon the 'I eat nails for breakfast' line is up there, as is wheeling out his mum to protect him after Trump bullied him and crying when talking about his dad.

He even bought Dubya back the other day to stir up the hicks.

[phonics]

He's been desperate for about six months; it's been wonderful to watch and even more wonderful to think of the reaction of his donors after they realised they'd pissed away millions on this chump. It's difficult to pick a best moment, but I reckon the 'I eat nails for breakfast' line is up there, as is wheeling out his mum to protect him after Trump bullied him and crying when talking about his dad.

He even bought Dubya back the other day to stir up the hicks.

http://cdn1-a.production.vidio.static6.com/uploads/262146/images/jeb-bush-to-audience-please-clap-youtube-68c9-640x360-00001.jpg

[Jimmy Floyd]

I thought bringing Dubya back only served to emphasise the vast gulf in charisma between Dubya and him.

[simon]

Trying to pay a visit to www.jebbush.com is rather good. :D

[phonics]

Trying to pay a visit to www.jebbush.com (http://www.jebbush.com) is rather good. :D

In other URL based news

700524066344546304

[Lewis]

'Bernie' daring to write to St. Margaret about the IRA has put me right off him. Plenty of people kill themselves in prison, mate.

[GS]

There's a rather nauseating trend of IRA sympathising that rears its head every so often.

They weren't bombing your home city to pieces, mate.

[phonics]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cbh7-RGWwAAhTWF.jpg:large

It's not exactly 'Up the IRA' is it?

[Spoonsky]

Nevada votes in an hour. If Bernie wins then it's well and truly on, like Leicester's win against City (South Carolina is Arsenal a week later).

[Bernanke]

Bernie's not gonna win Nevada. Not gonna happen.

[mugbull]

Lol, he's done a lot worse than expected.

[Lewis]

'The Donald' does it again. You would hope the expected shambles finally forces the party to burn itself down and start again, but you just know it won't. They will put all the problems down to him and blither on.

[QE Harold Flair]

Fucking love Trump.

[elth]

GOPs only hope is to get Bush and Kasich out of the race so Rubio can run at their 20%. If they keep letting Trump win primaries with 30% of the vote, he's their candidate.

[Bernanke]

Jeb! is out.

[Spoonsky]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O74XDI-o7xc

[Lewis]

http://i.imgur.com/psiq3N5.jpg

Might lol at that for another day or so.

[Henry]

Hopefully that's the last wee see of the Bush family on the national political stage.

[Pepe]

Agreed. It is time for the Trump family to take over.

[John Arne]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6pm0lYytOo

[Henry]

Why do these dickheads always "suspend" their campaigns anyway? Is it supposed to allow for the possibility of resuming them, or is to save face or what?

[Pepe]

I imagine it is somehow money related.

[Yevrah]

What are the latest odds in the race to the Whitehouse?

I'd check, but all betting sites are blocked here.

[Bernanke]

What are the latest odds in the race to the Whitehouse?

I'd check, but all betting sites are blocked here.

http://i.imgur.com/EPxpNO3.png?1

Straight from Unibet.

The Rubio/Cruz discrepancy seems mental.

[mugbull]

More that Bloomberg, who hasn't even declared a bid for the presidency, is ahead of Cruz.

[John Arne]

Indeed. There is not a hope in hell that Bloomberg is winning.

[Henry]

Yeah, how is Cruz so low on that?

I might stick some moneys on Hilary. It's as close to a sure thing as you'll find.

[Rubacava]

Apparently most of the states Cruz is strong in split their delegates proportionally whereas the winner take all states are likely to be won by Rubio or Trump.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/ted-cruz-has-a-huge-math-problem/

[Davgooner]

Yeah, how is Cruz so low on that?

I might stick some moneys on Hilary. It's as close to a sure thing as you'll find.

As long as Trump is the Republican nominee. She's getting fisted to various degrees by the rest. Rubio and Kasich have about 10 points on here.

Sanders annihilates the lot of them. :cool:

[Jimmy Floyd]

Rubio gives them such a good chance of getting the White House back. I don't understand what they're doing.

[Pepe]

Who is 'they' and what should 'they' be doing?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Everyone who wants a Republican to win, and they should be voting for him.

[Pepe]

I see. Well, Trump voters clearly don't care for the party. Not entirely sure what they care for, really. If Cruz dropped (which I don't think he will) I wonder how many of his voters would go for Rubio and how many for Trump.

[Henry]

Rubio gives them such a good chance of getting the White House back. I don't understand what they're doing.

They're being anti-establishment. I certainly don't agree with them at all, but it's easy to understand.

[Pepe]

It is quite lol to hear Republicans talk about slashing government down and whatnot and then be surprised when their crowd ends up voting for 'not government.' Should have thought it out a bit more mates.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I see. Well, Trump voters clearly don't care for the party. Not entirely sure what they care for, really. If Cruz dropped (which I don't think he will) I wonder how many of his voters would go for Rubio and how many for Trump.

Whatever passes for 'party elders' over there needs to bribe everyone bar Rubio to drop out asap, but they don't seem to be as organised as that.

[Pepe]

Cruz always labelled himself as some sort outsider, but he got out-outsidered by Trump. I doubt he'll drop but I guess we'll see. Carson is another outsider and Kasich's votes won't make any meaningful difference.

[Henry]

Whatever passes for 'party elders' over there needs to bribe everyone bar Rubio to drop out asap, but they don't seem to be as organised as that.

Problem is that Trump then runs as an independent. :D

[Pepe]

Problem is that Trump then runs as an independent. :D

That would be an interesting one. Could end up similarly, with Clinton and Rubio splitting votes and Trump snatching the presidency from them. Rather have Trump as president than Rubio, truth be told.

[Jimmy Floyd]

If I were Trump I'd have just done that anyway. He could have a proper team spending a full 2 years building up to the general, he wouldn't have to waste resources and a lot of his political capital on all these fucking ridiculous primaries, and then he could have unleashed his Donaldness on everyone in August and September just as everyone is realising they hate whichever turds are churned out by the party machine.

Might not have quite won, but I'm sure he's mainly in it for the lolz anyway.

[Pepe]

Might not have quite won, but I'm sure he's mainly in it for the lolz anyway.

That has been my GF's stance all along, that he's seeing how much shite he can say and still get away with it. Turns out it is A LOT of shite.

[Spoonsky]

Rubio gives them such a good chance of getting the White House back. I don't understand what they're doing.


Whatever passes for 'party elders' over there needs to bribe everyone bar Rubio to drop out asap, but they don't seem to be as organised as that.

:thbup:

I was talking to Mert about this. The 'establishment' seems to have finally sorted themselves out and united behind Rubio, the problem is that Cruz doesn't give a fuck (he's running as anti-establishment as well) and is not nearly selfless enough to drop out. And as long as Rubio and Cruz are both in it, it goes to Trump, and if Cruz can see out the next month or so then it probably will.

[GS]

A Rubio / Kasich ticket is nicely balanced and should win two key swing states. Rubio also offers an opportunity to cut into the Democrats' healthy lead with minority voters.

[Davgooner]

The wet dream for the Republicans is Trump/Rubio/Cruz going to the end with no-one getting a majority, at which point they could fiddle Rubio.

'Hilary' is a fucking bomb-scare of a candidate and anyone but Trump beats her.

[Byron]

Hilary is probably the most untrustworthy candidate I've seen, everything about her screams 'dodgy as fuck'

The amusing aspect being that there are supposed to be in the midst of releasing emails for the personal server she was using for work business and if I recall when they had the snowstorm they asked for an extra month to release everything :D

[elth]

Cruz honestly believes that he's God's ordained choice as the next President.

The party absolutely detests him, which is why he's so low in the odds. They'd probably take Trump as the nominee before they accepted Cruz.

[Bernanke]

Honestly, it's Rubio vs. Trump at this point. Cruz coming in 3rd in SC, a state he should've done relatively well in, pretty much seals it for him.

Kasich still being in it really hurts Rubio.

[GS]

Kasich really should cut a deal where he drops out, throws his weight behind Rubio and takes the VP slot on the ticket.

[Henry]

Rubio is a fucking nut as well. I'm hoping it's Trump. At least then you get someone who shows their true colours, rather than hiding it behind a veneer of respectability.

[GS]

Rubio is a nutter, but the field on the Republican side is a disaster.

Clinton is probably the most palatable (realistic) candidate left.

[Pepe]

She's Rubio with a skirt (or a potato sack on that debate.)

EDIT:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CWuRXLuXAAINsBC.jpg

:face:

[Spoonsky]

Trump wins Nevada. This is becoming frightening.

[Henry]

Trump wins Nevada. This is becoming frightening.

Why is it frightening? The only thing that's suffering here is the credibility of the US Republican party. That's great.

[Davgooner]

Cruz honestly believes that he's God's ordained choice as the next President.


Have you read the details of how he and his family sought guidance from God to run? :D

[Spoonsky]

Why is it frightening? The only thing that's suffering here is the credibility of the US Republican party. That's great.

That's great, unless he gets elected. And him being the nominee would already be too close for comfort.

[QE Harold Flair]

I really hope Trump wins. Someone who speaks for the ordinary, working class right would be amazing.

[Pepe]

That's great, unless he gets elected. And him being the nominee would already be too close for comfort.

Trump as president > Rubio as president. Will take incompetent over someone who pushes 'Republican values' any day.

[Lewis]

Wouldn't every Trump (or 'Bernie' for that matter) initiative just be lolled out of the Congress/Senate, thereby limiting his potential to fuck things up?

[Jimmy Floyd]

It's the Commander-in-Chief element that I'd find more worrying.

'Mr President, let me introduce General Casey C. Cheesebur...'

'Just bomb the Jews, and the Muslims.'

[Pepe]

Exactly, which is why I would prefer him over Rubio. Bernie would get a lot shit done via the youth uprising.

[phonics]

702564675737681921

This sums up why Trump will win.

[Henry]

That's great, unless he gets elected. And him being the nominee would already be too close for comfort.

In policy terms he's no worse than any of the others. An obnoxious twat who does bad thing is arguably better to have there than someone who appears statesmanlike while doing the same things.

[GS]

Trump would presumably modify his views if he was actually elected and be pragmatic about things.

Someone like Cruz or Rubio is more likely to STAND FIRM on ideological grounds.

[Spoonsky]

Wouldn't every Trump (or 'Bernie' for that matter) initiative just be lolled out of the Congress/Senate, thereby limiting his potential to fuck things up?

People argue that about Bernie a lot, and what they don't realize is that essentially the same thing has happened to Obama, who ran to the right of Hillary in 2008. Republicans have gone so far to the right that you might as well have someone crazy like Bernie to fight them rather than Hillary who will capitulate. Trump would probably be able to get things done with the current Congress, sadly.

[ItalAussie]

Calling Trump a member of the "right" is missing the point. He's not an ideologue. He's a reactionary who has worked out what demographic are most likely to buy his schtick, and saying what they want to hear.

[QE Harold Flair]

Calling Trump a member of the "right" is missing the point. He's not an ideologue. He's a reactionary who has worked out what demographic are most likely to buy his schtick, and saying what they want to hear.

He was on Oprah back in the day praising Ronnie Regan to the hills and speaking in much the same way as he does now. This was back in '88. Interesting to watch now:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEPs17_AkTI

[John Arne]

I don't really understand his point on Japan. Whenever Japan exports anything to the US, it's liable for Import Duties... so they aren't getting away with anything.
If he levies massive duties any importers, then imports will dry up - he gets his way and more products are made in the US, lo and behold, the prices to the end customers double due to massive manufacturing costs in the US.

The US needs China, Japan, South America and the EU, just as much as they need the US.

[Lewis]

Free trade is obviously best trade, but if everybody shut up shop we would all feel it before them. China would fall to pieces in about three days.

[Pepe]

He doesn't understand his point either.

[mikem]

This is like watching a movie from the 80's and seeing a running joke about how the character can't leave the house because you may miss an important call. Context is that in the decade the US flipped from being the biggest exporter to the biggest importer and everyone was complaining that it happened because we had lower tariffs and regulations than anyone else.

Or Pepe is right and uses fewer words.

[QE Harold Flair]

It's irrelevant. The point being made is that he has pretty much always been the way he is now. It is exaggerated and he does bluster, but it's not some big act.

Also, he really does look like the stereotypical 80's man there.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I saw a quite amazing video the other day of him drawing the ties for the 1991-2 Rumbelows Cup quarter-finals along with Jimmy Greaves.

[ItalAussie]

It's not hard to dig up examples of him promoting things like single-payer healthcare or abortion rights in his past. He's a reactionary, who doesn't adhere to a consistent ideological position. And there's nothing intrinsically wrong with that, but it does mean that it oversimplifies the case dramatically to refer to him as any kind of wing.

[Pepe]

In the last debate he said he was against defunding planned parenthood, but he still claimed to be against abortion.

[QE Harold Flair]

It's not hard to dig up examples of him promoting things like single-payer healthcare or abortion rights in his past. He's a reactionary, who doesn't adhere to a consistent ideological position. And there's nothing intrinsically wrong with that, but it does mean that it oversimplifies the case dramatically to refer to him as any kind of wing.

I think I prefer someone who doesn't adhere to a consistent, ideological position. You may be right though, I'm not all right wing.

[Lewis]

Good article (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trump-is-the-gops-frankenstein-monster-now-hes-strong-enough-to-destroy-the-party/2016/02/25/3e443f28-dbc1-11e5-925f-1d10062cc82d_story.html?postshare=8701456428113518&tid=ss_tw) (developing Pepe's cartoon from a coupe of pages ago) on the Republican Party and President Trump:


Let’s be clear: Trump is no fluke. Nor is he hijacking the Republican Party or the conservative movement, if there is such a thing. He is, rather, the party’s creation, its Frankenstein monster, brought to life by the party, fed by the party and now made strong enough to destroy its maker.

Start focus-grouping names for the replacement. The Free Soil Party was probably too metropolitan, and the American Party had an unfortunate nickname, so what about the Conservative Party? The Conservative and Unionist Party if they want a nod towards Abraham Lincoln.

[Toby]

What's likely to happen with the House and Senate? I can't find any info on polling for that. Are the Democrats likely to take back some control there?

[Spoonsky]

In the last debate he said he was against defunding planned parenthood, but he still claimed to be against abortion.

Not sure you can criticize him for that, that's actually a really sensible view. Loads of people are against abortion, the problem is that abortion is only ~5% of the services that Planned Parenthood provides, and so when you defund that you're also defunding accessible birth control, etc - which will lead ultimately to more abortions. It's a pretty moderate view to be against abortion but not against defunding Planned Parenthood.

[Pepe]

I don't criticize him, at all. Just shows how ridiculous the rest are and how he is not that in-line with The Party.

[Spoonsky]

Gotcha.

For once I'm not interested in the Republican debate tonight. Maybe it was Poor Jeb that kept pulling me back.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-McIdVuY88

[Pepe]

First few minutes where tremendous entertainment. Hard to believe that this is an actual debate involving presidential candidates. Simply surreal.

[Pepe]

Texas. :drool:

Good to see Rubio getting into the mud with Trump. Zero class on that man.

[ItalAussie]

Trump is getting worked over in this debate. Rubio and Cruz have both gone after him, and he's struggling to deal with it.

[QE Harold Flair]

Trump is running riot here.

[Pepe]

Trump is getting worked over in this debate. Rubio and Cruz have both gone after him, and he's struggling to deal with it.

They got a few blows in but when it comes to Maurying a debate he dons them easily. Pathetic to see 'serious' politicians stoop down to that level.

[ItalAussie]

Yeah, I was just coming here to note that Trump pulled it back in the part of the debate after I posted that.

It's going to be one hell of an election.

[John Arne]

Anyone know which network hosted the latest debate?

https://gyazo.com/fc2be1c63daaa970507b1df85fa9c6e0.png

[Byron]

Can't be sure mate, give us a clue.

[Pepe]

Trump saying he's being audited because he is a Christian. :D

[Henry]

How is he proposing to force the Mexicans to pay for his wall again?

Especially since there are engineers saying it's impossible.

[Toby]

702996522711920641

[John Arne]

How is he proposing to force the Mexicans to pay for his wall again?

Especially since there are engineers saying it's impossible.

Yeah, I don't get this either. If the US wants the wall.. the US should pay for it. Good luck trying to bully another country into building a wall they don't want.

[Lewis]

It's a wall. How 'impossible' can it be to build? Unless it means politically, since it will presumably cost a lot of whatever Mexicans use as money.

[Toby]

703269684162867200

[Jimmy Floyd]

702996522711920641

And he does that face - the only face he does - which I saw brilliantly described on twitter as 'I like lasagne, but it's not what I ordered'.

[Dquincy]

Donald's daughter is tidy...nice fakies.

http://gonetworth.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/ivanka-trump-net-worth1.jpg
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/pc/Ivanka+Trump+shows+off+killer+curves+arrives+svISZ zvqlwsx.jpg

And you can't leave out the awkward family photo...

https://pmchollywoodlife.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/donald-ivanka-trump-throwback-photo-lead-11.jpg?w=600

[Disco]

Why are those stone parrots humping?

[Dquincy]

:D

[Lewis]

Chris Christie appears to have taken that Marco Rubio spat rather too personally.

[Pepe]

Aiming for vice-presidency maybe? Fuck knows.

[elth]

What's likely to happen with the House and Senate? I can't find any info on polling for that. Are the Democrats likely to take back some control there?

Not in the House. The Republicans have essentially gerrymandered House districts to the point that Democrats can't win it without the GOP collapsing entirely.

They can get back to 50/50 or marginal control of the Senate if they can get a big turnout, though.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The Trump 'campaign' is so batshit ridiculous that it wouldn't surprise me if the next big endorsement came from Bonnie Greer.

[Bernanke]

http://i.imgur.com/ZVZS9aj.gif

Don.

[Shindig]

Trump in a time of national crisis would be fun to watch.

[GS]

He is actually brilliant to watch.

I almost hope he wins, just to see what happens.

[Disco]

It would be worth it just to see Marine One fuck with that barnet.

[Davgooner]

And you can't leave out the awkward family photo...


Or the fact that he said he'd probably be dating her if she wasn't his daughter.

I see Hillary has finally been forced to confront the 'super-predator' thing. Several polls now have Sanders ahead decently nationally, which is fucking incredible whatever happens.

[Dquincy]

He is actually brilliant to watch.

I almost hope he wins, just to see what happens.

Agreed, he's hilarious. Trump for President.

[Shindig]

"Trump's latest wall, fence, partition proposal has been blocked by the house."

[Dquincy]

Donald Trump's wife. I would.


https://surgeryvip.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/MelaniaPre-293x416.jpg

http://cdn.buzzpo.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Breast-Cancer-Research-Foundation-Annual-Hot-n9vCGyKDoj3x.jpg

http://freebeacon.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/trump77.jpg

[randomlegend]

You'd think with a few billion knocking around you'd be able to afford a better makeup 'artist' than whoever's done it in that second picture.

The colour of those cheeks, for fuck's sake.

[Dquincy]

You'd think with a few billion knocking around you'd be able to afford a better makeup 'artist' than whoever's done it in that second picture.

The colour of those cheeks, for fuck's sake.

I'm too busy looking at her chest cheeks.

[Lewis]

It was fun whilst it lasted, 'Bernie'. Let that be a lesson, Spoon. Never get excited about anything.

[Toby]

Why are black voters opting so resoundingly for Clinton over Sanders? Everywhere I've read gives it the "as expected" when highlighting the 80-20 split of votes from that demographic but I've not seen anything in her campaigning that would explain it.

[Jimmy Floyd]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/why-black-voters-remain-in-hillary-clintons-corner/2016/02/25/7a86100a-da7d-11e5-81ae-7491b9b9e7df_story.html

Goodish article on it, although the race thing over there is far, far beyond my comprehension. They don't seem to have moved on very far from about 1875 in some respects.

[Lewis]

In other words, she's lied to them as well? Great.

[Spoonsky]

It was fun whilst it lasted, 'Bernie'. Let that be a lesson, Spoon. Never get excited about anything.

He won't win, probably, although this result comes as a surprise to nobody ('Super Tuesday' is the big one). I see him now as sort of liberal Barry Goldwater - he's politicized a lot of people who wouldn't otherwise have been, young people support him overwhelmingly, and he's shown that even after Citizens United it's possible to run a viable campaign without giving in to moneyed interests. He's already changed the Democratic Party a lot, I hope. It won't surprise me at all if in a decade or two we see a younger, better candidate fulfill his dream, just like Reagan fulfilled Goldwater's - and to that end all the volunteering and stuff has been worth it, because every day that he's a competitive candidate is a day for more people to learn about him. That's also why I think he'll keep running even when it will seem hopeless.


Why are black voters opting so resoundingly for Clinton over Sanders? Everywhere I've read gives it the "as expected" when highlighting the 80-20 split of votes from that demographic but I've not seen anything in her campaigning that would explain it.

This (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/25/opinion/campaign-stops/clinton-sanders-and-southern-voters.html?_r=0) was a good article about it. That and, as Jimmy and Lewis have said, she's better at talking than he is.

[Lewis]

Either that or he basically did well by default, and had there been a more 'credible' (in the wanky electoral sense) alternative to 'Hillary' he would have tanked. I bet if it had only been Mitt Romney and Ron Paul in 2008/12 the latter would have picked up a healthy number of youth and weirdos before being crushed.

Barry Goldwater. :drool:

[Pepe]

O'Malley was 'credible.'

[Pepe]

Also, that the 'black vote' is what going to give Clinton the win is seriously lol. What a country.

[Boydy]

What she says is essentially identity politics wank. It doesn't change anything. Fuck that.

[Boydy]

Although maybe she'll talk her Wall Street donors into giving jobs to a few more token black people. Balance up those boardrooms!

[Spoonsky]

Either that or he basically did well by default, and had there been a more 'credible' (in the wanky electoral sense) alternative to 'Hillary' he would have tanked. I bet if it had only been Mitt Romney and Ron Paul in 2008/12 the latter would have picked up a healthy number of youth and weirdos before being crushed.

Barry Goldwater. :drool:

That's true, maybe. Obama would've definitely won a third term (and fuck term limits, by the way. Haters gonna hate), but if Sanders hadn't run, would O'Malley have done well by default?

There was an interesting piece in the New Yorker a few months ago talking about the missing generation of Democrats who became Republicans during the Reagan era. It said that Democrats in Washington are basically a bunch of old geezers and their Millennial interns. O'Malley was the only viable candidate in his 40s or 50s, and he was a bust.

[Spoonsky]

What she says is essentially identity politics wank. It doesn't change anything. Fuck that.

Nah, what she says is alright, it's just that there's also the fact that she shares a fair amount of responsibility for the War on Crime and the mass incarceration of blacks in this country. Which people seem to forget very easily.

I'd have the two as fairly equal on issues of color. She speaks better and more convincingly about it, he has the slightly better track record. I just wish the support were more even as well.

[Pepe]

That ignores the fact that his proposed policies, whether economic or regarding criminal justice, would benefit the black community the most, but they dont seem to care for that, they really want their issues to be treated completely separately. Which is ok I suppose.

[QE Harold Flair]

Nah, what she says is alright, it's just that there's also the fact that she shares a fair amount of responsibility for the War on Crime and the mass incarceration of blacks in this country. Which people seem to forget very easily.

I'd have the two as fairly equal on issues of color. She speaks better and more convincingly about it, he has the slightly better track record. I just wish the support were more even as well.

I can think of someone else responsible for the mass incarceration of blacks.

[QE Harold Flair]

That ignores the fact that his proposed policies, whether economic or regarding criminal justice, would benefit the black community the most, but they dont seem to care for that, they really want their issues to be treated completely separately. Which is ok I suppose.

Sounds like the KKK.

[Lewis]

Martin O'Malley is a gimp, and he doesn't have the 'Bernie' schtick of having been moaning about everything for forty years, so if you're after an alternative you go with the most obvious contrast. He was like Rick Perry if 'Bernie' was Ron Paul. That Elizabeth Warren might have thrown some confusion into things, not least the 'Hillary' platform of voting for a vagina.

[Pepe]

Can't help but think that Warren is a 'flavour of the month' personality. I guess we'll see in eight years.

EDIT: 'It's not that I don't like universal healthcare etc. If it was Warren I would vote for her.' 'I have no issue with her being a woman. If it was Warren I would vote for her.'

[mikem]

Toby
Jimmy and Spoonsky's articles are great and when combined hit the mark. Sanders has huge optics problems where I am from (I think you call it the Deep South) among the non-university liberal crowd both white and black. My mom calls Bernie a "civil rights carpetbagger." White northerners tell us he has this great track record on civil rights, but then why don't any of the people involved in the struggle for the last fifty years know who he is? There is a massive disconnect and politics are retail.

His supporters (not Spoonsky or Pepe) are worse. They continually come off as lecturing African Americans (and Southerners) as not knowing or understanding the issues in their own community. After the South Carolina shooting there was once again the call of guns, guns, guns. However, groups there wanted to talk about the legacy of the Civil War and Jim Crow. Invariably, the discussion shifts to groups falling for identity / victim politics and them being too stupid to understand. Down south we scratch are heads and think - if you only listened for once we could tell you between 10-40 churches and synagogues get attacked a year. And no, it is not GUUUUNs because the vast majority are firebombed. I'm not saying Bernie is bad but he has huge perception problems and people go with who is perceived to be listening to them.

[Lewis]

White northerners tell us he has this great track record on civil rights, but then why don't any of the people involved in the struggle for the last fifty years know who he is?

That's interesting. Have his supporters tried to make out that he was a much more significant figure than he was? If so, wouldn't it have just been enough to say he did his youthful bit and supported it as best he could being a nobody? It's a bit like (or not like if 'Bernie' himself hasn't encouraged it) the Marco Rubio origin story. Isn't it enough that he was the son of immigrants and has clearly done quite well for himself? You've already got THE AMERICAN DREAM sorted. Why add the fleeing communism bit? It's obviously going to be found out.

[mikem]

That was a line from one of the articles that really hit home for me. I don't think any of his supporters have done that intentionally. I think they are tone deaf and if you were born past 1980 marching with Dr. King is marching with Dr. King and they are shocked that is not enough. It is just different if you have been in the trenches for 50 years. He did much more than most in his generation, but he mostly worked in Chicago - not down south. So people down south don't know him. And let's be honest, there are not many minorities in Vermont so what exactly is he meant to do? He just needed to be in the churches more and at universities less. Hillary has been at the church meetings for 20 odd years. It counts.

[Davgooner]

Toby
White northerners tell us he has this great track record on civil rights, but then why don't any of the people involved in the struggle for the last fifty years know who he is?


Jesus, looks like the shite from Hilary's campaign is working. He was there for the duration, and several people have vouched for that, and there was a piece of research done suggesting he was there for 95% of the major rallies etc at the time. The endorsements Hilary has are from establishment black groups that attempt to portray themselves are normal people on the ground. They're ever much a part of the democratic establishment that wants Hilary elected as gimps like Wasserman Schultz. The last mob was led by two geezers who make quite a lot of money from student loans. Wonder why they're backing her over Bernie?

That the black vote is almost entirely going to Hilary given what the Clintons have done to harm that same community is depressing as fuck.

[Toby]

phonics there seems to be something wrong with the board, it's trying to tell me a post with multiple paragraphs was written by Davgooner.

[Pepe]

Jesus, looks like the shite from Hilary's campaign is working. He was there for the duration, and several people have vouched for that, and there was a piece of research done suggesting he was there for 95% of the major rallies etc at the time. The endorsements Hilary has are from establishment black groups that attempt to portray themselves are normal people on the ground. They're ever much a part of the democratic establishment that wants Hilary elected as gimps like Wasserman Schultz. The last mob was led by two geezers who make quite a lot of money from student loans. Wonder why they're backing her over Bernie?

That the black vote is almost entirely going to Hilary given what the Clintons have done to harm that same community is depressing as fuck.

Yes but if he is so awesome why haven't I heard of him before? Name recognition is everything apparently.

[elth]

That ignores the fact that his proposed policies, whether economic or regarding criminal justice, would benefit the black community the most, but they dont seem to care for that, they really want their issues to be treated completely separately. Which is ok I suppose.

Or maybe they're just not gullible enough to think Sanders has a hope in hell of getting any of his daydream policies into practice.

[QE Harold Flair]

What is 'the black community'?

[Pepe]

Or maybe they're just not gullible enough to think Sanders has a hope in hell of getting any of his daydream policies into practice.

Must be that.

[Henry]

So, I hear Trump quoted Mussolini on Twitter, and refused to disavow an endorsement from David Dukes of the KKK.

[Toby]

He retweeted an innocuous quote* of Mussolini's that had been (falsely) attributed to him by a bot account. It hardly marks him as a fascist.

*“It is better to live one day as a lion than 100 years as a sheep.”

[Davgooner]

Unelectable, I've heard.

Edit: Bernie that is.

Trump has retweeted all manner of right-wing nutters, quite intentionally.

[phonics]

My personal favourite was the manual retweet of @WhiteGenocideTM who's bio links to this piece of insanity

http://thegreateststorynevertold.tv/

[Jimmy Floyd]

It literally doesn't matter what he does though. All that matters is that he dominates the agenda. Substance is irrelevant and not part of this campaign.

[Henry]

He retweeted an innocuous quote* of Mussolini's that had been (falsely) attributed to him by a bot account. It hardly marks him as a fascist.

*“It is better to live one day as a lion than 100 years as a sheep.”

His politics are proto-fascist and he's clearly interested in mobilising that constituency. Anyone else would have run a mile from anything to do with Mussolini.

[Toby]

His politics are proto-fascist and he's clearly interested in mobilising that constituency. Anyone else would have run a mile from anything to do with Mussolini.

If they recognised it as a Mussolini quote. It was falsely attributed as a quote from one of his books, and sounds conceivably like the sort of wank you get in business dinner speaker monologues.

[Pepe]

It literally doesn't matter what he does though. All that matters is that he dominates the agenda. Substance is irrelevant and not part of this campaign.

'This.'

[Davgooner]

Oh it matters that he keeps endorsing racists. His supporters demand it.

[phonics]

We're also forgetting that the next state up is Alabama.

[John]

John Oliver went in fairly hard on Trump last night. Petty feud incoming.

[Henry]

If they recognised it as a Mussolini quote. It was falsely attributed as a quote from one of his books, and sounds conceivably like the sort of wank you get in business dinner speaker monologues.

He did recognise it as a Mussolini quote. He said so.

[QE Harold Flair]

Who cares? It's a good quote.

[Toby]

Fair enough, I hadn't seen that. His response is a rambling mess and suggests he was embarrassed not to have recognised it (and therefore embarrassed to admit it), but I'd agree anybody else would have distanced themselves from it once that was pointed out.

[QE Harold Flair]

Yes, and it's refreshing that he doesn't care.

[Toby]

At least not as much as he cares about the effect on his ego of not knowing something.

[Pepe]

Shit survey time:

http://www.isidewith.com/

[Jimmy Floyd]

I agree with The Donald on environmental issues. Presumably that means we both agree that the land should be covered in golf courses.

[GS]

Sanders, Clinton and Bloomberg were my top three by a distance, so at least I can confirm I am not a fascist.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I got Sanders, as would anyone on here or indeed in the whole of Europe.

[GS]

So did I. Sanders was 84%, Clinton 77% and Bloomberg 76%. Then Ted Cruz somewhere down in the low sixties.

[Lewis]

Gary Johnson (94%)
Ted Cruz (74%)
Bernie 'Bernie' Sanders (70%)

That took too long.

[Giggles]

Way too long. Trump 80%, Cruz 71%, Rubio 71%.

[Bernanke]

John Oliver went in fairly hard on Trump last night. Petty feud incoming.

Make Donald Drumpf again! It was a great segment.

Honestly, it's kind of entertaining watching the GOP neocons squirming over The Donalds success. NY Times had a piece a few days ago about the internal happenings in the party:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/donald-trump-republican-party.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

"Inside the Republican Party’s Desperate Mission to Stop Donald Trump".

The twist at the end is amazing.

[Pepe]

Way too long. Trump 80%, Cruz 71%, Rubio 71%.

Ffs. :D


It was a great segment.

My misus was watching it during breakfast and I thought it was pretty unfunny, except for the lol I got when he said 'I'm great with words' or some shit like that.


I got 97% Sanders btw. Also 95% Clinton and Rand was nowhere to be seen so I'm going to call it shit.

[Lewis]

John 'Dennis Nilsen' Oliver is a bit crap isn't he really? He's like a worse David Mitchell.

[Pepe]

First time I watch him and I don't think I'll be looking for more.

Is he british or just a wanker?

[Giggles]

Ffs. :D


I've no clue on any of them really, but it was a quiz to do. Well obviously I know Trump is a cunt but I presume the others are very right too.

[Serj]

Jill Stein & Bernie Sanders 93%. I'm a hippie, apparently.

[Toby]

I got 96% Jill Stein, who I had never heard of until now, and 95% 'Bernie'.

Furthest from Marco Rubio, who I had not realised was such a 'values' bellend.

[Pepe]

He's basically Mert with his whole nuclear family shite.

[Henry]

I got Sanders (100%), Jill Stein (98%) and Clinton (97%) which is a bit fucked up.

Trump was 11% and Carson 5%, which makes him an absolute fruitcake I suppose.

[mikem]

While I only agree with Ted Cruz on 24% of things, one of them is science. I feel stupid.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I got Sanders (100%), Jill Stein (98%) and Clinton (97%) which is a bit fucked up.

Trump was 11% and Carson 5%, which makes him an absolute fruitcake I suppose.

In British terms, even Bernie is only a New Labour sop. Jezza Corbz would out-socialism him by KO in the second round.

[Vim]

Make Donald Drumpf again! It was a great segment.



Somehow I don't think he'll do a similar segment on Hillary Clinton, though.

[ItalAussie]

Make Donald Drumpf again! It was a great segment.

Honestly, it's kind of entertaining watching the GOP neocons squirming over The Donalds success. NY Times had a piece a few days ago about the internal happenings in the party:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/donald-trump-republican-party.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

"Inside the Republican Party’s Desperate Mission to Stop Donald Trump".

The twist at the end is amazing.

The GOP has spent a decade crafting and constructing the very attitude that is pushing Trump forward. It's the result of eight years of fear-mongering, demonization, and panicked obstruction. They have nobody to blame but themselves. He's not some misfortune they've had descend on them from on high. They created him, and now they can't control him.

[Spoonsky]

Somehow I don't think he'll do a similar segment on Hillary Clinton, though.

You can't really compare the two. Trump's like nothing anyone's ever seen.

[phonics]

Trump's like nothing anyone's ever seen.

Hi Spoon, I know you're young so this all seems quite new but chill beloved.

[Toby]

Hi Spoon, I know you're young so this all seems quite new but chill beloved.

Is that not a fair comment? As far as satire material goes I'm not sure there's ever been a comparable candidate. Certainly not one sweeping up actual votes for their party's nomination.

I'd assume Spoon's point is that it isn't really a fair comparison to suggest they set Clinton alongside and mock her in a similar manner, for "balance" or otherwise. For whatever her faults - I'm sure there are many - she's a serious politician running a fairly traditional campaign.

[John Arne]

In the context of an Amercian Pres election, Spoon is right.

[phonics]

We've never seen the population flee to the right during an economic downturn? Ok. The Greeks voted in a party called 'Golden Dawn'...

[phonics]

By the by, this is the actual terrifying bit

704625141121028096

It's been noted that around 100-200k Democrats have resigned in several states in the lead up to Super Tuesday.

[Toby]

We've never seen the population flee to the right during an economic downturn? Ok. The Greeks voted in a party called 'Golden Dawn'...

It's not "fleeing to the right" though, is it? He's not even consistently "right wing", just all over the place. As far as a subject for satire goes it's a near unique situation.

[QE Harold Flair]

By the by, this is the actual terrifying bit

704625141121028096

It's been noted that around 100-200k Democrats have resigned in several states in the lead up to Super Tuesday.

It's not 'terrifying' at all. Trump is not Hitler, and the left's desperation to paint any right wing person they disagree with in such a manner is what really needs addressing.

[Davgooner]

There are some pretty massive parallels with early-day Hitler and the Nazi movement, you chief.

[QE Harold Flair]

MASSIVE, you say? You think Trump is on course for mass genocide, do you?

[Lewis]

'The Donald' will never do or say anything more sinister than this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwG5MhVGQ6k), so people need to calm down.

[Pepe]

Trump = Hitler is seriously, seriously lol.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I just hope the CIA find an entertaining way to take him out, if the polls start looking queasy.

[Shindig]

Hope its like the end of The Final Cut.

[Spoonsky]

The CIA taking out Trump would be immense. It would probably start an armed insurgency.

[Henry]

MASSIVE, you say? You think Trump is on course for mass genocide, do you?

There's probably a reason he said "early" Hitler. It's quite clear that Trump is exploiting fear of the other and blaming them for societal ills.

[Kikó]

Trump was just talking about bringing the clean coal industry. Mint.

[QE Harold Flair]

There's probably a reason he said "early" Hitler. It's quite clear that Trump is exploiting fear of the other and blaming them for societal ills.

Yes, and it's said to insinuate that it could lead to later Hitler. Fear of 'the other' is very justified if we're talking backwards Muslims from backwards countries. To dispute that is to ignore what is happening in the world.

[Henry]

Yes, and it's said to insinuate that it could lead to later Hitler.

No it isn't. It's said to highlight the very clear similarities in how he is recruiting support.


Fear of 'the other' is very justified if we're talking backwards Muslims from backwards countries. To dispute that is to ignore what is happening in the world.

Muslims, Mexicans, black people, the poor, homosexuals, the disabled, women....

[Boydy]

Anyone ever read Philip Roth's The Plot Against America? He reminds me of Lindbergh in that.

[Serj]

Preliminary exit polls: At least 6 in 10 GOP voters support banning Muslims who aren't citizens from entering US.https://t.co/FiqY5VhtYv
— ABC News (@ABC)March 1, 2016

:sick:

[Pepe]

Trump was just talking about bringing the clean coal industry. Mint.

Nothing wrong with the 'clean coal' technologies, name aside. Carbon capture and sequestration is definitely one thing I would like to see lefties embrace instead of focusing exclusively on the wind/solar pipe dream.

[Davgooner]

More figures out today showing Bernie smashing all the Republican candidates out of sight.

Hilary not so much.

[Pepe]

Shame that he will get smashed out of sight by Hilary tonight.

RIP in pieces Bern. :(

[QE Harold Flair]

Anyone spot a white face behind Hilary? This is squirmingly embarrassing.

Why can't these dimwits see she's a clear phoney?

[Spoonsky]

Bernie Sanders has won Oklahoma, which is basically in the South. It's really happening now lads.

[Pepe]

It's on. :drool:

[Pepe]

Btw how fucking stupid is it to not have everyone vote at the same time? Jesus.

[Spoonsky]

Why does it matter?

[Kikó]

Nothing wrong with the 'clean coal' technologies, name aside. Carbon capture and sequestration is definitely one thing I would like to see lefties embrace instead of focusing exclusively on the wind/solar pipe dream.


It's something I'm ignorant of. Have you got something to read on it?

[Spoonsky]

I would now put a fair load of money on Clinton to beat Trump in the general (if anyone wants to take me up on it...). It seems like a lot of Clinton's dominance today has to do with people being terrified of Trump and seeing her as the person to beat him, and that will only be increased in the general election. On the other side it's hard to see Trump losing it from here, Nate Silver said that Marco Rubio could well be 200 delegates behind him by the end of the night and nobody likes Ted Cruz.

[elth]

It's something I'm ignorant of. Have you got something to read on it?

It's a myth. Pure PR bullshit from an industry desperate to extract every last dollar of their soon to be useless reserves before clean energy destroys their business model.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/a4947/4339171/

[elth]

Clinton v Trump it is, then.

Will the Republican Party still exist to challenge Clinton if she runs for re-election in 2020?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Hillary's numbers in the south are pretty comprehensive.

Which states would Trump carry in the general? Idaho? Bonne chance, old boy.

[Davgooner]

Better than expected for Bernie, but it's probably not enough. :(

[Toby]

Five Thirty Eight said he should have been winning Massachusetts as well as the four states he did.

[ItalAussie]

Clinton v Trump it is, then.

Will the Republican Party still exist to challenge Clinton if she runs for re-election in 2020?

I reckon they'll work themselves up into getting behind Trump. Even the ones who'd swear they never will.

They hate Liberals more than RINOs.

[ItalAussie]

Why does it matter?

It means that everyone isn't voting with the same information, which is a bit weird. I mean, I can see why they do it - every state is doing this indepedently - but it's odd.

[niko_cee]

Maybe this will finally be the thing to sink the Donald's campaign:


Piers Morgan, who has known Donald Trump for 10 years, tells the BBC Radio 4's Today programme the Republican presidential candidate as someone "pretty smart" with "warmth", "good humour" and a "sense of perspective".

[John Arne]

Is it too late for Rubio to drop out and run as Cruz'z running mate? You would have thought that combined they would easily beat Trump.

[Davgooner]

Five Thirty Eight said he should have been winning Massachusetts as well as the four states he did.

Yeah, that was a shitter, although a couple of others were a bit of a surprise as the little polling there had been seemed to indicate that Hilary was holding on.

[Toby]

They were talking more about what he would need to win rather than what would be outperforming current polling. Massachusetts being predominantly white and 'liberal', and bordering Vermont, meant it should have been one of his stronger states, and without it it doesn't seem clear where he's going to make up the difference.

[elth]

He's losing the Southern states by so much that even piling up wins in more liberal but less populated states can't get him enough delegates (even without the super delegates).

I actually think most "party" Republicans would rather Trump than Cruz. There's no way Rubio makes way for him even as VP, his Senate colleagues *hate* Cruz.

[Jimmy Floyd]

If Hillary were smart, she'd offer him VP. Probably more chance of Colonel Sanders getting on the ticket sadly.

[elth]

Hillary will want someone younger and more ethnic than Sanders, I think, given "old, boring and white" are basically her three biggest weaknesses apart from the whole career politician thing, which she can't do much about.

[Henry]

So, what happens to the nomination if Trump is the leading candidate but without a majority?
And if say, Rubio drops out, what happens to his delegates?

[phonics]

So, what happens to the nomination if Trump is the leading candidate but without a majority?
And if say, Rubio drops out, what happens to his delegates?

Then it's a floor war at the RNC with everyone trying to steal delegates.

[Henry]

Then it's a floor war at the RNC with everyone trying to steal delegates.

What does that mean? Can delegates change their views as they please?

[phonics]

What does that mean? Can delegates change their views as they please?

Yes, if there's a majority then the delegates are locked but if Trump has less than 1538 (I think) delegates then they can swap as they wish. Which means you're going to have the Cruz/Rubio/Carson train rolling on so that Trump keeps winning 30/40% in the hope that it keeps his delegate numbers low enough to stab him in the back from the RNC convention.

[Henry]

Cheers. It would be absolutely glorious to see those gobshites ripping each other to pieces over that.

[niko_cee]

Doesn't Trump then just run as an independent and crash the whole thing anyway?

[ItalAussie]

A brokered convention would be the most fascinating political entertainment in years. As delegates are generally party establishment, they'd probably squeeze Trump out, and he and his base would go ballistic. That's the only situation I could envision where the party would really tear itself apart.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The West Wing prepared us for everything. Brokered convention, check. President temporarily resigning with no VP in position and handing over to opposite party, check. No impeachment, but we had one of those in the 70s (and 90s?)

[Toby]

They did have almost a whole series on Barlet's possible impeachment too, just that he got away with it in the end.

[Lewis]

I liked the idea (I can't remember where I read it) that the other Republicans up for election would base their campaigns around the need for conservative representatives to hold 'Hillary' to account, rather than bothering to waste their time backing whoever gets nominated. That would probably keep the party together, since 'The Donald' would just tell them to get lost and forsake their support rather than appeal for it.

[Magic]

This is incredible. Fuck me.

[QE Harold Flair]

The white, working class have finally had enough of the bollocks. Viva la Trump!

[QE Harold Flair]

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/7-28-2015/VGz10i.gif

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/3-02-2016/KwitXN.gif

[Pepe]

Why does it matter?

Because results from early elections inevitably affect the voting decisions of elections occurring later.


It's something I'm ignorant of. Have you got something to read on it?

You know what, I actually don't have anything right now. Let me dig something out although elth's article covers the principle and challenges well enough, although it only mentions one method of carbon capture, there are (potentially) better ones out there.


It's a myth. Pure PR bullshit from an industry desperate to extract every last dollar of their soon to be useless reserves before clean energy destroys their business model.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/a4947/4339171/

While 'Big coal' and 'Big oil' and big whatever are definitely a nasty bunch (not sure why we thing Big wind and big solar will be any better though) and I would be happy if we could all live off solar panels in an emissions free world, the technical challenges of that are pretty darn big, so it is not so much about whether we want to burn fossil fuels or not and more about how much must we burn. Even your article admits it:


Let's be clear. We should continue research into making coal cleaner--that fuel will be a vital part of our energy mix for decades. But let's not allow clean-coal myths to divert us from real-world energy alternatives that work today.

I would also add: Lets not allow clean-energy myths to divert us from pursuing technologies that will allow us to reduce emissions in the short term. If we focus entirely on wind and solar and batteries it will be decades (lots of them) before we reduce emissions in any considerable way.

I would also strongly agree with this part:


The cleanest energy option of all is also the closest at hand: conservation.

Unfortunately that's the hardest sell because it actually requires 'the common folk' to do something.

[Pepe]

Not specifically about 'Clean Coal' but If you really want to read the other side, then The Moral Case for Fossil Fuels by Alex Epstein is a good option.

[Henry]

The white, working class have finally had enough of the bollocks. Viva la Trump!

He wants to lower their wages, you know.

[Pepe]

Yes but it's for their own good.

[Lewis]

I read that his tax plan would make everybody better off. Yes, the country would also collapse under the weight of all the added debt, but they'll be winning so much by then they're gonna be tired of winning.

[phonics]

I read that his tax plan would make everybody better off. Yes, the country would also collapse under the weight of all the added debt, but they'll be winning so much by then they're gonna be tired of winning.
705004284593774593

[mikem]

The Presidential primary season is fine. It shows if the candidates have the executive ability to create and build coalitions and if they can manage teams that can successfully disseminate policy information and achieve their stated goals over a sustained period. Presidents don't have a lot of institutional power and their strength is primarily about their ability to manage retail politics.

[Henry]

Fuck me.

Under no circumstances.

[mikem]

Henry
We have not had a brokered convention since the 60's so who knows. In the near past losing candidates have released their delegates. I know some Hillary delegates who were told (by the Clinton campaign) to stay home to allow Obama to choose who he wanted to send. They would have happily voted for Obama but it allows the candidate to reward people with a party who worked hard even when they lost or were sacrificial. So it all depends on whether the Republicans release their delegates or not.

[Boydy]

http://theslot.jezebel.com/clinton-tells-young-black-voter-asking-about-diversity-1762385043

:cringe:

[Lewis]

She does seem like somebody who can't really deal with criticism/disagreement. If 'The Donald' gets to debate her we could be on for a right THE MASK HAS SLIPPED (God I hate that expression) chimp out.

[mikem]

Boydy the comment section is even better than the article.

[Henry]

Trump now saying that he's a "unifier" and that he wants the party behind him. LOL.

[Bernanke]

I legitimately miss Romney at this point.

[Serj]

She does seem like somebody who can't really deal with criticism/disagreement. If 'The Donald' gets to debate her we could be on for a right THE MASK HAS SLIPPED (God I hate that expression) chimp out.

Yeah that's going to be very interesting. As far as I can tell, she's usually really intent on not actually settling for a position so that it's hard to criticise her/disagree with her.

Like here (from 3.40, how do I make it start there?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgIe2GKudYY?t=219

[Lewis]

There were those books that claimed she used to kick fuck out of poor ol' Bill and terrorise the staff, but everybody has been too polite to mention it... UNTIL NOW.

[Spoonsky]

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/03/marco-rubio-just-lost-fox-news.html#

lol. I really don't get how he's bungled it this badly. When I saw him at the first debate I honestly felt like he could the Republican's Obama (I guess one of the problems is that the GOP is white as fuck).

Ted Cruz is the dream Republican nominee. He'd never get elected, and if he did he'd be less disastrous than Trump.