View Full Version : Making a Murderer (Massive Spoilers Within)
"You missed your ONE chance".
"If you change your mind, please contact me".
Ugh. Disgusting twat.
Crazy, eh? Once again the justice system is completely shown to be a mess. The fact that not only did they consider the incident from Germany, but they basically changed the verdict of that case as well... madness. The defence offering up no murder weapon (lol - what a scene that was "This is the blowpoke!!".. [gasps from courtroom]. I actually trust Michael less than I believe Avery - there is something about him that I don't like or trust.
To be honest, I think both the prosecution and defence failed in some way. The prosecution in not finding a murder weapon, or a decent motive, and I thought his defence offered little by way of alternative... although, I guess, "if" she feel down the stairs, then perhaps there is nothing else to be argued.
Finally, as in MaM - the TV coverage is absolutely disgraceful... how on earth are the lawyers allowed to speak to the press during the trial... is this still allowed? It's certainly not permitted in the UK.
I watched a BBC follow-up but it was pretty crap - it just sounds like they are appealing, but not much has happened since.
The moment when the jury returned is probably the most hooked I've been on TV for a while... I was completely engrossed and at the last minute, I genuinely thougt that they would find him not guilty.
The Staircase Spoilers
I was gobsmacked when he was found guilty. I felt gutted for his daughters, who seemed to think him being found guilty was totally unfathomable. I'm not sure how accurate the documentary captured the trial, but if it was somewhat accurate, the jury are fucking morons. And it leaves me with absolutely no faith in the justice system.
The whole Germany thing was ridiculous. Not only did they change the verdict, the work they did was clearly done to try and find parallels between the two cases. And since when was it the pathologist's job to determine if someone was murdered or not?! She was a total cunt on the stand, rolling her eyes every time the defence questioned her.
I thought the defence did a reasonable job at offering an alternative, actually. The animation they showed in the court was consistent with the blood splatter. The lack of any cast off splatter surely ruled out being hit with a weapon of any sort? Unless they were doing Bruce Lee style one inch punches.
I said to my wife that there should be a blanket ban on ANY media coverage of criminal cases until they've been convicted. It just makes it impossible to not taint the jury pool.
I haven't watched the follow up yet, but he's out from what I can gather after being granted a new trial in 2011, which hasn't happened yet. It looks like the blood splatter guy from the prosecution was totally full of shit and lied about his credentials. What a joke.
John Arne
25-01-2016, 04:23 PM
Nice of his lawyer to include the telephone number and email address :D
Shite, I meant F. :D
Well, then good old wood could do the trick. :D
Magic
25-01-2016, 05:41 PM
Is Serial 2007?
Magic
25-01-2016, 05:47 PM
Also downloading this: Murder on a Sunday Morning
Mixed with pure oxygen? You couldn't achieve those temps with any fuel on am open bonfire, basically?
You realise air is circa 80% nitrogen yeah, not hydrogen.
Magic
25-01-2016, 06:17 PM
Yes. That's why I said mixed with oxygen/air these temps simply can't be achieved. So Hydrogen + flame - the atmosphere = win?
Hydrogen + oxygen + spark = 3000+ C flame.
Yevrah
25-01-2016, 06:47 PM
Some of these already covered.
http://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/news/a780691/youve-finished-making-a-murderer-so-now-what-10-things-you-should-binge-on-next/
Not sure about the spoiler content in that link, but DS are normally ok.
Magic
25-01-2016, 06:55 PM
Hydrogen + oxygen + spark = 3000+ C flame.
F, you mean? Sorry m8 I can't believe you can achieve those temps in a fucking burn pit and also if you're a thick cunt.
Definitely not in a burn pit. If done in a burn pit you wouldn't have pure oxygen as the oxidizer.
Magic
25-01-2016, 07:19 PM
That's what I meant. Fuck you, Foe.
I misread magics post. :/
Magic
25-01-2016, 07:59 PM
Remember you're on a 3 month probationary period for #teamengineer. Not looking good.
I won't be an engineer for long. :moop:
Magic and I carrying the team all alone. :drool:
Magic
25-01-2016, 08:14 PM
Foe, Giggles and Merse heading up #teamtechnician.
:harold:
Giggles
25-01-2016, 08:15 PM
Foe, Giggles and Merse heading up #teamtechnician.
:harold:
I'm a delivery man.
I'll just re-establish my career as a bin man.
Now now, don't be modest. Waste Management Engineer.
Alan Shearer The 2nd
25-01-2016, 08:24 PM
How about Officer?
Every other job title seems to get that one.
You can stick 'supervisor' in there as long as you're not specific about supervising people.
That's how a paperboy becomes a 'Periodic Delivery Supervisor'.
Magic
26-01-2016, 02:19 PM
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/making-murderer-explosive-new-details-7245290?ICID=FB_mirror_main
New evidence discovered apparently. Talk about this bombshell too:
While hundreds of people have descended on Avery's Salvage Yard (http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/making-a-murderer) in Two Rivers, Wisconsin - it is said his mother 78-year-old Dolores is getting set to implicate Teresa's brother in Michael in the murder.
How's his dad, these days? He was the only likeable character aside from Super Dean Strang.
The Merse
27-01-2016, 12:16 AM
Foe, Giggles and Merse heading up #teamtechnician.
:harold:
Technician?
Anyhow - The Jinx. Fuck me. I just made it to ep 6 and the toilet scene.
A friend has described it to me before I'd even heard of The Jinx properly so I thought it was the impact would have been spoiled, but I was staggered that he'd made that mistake before but without revealing anything really, and the 'scene' still carried plenty of impact having been so transfixed by so much of it so far. It's probably better than MAM in pure documentary terms as it's definitely more balanced (at least for 5 episodes), but it lacks the same relentlessness and isn't as well paced.
The step son of the LA victim realising he'd been 'dancing with the devil' for years was actually quite harrowing, even if he'd clearly been lying to himself/playing ignorant for a long time. That it appeared to happen organically was interesting.
Alan Shearer The 2nd
27-01-2016, 09:42 PM
Technician?
Anyhow - The Jinx. Fuck me. I just made it to ep 6 and the toilet scene.
A friend has described it to me before I'd even heard of The Jinx properly so I thought it was the impact would have been spoiled, but I was staggered that he'd made that mistake before but without revealing anything really, and the 'scene' still carried plenty of impact having been so transfixed by so much of it so far. It's probably better than MAM in pure documentary terms as it's definitely more balanced (at least for 5 episodes), but it lacks the same relentlessness and isn't as well paced.
The step son of the LA victim realising he'd been 'dancing with the devil' for years was actually quite harrowing, even if he'd clearly been lying to himself/playing ignorant for a long time. That it appeared to happen organically was interesting.
Glad I watched this too.
For someone being regarded as quite sharp by people in the show, I struggle to see what the fuck possessed Durst to be so daft as to forget about having a mic. on him twice. Then of course there's the stealing of the sandwich. :D
The Merse
27-01-2016, 09:54 PM
Glad I watched this too.
For someone being regarded as quite sharp by people in the show, I struggle to see what the fuck possessed Durst to be so daft as to forget about having a mic. on him twice. Then of course there's the stealing of the sandwich. :D
My lasting impression is the clear lack of a grip of rational thought behind actually fucking requesting someone make a documentary about it in the first place and then giving them unfettered access to his files (which also resulted in him breaking an NDA with his brother.
Alan Shearer The 2nd
27-01-2016, 09:57 PM
His blinking should have given it away.
Magic
27-01-2016, 10:08 PM
Whoa whoa spoiler that shit.
Alan Shearer The 2nd
27-01-2016, 10:24 PM
I assume that's you just being a knob you ned?
The jinx didn't really grab me as much at all. Something about the pacing or the story didn't make me want to carry on. I guess the payoff was worth it.
The Merse
28-01-2016, 07:59 AM
I will say that Bob's 'distinctive' voice was grating as hell and I struggled to put up with longer pieces of his dialogue where it was less interesting. The point I guess is that so much of that dialogue is later proved wrong.
Bingeing on true crime now. Staircase ep 3 and serial ep 7. The former is yet to grab me, the latter feels as if it's awaiting a massive revelation.
Alan Shearer The 2nd
28-01-2016, 12:57 PM
Now that's worth a spoiler.
The Staircase. Seriously, if you enjoyed Making a Murderer get on this.
Obviously time constraints mean most of what was said in that trial was cut out, but I found myself making arguments against almost everything the prosecution said and then getting pissed off when the defence didn't make the same ones. The blood spatter bloke in particular was a fucking div.
I think the defence fucked themselves a little with the Lee bloke, who I'd imagine was verging on incomprehensible at times to that jury, and you know for a fact the question 'did they have to go to fucking China to find someone who disagrees with the prosecution's interpretation?' was asked during deliberations. The biomechanics guy was not bad, but rather than trying to quibble on semantics during cross when that hateful shebeast was asking if the person touching the body was in a better position he should just have said 'not necessarily'.
That the case from Germany was allowed in evidence was bad enough, but the way they essentially created a huge diversion by taking a death already ruled natural and getting someone in their employ to make a different ruling which could then not be challenged was bordering on criminal. The real disgrace, though, is that nobody panelled the stupid blonde bitch making things up with the heaviest object they could find. Her testimony and the scene with the two sisters getting increasingly smug in the library were the only two moments where I felt anything like the same sort of anger I was experiencing during MaM when Ken Kratz or that fat wanker with the sketch were on-screen.
The German guy who appeared near the start and then basically vanished used an analogy that one of my lecturers at uni liked, with the 'water balloon' analogy for non-contact wound. He was good, and based on some of what he was saying could have made the same arguments as Lee from a similar position of authority.
Really felt for the two daughters, who have had a fucking hellish time of it. Mum dies when they're children, they're taken in by a family friend who then marries and provides a stable family unit for them with a new mum. That mum then dies, and the world tells them that not only did their 'dad' kill her, but he killed their actual mum too. That's like a supervillain origin story.
Staircase:
Don't forget their sister basically left the family, too. They lost their parents and a sister from one event.
According to Wikipedia, Henry Lee is one of the world's "leading forensic scientists", so I assume they went with him because of the credibility he had. Although the focus group they had already showed them that people didn't like the way he testified and struggled to understand him.
The two sisters were really enraging. I kept having to remind myself that as far as they were concerned, this man had killed their sister, and to try and cut them some slack. The library moment where they found stuff about killing in his fiction writing was horrible though. They really thought they'd found the smoking gun.
Staircase:
Don't forget their sister basically left the family, too. They lost their parents and a sister from one event.
According to Wikipedia, Henry Lee is one of the world's "leading forensic scientists", so I assume they went with him because of the credibility he had. Although the focus group they had already showed them that people didn't like the way he testified and struggled to understand him.
The two sisters were really enraging. I kept having to remind myself that as far as they were concerned, this man had killed their sister, and to try and cut them some slack. The library moment where they found stuff about killing in his fiction writing was horrible though. They really thought they'd found the smoking gun.
Their 'sister'. She was Kathleen's daughter from a previous marriage. Obviously it would have been a bastard for her to walk away from them, but given what else was going on it would have been fairly small potatoes. The more prominent of the two sisters seemed to swing towards thinking he'd killed her based on the stuff about his sexuality, which is repulsive.
Putting Lee up there after the focus group told them not to was a blunder. Being the world expert in something is good for selling books and booking guest lecturing spots, but when it comes to laying out a concept for a group of laypeople communication and gravitas are much more important than your CV, and someone speaking in vague English and giggling isn't the man for that job. I'll stick to what I said about him being foreign working against them on a more fundamental level too, in that if the perception is that you had to go all that way to find someone to back you up your story seems immediately less credible.
That library scene was disquieting as it was happening, but it added dread to some stuff further down the line too, like when Mike is deciding whether or not to testify. I'd have been rooting for him to get up there and give an impassioned plea of innocence if it wasn't for the knowledge that the prosecution could produce pages of him talking about murder.
There is something a bit slippery about Mike and I wouldn't trust the man to tell the time never mind the truth, but he wasn't guilty.
Samadini
29-01-2016, 10:45 AM
I don't want to Google anything at all for fear of spoilers. How many episodes and how long are they? Hoping for good binge potential here.
The Staircase? Eight episodes about forty minutes each, with the last of them running fifty. It has binge potential, probably more than Making a Murderer, actually.
Samadini
29-01-2016, 10:54 AM
:drool:
FInally finished watching this. Tip to anybody who hasn't started yet: don't agree to watch it with other people. :moop:
It's probably the most maddening documentary I've ever seen. I simply cannot understand how either of them were convicted. In the case of Avery I can see why people would have an inkling he might be guilty but there clearly wasn't sufficient evidence to prove that beyond reasonable doubt. Every major piece of evidence they had was seriously compromised in some way or another.
And then you come to Brendan Dassey, who's story is one of those you just have to try not to think about because it's so upsetting. The phonecall where he says to his mum, "I can't help it mom, I'm just really stupid" nearly had me welling up for the poor kid. I've never seen somebody failed to such extremes by a system supposed to help them. How he was convicted on his obviously nonsensical 'confession' is completely beyond me, let alone how it was upheld against multiple appeals.
It's impossible to decide who is the most hateful out of Ken Kratz, Len Kachinsky and Bill O'Kelly but Good Lord they can't have much competition from elsewhere.
Henry
29-01-2016, 04:53 PM
There's a guy I know who has become convinced, based on the exapanded transcripts of the conversations that were in the documentary (bot not shown in entirety) that Dassey did do it.
Also, why not watch with other people?
I was mostly joking, because it took me so much longer to watch it all that way than if I'd just watched it on my own.
Dassey's confession just didn't make any sense. How could the scene he described have unfolded without any blood or other bodily evidence present in the bedroom?
Henry
29-01-2016, 05:44 PM
Personally, I agree. If he/they did it, then it went down very differently.
There's also the ludicrous fact that they were both prosecuted using different stories. In Avery's trial, the prosecution claimed Avery killed her in the garage. In Dassey's trial, they claimed they both killed her in the trailer. One of those stories cannot possibly be true.
This one is pretty fascinating as theories go: http://coldcasecameron.com/
It sounds reasonably plausible, but is clearly written by an obsessive looking to extend an existing conspiracy theory. Particularly amusing are the side-by-side graphs where the author appears to suggest that falls in the nationwide homicide rate were caused by this guy being in jail.
Samadini
29-01-2016, 07:18 PM
Downloading Death on the Staircase now rather than first thing this morning probably means tomorrow is now fucked, it's just not going to happen anymore.
It was recut as a two hour documentary with that name, I think, so make sure you're getting the full bhuna and not that version.
I've done a bit of reading this evening while making dinner and some of the stuff that isn't even in the documentary gives Making a Murderer a run for its money in the 'you fucking what' stakes.
Going back through the thread now that I've seen everything:
Not going to read the thread, as I'm just about to go onto episode 6, but just to note that this is an exceptional show.
It is indeed, one of the best I've ever seen.
Is it really all that? I can't think of a documentary with more fascinating subject material, but they don't really do anything new or special in the filming of it. While I'm inclined toward their perspective anyway I also don't think it can be denied that it's an extremely biased take on the story.
Samadini
29-01-2016, 07:54 PM
I was a bit worried, as I hadn't seen anyone here call it that, but again I don't want to Google anything, did it with both Serial and MaM and found spoilers because of the news articles at the top of the search.
What I'm downloading has 9 episodes, so looks like it's good.
Yeah, that'll probably be the original eight and some followup thing. The site I used has a separate 'extras' download listed so I'd imagine it'll be something from that.
Yevrah
29-01-2016, 08:33 PM
Going back through the thread now that I've seen everything:
Is it really all that? I can't think of a documentary with more fascinating subject material, but they don't really do anything new or special in the filming of it. While I'm inclined toward their perspective anyway I also don't think it can be denied that it's an extremely biased take on the story.
I haven't denied that, as previous posts in this thread are testament to.
And for me it was one of the best shows I've ever seen because I was gripped from start to finish and simply couldn't stop until I'd seen it all. That there was nothing new or special there in terms of how it was filmed (which I'd agree with) wasn't a problem when the subject matter was so good.
Fair enough. I probably just struggle with the idea of ranking documentaries alongside fictional stuff.
Magic
29-01-2016, 08:38 PM
I prefer real life to fiction. Its always more fucked up.
One more comment on this and then I'll shut up for a bit. I thought there were parallels to be drawn between the way a lot of people viewed the case and the way a lot of Americans seem to talk about religion. The people who still seemed to think Avery might be guilty of the Beerstein rape being perfect case in point.
Mazuuurk
29-01-2016, 09:07 PM
Beerstein sounds like such a fratbro name.
Magic
29-01-2016, 09:11 PM
Beerstein sounds like such a fratbro name.
Along with Kegstein and Bongstein. Starring in American Pie Jesu.
That is a cracking misspelling.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/81JpQJFZEtL._SY355_.jpg
Beernsten obvs.
Samadini
01-02-2016, 12:49 AM
The Staircase
Their 'sister'. She was Kathleen's daughter from a previous marriage. Obviously it would have been a bastard for her to walk away from them, but given what else was going on it would have been fairly small potatoes. The more prominent of the two sisters seemed to swing towards thinking he'd killed her based on the stuff about his sexuality, which is repulsive.
Putting Lee up there after the focus group told them not to was a blunder. Being the world expert in something is good for selling books and booking guest lecturing spots, but when it comes to laying out a concept for a group of laypeople communication and gravitas are much more important than your CV, and someone speaking in vague English and giggling isn't the man for that job. I'll stick to what I said about him being foreign working against them on a more fundamental level too, in that if the perception is that you had to go all that way to find someone to back you up your story seems immediately less credible.
That library scene was disquieting as it was happening, but it added dread to some stuff further down the line too, like when Mike is deciding whether or not to testify. I'd have been rooting for him to get up there and give an impassioned plea of innocence if it wasn't for the knowledge that the prosecution could produce pages of him talking about murder.
There is something a bit slippery about Mike and I wouldn't trust the man to tell the time never mind the truth, but he wasn't guilty.
My thoughts exactly after just finishing this. Had my head in my hands and soon as I saw the words 'Henry Lee' pop up after the meeting over whether they'd put up a defence. Also got quite the squeaky bum when they offered Mike the chance to step up after the library scene.
Once again I'm left feeling seriously uncomfortable after watching that, knowing that 12 people have unanimously agreed that he's guilty beyond reasonable doubt, somehow. It's frightening to think how many people have been fucked over by this.
Lol at that complete and utter cunt calling a bit of porn disgusting filth, given the things she's sure to have gotten up to.
The Staircase
My thoughts exactly after just finishing this. Had my head in my hands and soon as I saw the words 'Henry Lee' pop up after the meeting over whether they'd put up a defence. Also got quite the squeaky bum when they offered Mike the chance to step up after the library scene.
Once again I'm left feeling seriously uncomfortable after watching that, knowing that 12 people have unanimously agreed that he's guilty beyond reasonable doubt, somehow. It's frightening to think how many people have been fucked over by this.
Lol at that complete and utter cunt calling a bit of porn disgusting filth, given the things she's sure to have gotten up to.
Good, isn't it? What was the ninth 'episode' in your download?
Aye that prosecution thundercunt laid it on a bit thick, to the point where it stopped being a tactic and she seemed like a genuine homophobe. The stuff where she was claiming knowledge of Kathleen's character made me a bit uncomfortable, and the jury ought to have seen straight through it, but I suppose that's a standard tactic and it obviously works.
Have you done some reading on it? That squirrely little wanker who was doing the blood for the prosecution was just a lying arsehole. He claimed to have worked on hundreds of cases, written for x amount of journals, etc, and it was all bullshit. He'd been on a two day blood course a few years previously, written about ten papers, and the Peterson case was only his third jury trial. His work on the fourth was so bad it was used to sack him. You can't help but think that if the jury knew that they'd have trusted Lee implicitly by comparison and he'd have been found not guilty.
There's an 'owl theory' that's worth reading too.
Samadini
01-02-2016, 01:42 PM
Very good, mostly because I had no idea how it was going to go, right up until the verdict. I haven't done any reading yet, just in case the other episode (seems to be and hour and half long film made in 2013) has anything telling that I'd want to watch first, will get on it tonight.
John Arne
01-02-2016, 02:16 PM
That ninth episode isn't very good, if it's the I downloaded, too. It's a BBC thing that doesn't really spread any else onto the case.
The Merse
07-02-2016, 10:53 AM
Updates to serial season 1 have been posted up in the last couple of days. Interesting stuff.
Giggles
07-02-2016, 11:00 AM
Updates to serial season 1 have been posted up in the last couple of days. Interesting stuff.
Seen those pop up as I've subscribed but haven't listened to any as I'm waiting til the summer when there's no NFL or soccer podcasts to listen to. Are they changing the story or clarifying stuff or what? Suppose it won't really make sense until I listen but would I be better listening to these straight after series 1 before going on to 2?
The Merse
07-02-2016, 11:26 AM
Seen those pop up as I've subscribed but haven't listened to any as I'm waiting til the summer when there's no NFL or soccer podcasts to listen to. Are they changing the story or clarifying stuff or what? Suppose it won't really make sense until I listen but would I be better listening to these straight after series 1 before going on to 2?
Spoiler just for the benifit of those that haven't finished season 1:
The updates are from a hearing on whether Adnan gets a re-trial. They're only 30 mins in total and from the sounds of it, further updates won't be in podcast form due to season 2 commitments. Season 2 has nothing to do with season 1, it's a completely different story. Far more moralistic too, as opposed to talking about 'the law' as such - at least where I'm up to (just finished ep 3).
You're as well listening to the two updates whilst season 1 is fresh in the mind and whilst interesting as a follow up, there's nothing MASSIVE'. Unless the retrial is granted, in which case you'll probably hear about it from other sources this week anyway.
Giggles
07-02-2016, 11:32 AM
I couldn't help myself but to click on that :(
The Merse
07-02-2016, 12:18 PM
I couldn't help myself but to click on that :(
Don't worry. I could really have put 'spoiler for those who've listened to less than 2 minutes of episode 1'. It's not much of a series for spoilers really. At least not in an overarching sense.
Giggles
07-02-2016, 12:22 PM
Ah it doesn't really matter as it might be heavy going on the road driving anyway, which is the only place I get to listen to podcasts.
Boydy
07-02-2016, 05:35 PM
Only tangentially related in it's a documentary about a prisoner but this is seriously good - http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b06zdjn0/storyville-20152016-14-a-death-row-tale-the-fear-of-13
Boydy
10-02-2016, 12:11 AM
Only tangentially related in it's a documentary about a prisoner but this is seriously good - http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b06zdjn0/storyville-20152016-14-a-death-row-tale-the-fear-of-13
No one's watched this, have they? Watch it. It's incredibly good. Also, you've only got 20 days left.
Samadini
10-02-2016, 06:14 AM
I watched it a couple of nights ago actually, I forgot to say. Cheers for the heads up, definitely a good watch.
Magic
29-02-2016, 05:04 PM
Season 2 confirmed, apparently. Can't help but thinking it'll be boring, circumstantial shite.
Paradise Lost was the best one out of the lot.
Yeah, I really don't see how there's a second season in this. The first one took them ten years to make, and obviously a lot of work and detail went into it. What else is there to say though?
Henry
29-02-2016, 05:49 PM
Maybe it's a separate story? i.e. unrelated to the first series?
Magic
29-02-2016, 05:58 PM
Maybe it's a separate story? i.e. unrelated to the first series?
No, it's entirely related. It's all about Avery and Dassey and NEW EVIDENCE.
To be honest, there's better out there and if it hadn't been for NETFLIX MARKETING it wouldn't nearly have received this much attention.
Giggles
29-02-2016, 05:59 PM
Maybe it's a separate story? i.e. unrelated to the first series?
I'm hoping that, but I fear it's going to be a rushed cash-in on the first series.
Charlie
29-02-2016, 07:01 PM
They'll get access to much deeper information with Netflix behind them and the publicity. That will be where they will make the second series.
Magic
07-03-2016, 04:09 PM
The Staircase:
:D
I love it. Michael Peterson is a DUDE. I'm only half way through so don't ruin it. I love the way the DA finds out he's a raging homo and that basically makes him guilty.
"If you said a relationship, no, not at all. Kathleen satisfied that in every way, I felt complete. If, on the other hand, you said a BBC gay orgy with ex-military men, then the answer would be yes."
Then it turns out his best mate's wife was also found at the bottom of a staircase. :D
SERIAL KILLER. Pretty damn good so far. But it's the same ridiculous prosecution attempts, do they honestly believe the shite that comes out their mouths? And the prosecution experts :face:.
John Arne
07-03-2016, 04:18 PM
The Staircase:
:D
I love it. Michael Peterson is a DUDE. I'm only half way through so don't ruin it. I love the way the DA finds out he's a raging homo and that basically makes him guilty.
"If you said a relationship, no, not at all. Kathleen satisfied that in every way, I felt complete. If, on the other hand, you said a BBC gay orgy with ex-military men, then the answer would be yes."
Then it turns out his best mate's wife was also found at the bottom of a staircase. :D
SERIAL KILLER. Pretty damn good so far. But it's the same ridiculous prosecution attempts, do they honestly believe the shite that comes out their mouths? And the prosecution experts :face:.
She's a fucking horrible bitch.
That scene was genuinely one of the best moments of TV for a long time... 'oh yeah.... turns out his closest friend also died in exactly the same circumstances'.
Giggles
07-03-2016, 08:59 PM
http://www.joe.ie/movies-tv/pic-making-a-murderer-victims-death-certificate-raises-doubts-on-steven-averys-conviction/533919
Surprised the cause of death isn't listed as 'LOL.'
Magic
09-03-2016, 02:01 PM
Fucking hell @ The Staircase.
David Rudolf is some man, working pro-bono for more than a decade after Peterson was jailed. He had to give it up in 2014 as he was skint. Interesting about the Owl Theory.
Staircase
It seems crazy to me that he's been waiting for a new trial since 2011. What the fuck is going on?
I wonder he'd accept a guilty plea in exchange for time served.
Magic
09-03-2016, 02:16 PM
I thought he said he'd refused any guilty plea or any proposed guilty plea? He's basically free just now, but still a convicted murderer? It's disgusting about that cunt SBI agent lying about the blood spatter, did you know he also witheld evidence in another trial that caused a life sentence for another guy? He's been freed now too. The state, the DA etc were a total fucking shambles here.
He did, but having spent all of those years in prison, I wonder if his opinion would change after 5 years of "freedom" again. His house arrest was lifted in 2014 so he's basically free for the time being.
And yeah, that bald headed fucker Duane Deaver should be in prison for what he did. As it stands, he just got fired from what I can see. And then appealed and won. http://www.wral.com/state-panel-awards-discredited-sbi-analyst-back-pay/14160120/. How fucking ridiculous.
That weasely little shitbag should have been laughed out of the room the moment that report with fifty techniques he didn't even know about appeared. The extent to which he'd exaggerated his credentials was disgusting.
'One of the best', indeed. Henry Lee you smiley twat.
Magic
09-03-2016, 02:39 PM
The woman who did the autopsy was a smug cunt as well. She's now N.C's chief medical examiner.
Yevrah
19-07-2016, 07:53 PM
Making a Murderer is coming back.
http://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/news/a801864/making-a-murderer-return-netflix-brand-new-episodes-steven-avery-brendan-dassey/
Not sure how they'll fill the episodes given basically nothing's happened inbetween times.
Magic
19-07-2016, 07:55 PM
What's coming back? Who the fuck is Stuart Avery?
Giggles
19-07-2016, 07:56 PM
Blatant cash-in. I'll pass this time round.
Yeah, fuck that. What more is there to be said on the matter at this point? I thought the original run of it was very good too, but wasn't it about ten years in the making or something? I really don't think the subsequent six or seven months since it was released warrant a second season.
Magic
19-07-2016, 08:04 PM
It's amazing how literally nobody gives a shit about this anymore.
Sir Andy Mahowry
19-07-2016, 08:32 PM
I heard about a second season ages ago but I was hoping they'd move on to a different case.
Yeah we appealed and got rejected...
Going to be fascinating.
Shindig
19-07-2016, 08:33 PM
That's the problem with documentaries that don't have a clear conclusion. I watched an awesome one the other day entitled "The Man Who Ate Himself to Death." He topped himself so early in the thing the last 15 minutes are filler.
It is funny just how little you hear about Avery after just about everyone was fucking furious about it six months ago.
Well what else is anyone supposed to say about it?
Sequel sounds shit.
Magic
12-08-2016, 08:53 PM
Well shit. Dassey has had his conviction overturned.
Giggles
12-08-2016, 08:56 PM
Well shit. Dassey has had his conviction overturned.
That's out of the blue.
Sir Andy Mahowry
12-08-2016, 08:57 PM
Good. He should never have been convicted.
Yevrah
09-10-2016, 04:52 PM
So Brendan Dassey's confession was fairly recently adjudged to have been unlawful, but he's still in prison as it's the prosecution's turn to appeal.
http://www.morningnewsusa.com/brendan-dassey-release-serious-threat-freedom-now-impossible-23110612.html
The "serious threat to public safety" line makes me want to fly over there and start taking names. How do these people sleep at night?
Magic
09-10-2016, 05:02 PM
He probably would have raped someone eventually. We all know what those strong, low IQ types are like.
Sir Andy Mahowry
09-10-2016, 05:05 PM
Absolutely mental.
Yevrah
11-10-2016, 02:05 AM
Finally watched The Staircase.
:|
John Arne
11-10-2016, 05:55 AM
Yup. I posted earlier in this thread, the moment the verdict was being read out is probably the most gripping TV I've seen in a long time.
That the verdict was guilty just made it more shocking
Giggles
11-10-2016, 06:16 AM
Where can this be watched? I can't find it on Netflix.
John Arne
11-10-2016, 06:44 AM
Piratebay has it.
Giggles
11-10-2016, 06:48 AM
Are they still on the go? I thought all public torrents had been shut down.
Also, what do people recommend as a good VPN? The last time I Googled PB, I got redirected to my ISP homepage.
John Arne
11-10-2016, 06:56 AM
Opera has a good native blocker that I use to access BBC over here.
John Arne
11-10-2016, 06:56 AM
And yeah, PirateBay very much still on the go (if you can access it).
John Arne
11-10-2016, 07:20 AM
As i'm in a good mood, in case you can't access piratebay, here's the link;
magnet:?xt=urn:btih:308919907f33601de47b7fbc71b123 31b4de4306&dn=Death+on+the+Staircase+%282004%2F2013%29&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.leechers-paradise.org%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fzer0day.ch%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fopen.demonii.com%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.coppersurfer.tk%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fexodus.desync.com%3A6969
Giggles
11-10-2016, 07:22 AM
:thbup:
I won't try it now as I'm on the company network but I'll set it downloading at lunch time.
Yevrah
12-10-2016, 08:53 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzNK7PkCWkI
Impressive Woman, but I didn't realise the tests they can do can prove/disprove the sort of stuff she's talking about.
Yevrah
12-10-2016, 10:10 PM
Back on The Staircase, this is also required viewing.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2257602/
Would have thought those that had seen the series would have been on it, but I can't see a mention of it in the thread.
I think that's the follow up that was in the downloads a couple of people got. John Arne said it wasn't up to much so I didn't bother with it.
Duane Deaver's continued existence fucks me off far more intensely than any of the myriad arseholes involved in MaM.
Yevrah
15-10-2016, 11:33 AM
Indeed, it appears the American justice system is rife with bad science.
As for the follow up, it does go over a lot of the stuff already covered, but there's enough new stuff too to make it worthwhile.
Indeed, it appears the American justice system is rife with bad science.
As for the follow up, it does go over a lot of the stuff already covered, but there's enough new stuff too to make it worthwhile.
Does it go into the 'Owl Theory'? If not, and you haven't done any further reading, have a look at that.
Yevrah
15-10-2016, 11:36 AM
So having done MaM and The Staircase, what else in the genre is required viewing?
West of Memphis is very good, but it's a film rather than a series so it doesn't have the same depth.
Samadini
15-10-2016, 11:42 AM
Have to watch The Jinx as well.
Yevrah
15-10-2016, 11:42 AM
Does it go into the 'Owl Theory'? If not, and you haven't done any further reading, have a look at that.
Read that and while unlikely, it sounds more plausible than the alternatives, well, all bar the obvious one.
The new stuff in it basically covers what happens after 2011, which even though you know is worth watching anyway. Same level of access by the same documentary team.
Yevrah
17-10-2016, 07:26 PM
Watched Jinx over the weekend. A distant third to Making a Murderer and The Staircase, but still pretty good nonetheless.
A follow up would have been nice too.
Samadini
17-10-2016, 07:42 PM
Would agree with that. Almost gave up on it early on, but definitely worth the watch in the end.
The climax was tense as fuck, I don't really get like that with TV either.
I prefer The Staircase to Making a Murderer, but I agree that The Jinx is a distant third.
Given how clearly compelling this stuff is, and how incredibly popular MaM was, I'm surprised we're not knee deep in true crime courtroom dramas at this point. The rush to run anything even vaguely popular into the ground usually gets started so much quicker.
Henry
14-11-2016, 08:00 PM
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-37980721
FREEEEEDOM!!!!
Sir Andy Mahowry
14-11-2016, 08:10 PM
He should have never been in there in the first place, same as Steve.
Magic
14-11-2016, 08:22 PM
Be so good when he Mahow's a few young children and get's 25 life sentences. :drool:
Boydy
14-11-2016, 08:56 PM
Mahow's not the one running a paedo ring inside his own family.
Spikey M
14-11-2016, 09:04 PM
You say that but those Ukranians have a bit of a reputation.
Magic
14-11-2016, 09:27 PM
Mahow's not the one running a paedo ring inside his own family.
I've got a really big family so that's not as bad as it first sounds.
Or does that make it worse?
Sir Andy Mahowry
15-11-2016, 12:03 AM
You say that but those Ukranians have a bit of a reputation.
Those mental looking kids are as a result of Chernobyl not inbreeding, mate.
Dquincy
18-11-2016, 07:49 AM
His release has been blocked.
Yevrah
18-11-2016, 08:04 AM
To say it's an absolutely unbelievable system just doesn't do it justice.
Adamski
18-11-2016, 08:25 AM
I like what you did there Yev.
niko_cee
18-11-2016, 08:35 AM
Wasn't there some poor chap who rotted in a US jail for about 15 years after he ought to have been released? Once you're in you're in over there.
John Arne
18-11-2016, 08:36 AM
There was this guy who spent 40 years in the clink. "Didn't do it, guv'nor".
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/may/19/cleveland-ricky-jackson-wrongful-imprisonment-lawsuit
niko_cee
18-11-2016, 08:38 AM
I'd imagine he'll be committing an entirely inexplicable crime in the near future.
Yevrah
30-01-2017, 03:01 AM
On The Staircase:
http://abc11.com/news/judge-rules-peterson-will-stand-trial-in-murder-case/1605864/
Giggles
30-01-2017, 07:05 AM
I'd forgot all about the Staircase since I got Kodi going. Presumably it's on there, but is it really as good as MaM? Or did it peak because everyone was looking for something similar at the time?
John Arne
30-01-2017, 08:14 AM
I reckon it's probably a little better - due to the amount of access you get to the defendants building their case - it's less hearsay and more evidence than MaM.
Giggles
30-01-2017, 08:24 AM
Grand job. MaM was something the Mrs liked too so she will watch this one as well. Better than going to separate rooms while I watch Man in the High Castle and she watches Greys Anatomy.
John Arne
30-01-2017, 09:00 AM
The courtroom scene when they were handing out the judgement on The Staircase had me genuinely on the edge of my seat - brilliant TV.
Yeah, The Staircase was superb. The follow up, not so much, but worth watching anyway.
Dquincy
05-05-2017, 08:46 PM
Just finished watching The Jinx. Fuck me that was good! Pure drama. Better than MaM.
I grew to quite like him over the series. Felt sorry for him at the end. Also really liked his odd emotionless voice.
Going to watch The Staircase next.
Magic
05-05-2017, 08:47 PM
Got excited thinking Dassey was back in jail after raping and killing a few kids.
Sir Andy Mahowry
05-05-2017, 08:50 PM
He hasn't been released yet.
Dquincy
05-05-2017, 08:52 PM
Someone talk to me about jinx. What a man. I thought the niece of the first dead lady was simply delicious.
Magic
05-05-2017, 08:53 PM
He hasn't been released yet.
No wonder you're keeping a close eye on his conviction.
Dquincy
28-05-2017, 08:11 PM
Just finished The Staircase.
All I'll say is how the buggery does someone get those injures on her head from falling down a stairs?
That aside, he seems an absolutey lovely chap.
If you watched the staircase it explains how it's possible.
Yevrah
28-05-2017, 08:47 PM
It's nearly a year ago now that Dassey's conviction was overturned. He's still in prison.
Land of the free. Except when you're wrongly imprisoned.
Dquincy
29-05-2017, 08:07 AM
If you watched the staircase it explains how it's possible.
In great detail.
I meant a plausible explanation. Not a load of bollocks being spouted by the defence.
You've got to be a moron to believe that she tried to get up a few times and repeatedly banged her head.
Are you 2 morons?
Yevrah
29-05-2017, 08:28 AM
While I wouldn't necessarily go so far as Dquincy, Henry Lee's testimony was dreadful, which was perhaps more him than the defence's explanation, but when I read the owl theory and thought that was the most plausible explanation I did need to give my head a wobble as to why I bought into her falling down the stairs so convincingly.
The jury did him by Occam's Razor.
I liked the owl theory. Made more sense than falling or him killing her.
Dquincy
29-05-2017, 09:10 AM
I liked the owl theory. Made more sense than falling or him killing her.
Surely there would be a fair few more feathers at the (crime) scene if it was an owl.
Hey i found the chap quite affable, but struggle to find another logical reason for the incident.
However, when they read out the verdict it truly shocked me as i was not expecting that. Great drama.
Mazuuurk
29-05-2017, 11:20 AM
Damn, I read most of the posts about this The Stairwell thinking it was somehow related to MaM, and now I guess I know how it ends.
Is it still worth watching?
Dquincy
29-05-2017, 02:35 PM
Damn, I read most of the posts about this The Stairwell thinking it was somehow related to MaM, and now I guess I know how it ends.
Is it still worth watching?
Definitely worth watching. And anything said above is not giving the game away.
Mazuuurk
29-05-2017, 02:46 PM
Cool will prolly give it a go then :thbup:
Browning
31-05-2017, 08:53 PM
Bit late to the party on Making a Murderer, but I'm 3 episodes in. It's fucking good, but I'm not sure why I'm watching when it just pisses me off.
Looks like The Staircase is on iPlayer so I'll give that a look whenever I finish this.
Magic
31-05-2017, 08:54 PM
Looking back its actually one sided boring turd.
Shindig
31-05-2017, 08:58 PM
I can't see The Staircase on iplayer but they have the OJ Storyville episode which I might watch.
Browning
31-05-2017, 08:59 PM
For some reason it doesn't come up in the normal search but if you google it it comes up under a slightly different name. I assume this is it as other sites have the same show listed as 'The Staircase'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/group/p04gftq7
Shindig
31-05-2017, 09:37 PM
Much obliged. That's my weekend sorted.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-42291231
Back to square one.
Unless there's more bizarre shit to come out that isn't even square one. It's game over.
Sir Andy Mahowry
09-12-2017, 07:20 PM
That's batshit.
Max Power
09-12-2017, 07:58 PM
That is mental. Obvs Avery did it but the disabled kid got shafted big time.
Yevrah
20-10-2018, 06:51 PM
It's back. Season 2 on Netflix now.
Giggles
20-10-2018, 06:59 PM
Why? Fuck all has happened since.
Sir Andy Mahowry
20-10-2018, 07:07 PM
Why? Fuck all has happened since.
Other than the Brendan will he/wont he be released thing.
Seems kind of pointless and I've not bothered with it yet.
I’m sticking the first new episode on now.
Magic
20-10-2018, 09:20 PM
People still care about this?
I watched the first episode tonight. Fairly tame stuff, pretty much a catchup episode. Hopefully the rest of the series has more to it.
Yeah, just watched the first episode as well. Watching with my housemate so it’ll probably take a month to get through all ten episodes, but I’m assuming nothing much is going to happen in terms of actual progress.
Shindig
20-10-2018, 09:47 PM
I wonder if they pushed this out due to some contractual obligation with Netflix?
The Merse
10-11-2018, 04:46 PM
Going into the last episode of this new season, and after hours of redditing I’m still massively on the fence about it all. I came away from season 1 in much the same manner as Yev in the opening post - baffled and somewhat forlorn. Then after much further reading, Moreno doubting if eithers innocence and simply feeling that Dasseys conviction was entirely unsafe and Amerys was less so, and that on the balance of probability, at least the latter was involved.
Anyone swayed massively away from their thoughts of two years ago?
Sir Andy Mahowry
10-11-2018, 05:21 PM
I haven't watched it yet but I left season 1 feeling they both should have been found innocent.
Dassey's case should have been thrown out because the moronic police and whilst I believe that Avery did it, there's not enough there to claim he's guilty beyond doubt.
Started watching the new one. I thought it would be shit but so far it has been quite good.
Sir Andy Mahowry
27-02-2019, 12:07 AM
Still haven't watched any of the new season (will start this week or next) but:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-47380658
Avery has won a motion to appeal based on possible human bones found in a gravel pit.
His lawyer says they were not tested for DNA and were given to the Halbach family, a violation of state law.
Kathleen Zellner, who filed the motion, said the return of the bones meant that potentially crucial evidence in the case had been kept from further testing.
Yevrah
07-03-2019, 04:15 PM
If the bones - found near the Avery property - are found to belong to Ms Halbach, Ms Zellner says it undermines the prosecution's theory that she was killed on the Avery property.
How does that work?
It goes against their theory, but doesn't really do him any favours.
Shindig
07-03-2019, 08:43 PM
Let's be honest, him actually doing it would probably the most interesting conclusion to this.
Sir Andy Mahowry
16-03-2019, 02:38 AM
Watched the first 5 now and I echo Pepe's statement about Zellner.
I finished the first season believing that Avery more than likely did it but would have found him innocent due to a lack of evidence, I'm now starting to believe that he is innocent. The amount of shit she's turned up that his previous legal team didn't mention or didn't look into is staggering.
Still completely miffed that the seventh circuit ruled Dassey's 'confession' to be legit too.
Dassey's storyline is heartbreaking.
Spikey M
16-03-2019, 12:15 PM
I only watched the first episode of this, but the reaction of pretty much everyone baffles me. He seems like a massive scum bag. What happens to change that?
Yevrah
16-03-2019, 12:58 PM
That there’s not much credible evidence that he did the things he’s accused of.
A potentially innocent scumbag if you will.
Sir Andy Mahowry
16-03-2019, 02:56 PM
Dassey's storyline is heartbreaking.
It's genuinely baffling how so many high profile courts and judges can look at the confession tape and think it's legit.
The US is run by massive assholes.
Sir Andy Mahowry
22-03-2019, 10:54 PM
Finished the second season.
Really didn't think we'd get to the actual truth after everything the Calumet County Police did but I think Zellner (:cool:) managed it. I'm firmly in camp Bobby (what a wrong'un) and Scott.
I love that Zellner pretty much found the bullshit in every single thing that prosecution claimed, she's great.
Sir Andy Mahowry
04-06-2020, 07:48 PM
1268230349810741251
rip.
Shindig
04-06-2020, 08:26 PM
Really straining for that segue, Kath.
Dquincy
05-07-2020, 01:44 PM
Finished the second season.
Really didn't think we'd get to the actual truth after everything the Calumet County Police did but I think Zellner (:cool:) managed it. I'm firmly in camp Bobby (what a wrong'un) and Scott.
I love that Zellner pretty much found the bullshit in every single thing that prosecution claimed, she's great.
Is the 2nd season worth a watch? I'm presuming it doesn't reach the levels of the first season?
I'd say it's worth a watch.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-62963466.amp?deb=0mobile1gsa&uuld=50.11538,8.67369&expflags=GenieDiscoverability__enable_discoverabil ity:false
Adnan is out. 😎
Spikey M
20-09-2022, 10:55 AM
I wonder what percentage of people in US prisons are actually innocent. Considering the shit their police pull it must be pretty high.
Dquincy
20-09-2022, 11:15 AM
Have just started re-listening to the Serial series. 5 episodes in and I still can't gauge a confident opinion on whether he did it or not.
Spikey M
20-09-2022, 11:53 AM
I remember thinking that he probably did do it - although I can't remember why - but there was absolutely no way it should have got past "beyond a reasonable doubt".
Dquincy
20-09-2022, 12:52 PM
Have just finished a few more episodes and I think you're right. I reckon he did it. There are too many circumstances and stories which point to him doing it.
igor_balis
21-09-2022, 01:18 AM
Yeah I was pretty sure he did it too.
Danny
21-09-2022, 02:21 AM
Apparently, a lot more has come out since serial that makes it quite a poor reflection of the case. I saw something about a documentary on HBO, looks like its called "The Case Against Adnan Syed", that add a lot more to the story.
Might need to have a look since its coming back.
Dquincy
24-09-2022, 07:00 PM
Apparently, a lot more has come out since serial that makes it quite a poor reflection of the case. I saw something about a documentary on HBO, looks like its called "The Case Against Adnan Syed", that add a lot more to the story.
Might need to have a look since its coming back.
Will give this a watch, thanks.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.