Monk on his own

[ScousePig]

Can't see another thread for it. Garry Monk's been sacked. Not sure if this has only just happened or if nobody cares about Swansea. He seemed to do okay after people were sceptical when he took over, but lost it a bit this season.

Brendan Rodgers is the early favourite to succeed him.

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11731/10094275/swansea-sack-manager-garry-monk

[Reg]

Bit of a shame, it would have been nice (and not too surprising) to see him get them out of this run.

They're run very well though, you have to trust them at this point really.

[Lee]

They've been on an awful run but I think this one is a bit harsh. I doubt they'd have gone down which is a success in itself for a clb the size of Swansea. I'd have been inclined to give him another summer window and the first portion of next season unless they looked destined for relegation. Not that relegation should automatically be a sackable offence. Although I guess Swamsea are established enough in the top flight that it would be.

I think he's a genuinely good manager and could be a shout for England in the future. Or could have been; it's going to be bloody hard for him to find another club with the same top to bottom philosophy as Swansea.

[Andy]

Harsh. Although you don't know what's said behind closed doors, he may well have said he could take this team into Europe if you sign certain players and now the chairman is pissed as he's not delivering.

I'd probably have him at Southampton when Koeman goes.

[phonics]

I was going to post this earlier under 'Monk without a prayer' and I bottled it.

[Benny]

Phonics can't handle someone knowing something before him :lol:

This sacking reminds me of Adkins and Southampton, seemed dumb at the time but worked out well for the club in the end. It's all primed for Rodgers to takeover now anyway, so it's as good a time as any to do it.

[niko_cee]

Hopefully he takes Joe Allen back with him.

[Kikó]

I'm sure every time the guardian release an article about a manager he goes to absolute shite. Seems a decent sort. Get him in for Louis.

[Manc]

Possibly the most uncharismatic manager to grace the premier league. He'll probably manage in the Championship forever now.

[leedsrevolution]

It does seem harsh but I feel his success last year was mainly due to the decent team previous managers had built. Feel this would be a good move for B Rodgers to move back.

[ScousePig]

Weren't they going backwards under Laudrup?

[phonics]

Laudrup was sacked for agent stuff and the players that came with it rather than results.

[SvN]

They're after Giggsy, apparently.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/ryan-giggs-swansea-city-eager-to-speak-with-manchester-united-great-about-replacing-garry-monk-a6768426.html

[Boom-Boom]

It does seem harsh but I feel his success last year was mainly due to the decent team previous managers had built. Feel this would be a good move for B Rodgers to move back.

It's perfect for Rodgers. I was surprised to see an article earlier today claiming that Rodgers does not want the job.

He's not going to get much better in England, maybe the Newcastle job may come up but that's it.

[Smiffy]

.....

[SvN]

What a bizarre prediction. You might be right, but that's a total guess.

[Smiffy]

.....

[SvN]

He's never managed a club, so any prediction is based on absolutely nothing. I find it odd how certain you seem to be about it, that's all.

Most people make predictions based on the knowledge they already have. What is it in this case? His post-match interviews?

[Lewis]

Smiffy normally makes such well-informed United predictions as well. This is most unusual.

[ScousePig]

Aren't all predictions? There's no way he joins Swansea as that will rule him out of the Man United job when he flops so he'll wait to replace lvg, as is 100% going to happen whereby he'll be lauded simply because his Man United team actually pass the half way line. Then even that will eventually get tedious because Man United 'fans', the none match going variety mostly who want trophies because they're unaccustomed to long stretches without. High profile manager > new signings > repeat.

But yeah, he flops if he leaves, the quality at his disposal if he stays will mask the deficiencies for a while.

Can you spoiler this next time please?

[Kikó]

Well if Giggs makes it or not at least he's looking to have a go. He's probably getting his arse in gear because his mate GNeviller is now getting first team managerial experience.

[niko_cee]

I think Giggs would probably make quite a good manager, but going somewhere 'to get experience' is the wrong approach if he wants the United job. He should stick it out until Van Gaal gets the boot and then seize control after that. I don't think, at a job like United, it is so much about how good a coach you are. You will either thrive, or events will run out of control. Neville is too tactics truck to not massively fail in that job, even if he turns out to be a better coach than Giggs. Giggs looks like he might understand that, from the few games he took charge of.

[Reg]

That was a weird post, niko. So a United coach doesn't need to be a good coach, and Giggs would do better because he might know less about tactics?

[Kikó]

Any old bin man can manage top football clubs. See Barcamate.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I think Giggs would probably make quite a good manager, but going somewhere 'to get experience' is the wrong approach if he wants the United job. He should stick it out until Van Gaal gets the boot and then seize control after that. I don't think, at a job like United, it is so much about how good a coach you are. You will either thrive, or events will run out of control. Neville is too tactics truck to not massively fail in that job, even if he turns out to be a better coach than Giggs. Giggs looks like he might understand that, from the few games he took charge of.

Not a bad point. I'm not convinced Ferguson was even watching much football after about 2009.

[Lewis]

You get the impression that Ferguson picking a player was motivation in itself, because that player gained confidence by being rated and picked by Sir Alex Ferguson, and everything else just fell into place from there. Wayne Bennett seemingly operates on a similar level these days.

[niko_cee]

Any old bin man can manage top football clubs. See Barcamate.

Many a true word said in jest.

Barca are a good example really. Potato Martinez or whatever he was called had the same problem Moyes had, he never looked right no matter how good he was on the training pitch or with the magic marker (he probably wasn't up to much on that front either) whereas relative mooks like Enrique have thrived on the back of the best front three mustered in many a year and an affiliation with the club to fall back on when things looked rough (Christmas last year).

Giggs, with his blazer and massive club crest, knew what the score was, the 'United way' or whatever you want to call it. Neville might be the same, but he looks more of a busybody, which never seems to work well with top, top players. Giggs' 'will I/won't I bang your wife' laissez-faire approach (I have attributed this to him on the basis of nothing really, other than the fact he was a winger, football's wastrel position) might serve him well - although you'd imagine they'll go with a more established everyboby's mate manager (Ancelotti) when Van Gaal's dogmatic experiment draws to a close.

Or Pep. That would be interesting. Considering how poor the league is at the moment United really are squandering a good opportunity to re-establish dominance with all this ultra-defensive shite. Ferguson would be lolling away with a 10 point lead in the league by now.

[Kikó]

It's a shame (for Ed) that it'll look bad on Woodward if his man is booted out. Writing off Guardiola seems to suggest we haven't got a chance so it's a save face.

Get Giggs in with Keane as assistant.

[Reg]

whereas relative mooks like Enrique have thrived(...)
He had very comparable experience to Pep when he took the job.


Neville might be the same, but he looks more of a busybody, which never seems to work well with top, top players.
Who's this based on? By busybody do you mean somebody who works hard?

If any old bin man can manage a job, as it looks like you've seriously agreed to, why do the top managers get paid astronomical amounts of money?

[Lewis]

It's not 'any old bin man'.

[niko_cee]

Enrique probably had more experience, having been a bit shit at a few actual teams rather than youth/B arrangements.

And yes, the 'bin man' needs some characteristics, just not coaching ones, although with Messi, Suarez and Neymar you might get by with an actual bin man.

Top managers get paid astronomical amounts of money because the players they are supposed to manage get paid astronomical amounts of money, and Fergie's Law (I'm pretty sure he invented it) states that players don't respect people who earn less than them, so you have to pay me (them) a fortune. Do Bayern really need to be paying 'Pep' 58,000 BMWs a year to maintain their bundes hegemony? Arjen Robben's dad could probably do it in his spare time.

[Reg]

Forgot he was at Celta and Roma, was thinking he went straight up from the B team.

This 'anyone can manage' sounds a bit FM influenced. Notice lots of people who have played FM subscribe to this view, thinking all Guardiola does is pick a formation and press continue. Any football fan who hasn't played FM would look at you funny if you questioned top managers' abilities.

[niko_cee]

I haven't played FM for nigh on 10 years.

And it's not what I'm saying. I'm saying successful managers of top, top clubs need to have specific characteristics - most importantly the respect of the players and the media, and a certain amount of collateral to see you through the bad times (long-standing relationship with club as legendary player, for example). You don't need coaching badges to get those things. It's not the only way to go about things. You can be a genuinely good manager in the mould of a Mourinho, but I don't know that ex-players necessarily tend towards that route. Giggs would be better served wearing the blazer with the massive badge, going back to the way Fergie had things and hope that was enough to inspire what should be a very capable squad of players (given the financial resources available). Start down the route of philosophies and you risk ending in Brentville.

[Lewis]

Speaking of 'Brentville', I saw this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtZmfOqLfEw) for the first time the other day. Why didn't they just sack him there and then?

[Reg]

Well yeah, they need a combination of lots of things, and not just coaching ability. I don't think that's ever been in doubt.

[GS]

Speaking of 'Brentville', I saw this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtZmfOqLfEw) for the first time the other day. Why didn't they just sack him there and then?

I could never bring myself to watch the programme. I see clips every so often, and it validates the decision every time.

[niko_cee]

I also never watched it, but peak Brentism must have been when he spectacularly meffed that Shankly quote about interfering with play up. Wish I could find a clip.