Vegetarianism/veganism

[Offshore Toon]

I think I'm on the verge of crossing over, but I'm not really sure what the best route is. It's mainly for animal cruelty reasons, but I also don't want to turn into a wimp.

The advice I've received so far is to just try and cut down slowly or go pescatarian. I don't really understand why fish are fair game if they also feel pain, but I guess it's more living conditions before death.

I'm also worried about complete protein sources if I went full vegan. Is tofu the only one?

[Giggles]

Could you not just take one of those powders that meat heads take?

[Spikey M]

Give up vegetables instead.

[Queenslander]

Nuts and eggs will help make up daily protien.

[Offshore Toon]

Could you not just take one of those powders that meat heads take?
I already do, but ideally you should get your protein from multiple sources. Plus if I was to go vegan, whey protein would be out so I'd have to look at alternatives for that too.

Nuts and eggs will help make up daily protien.
Nuts aren't a decent source of protein per calorie imo and also need to be paired with a grain to make a complete protein. Eggs bring up the cruelty thing again, and aren't even that high in protein.

Ideally I'd want higher than 10g of protein per 100 calories. Tofu only just cuts the mustard.

[hfswjyr]

I've made a conscious effort this year to reduce my meat intake - but mostly for environmental reasons.
Don't think I'll ever go fully over simply because I don't care enough to, but at least I feel like I'm doing my bit.

Science magazines tell me we're not far away from lab meat anyway? That Quorn stuff is alright as it is for substitute in specific dishes already.

[niko_cee]

Legumes! Aren't beans and lentils and the like super good for you?

Not sure it's possible to go vegetarian/vegan (don't go vegan) for ethical reasons and not be a bit of a knob.

[mugbull]

Apparently fish don’t feel pain like land animals do, which is why they’re often not off-limits. Though i wonder if they can feel impending doom or dread, which would probably be worse

[Queenslander]

I already do, but ideally you should get your protein from multiple sources. Plus if I was to go vegan, whey protein would be out so I'd have to look at alternatives for that too.

Nuts aren't a decent source of protein per calorie imo and also need to be paired with a grain to make a complete protein. Eggs bring up the cruelty thing again, and aren't even that high in protein.

Ideally I'd want higher than 10g of protein per 100 calories. Tofu only just cuts the mustard.

Yep my mistake.

[randomlegend]

I think I'm on the verge of crossing over, but I'm not really sure what the best route is. It's mainly for animal cruelty reasons, but I also don't want to turn into a wimp.

The advice I've received so far is to just try and cut down slowly or go pescatarian. I don't really understand why fish are fair game if they also feel pain, but I guess it's more living conditions before death.

I'm also worried about complete protein sources if I went full vegan. Is tofu the only one?

Beans, chickpeas, lentils etc. are meant to be good protein sources right?

Where do you stand on honey out of interest?

[SincereTheRebel]

I dated a vegetarian once. Her pussy smelled like shit. Never again.

[Pepe]

Apparently fish don’t feel pain like land animals do, which is why they’re often not off-limits. Though i wonder if they can feel impending doom or dread, which would probably be worse

Watching a fish flop around when taken out of the water doesn't really give a "having a good time" vibe.

[Pepe]

I dated a vegetarian once. Her pussy smelled like shit. Never again.

:lol:

[Ian]

I think the main thinking behind pescatarianism is "Yeah but.... I really like fish."

Animal cruelty is bad maaaaan but please if you could boil that lobster alive for me that'd be grand.

[mugbull]

Nobody reallllyyy likes fish

[Pepe]

If your ethical framework is basically "minimize suffering," and because of that you are looking into veganism, wouldn't you be much more effective by donating a few bucks to a charity that provides malaria nets or whatever every time you eat a burger instead of going for the chickpeas? By not having to eat tofu you are also minimizing your own suffering, so it is a win-win situation.

[Ian]

Nobody reallllyyy likes fish

People with the correct taste buds do, you savage.

[Sir Andy Mahowry]

I dated a vegetarian once. Her pussy smelled like shit. Never again.

:D

[Disco]

Lobsters aren't fish either.

[Ian]

Fair point.

Are shelled thingies allowed with pescatarianism? Is it just anything that lives in the sea?

[Giggles]

Fair point.

Are shelled thingies allowed with pescatarianism? Is it just anything that lives in the sea?

Someone who is making the big back slapping declaration that they won't eat meat but will eat fish is just suiting themselves anyway, so it'll just come down to whether you like lobster or not.

[SincereTheRebel]

I respect vegans though. I think its a great thing that they do. Go for it. Most never look back.

[Lewis]

If people gave up meat wouldn't every pig and ninety-nine per cent of cows have to be annihilated overnight? If anything you're doing them a favour.

I reckon I could give up meat if I had to, if it was going to give me baldness or some other major health issue; but you would have to take my dairy products from my cold dead hands.

[Disco]

If people gave up meat wouldn't every pig and ninety-nine per cent of cows have to be annihilated overnight? If anything you're doing them a favour.

I reckon I could give up meat if I had to, if it was going to give me baldness or some other major health issue; but you would have to take my dairy products from my cold dead hands.

Being tasty is one of the most beneficial attributes a species can have. And if you're even vaguely careful about where you buy your meat then welfare just isn't an issue (for anyone who isn't a giant wally).

[The Merse]

I think I'm on the verge of crossing over, but I'm not really sure what the best route is. It's mainly for animal cruelty reasons, but I also don't want to turn into a wimp.

The advice I've received so far is to just try and cut down slowly or go pescatarian. I don't really understand why fish are fair game if they also feel pain, but I guess it's more living conditions before death.

I'm also worried about complete protein sources if I went full vegan. Is tofu the only one?

Protein is a piece of piss. All of the soy products inc tofu, Seitan (piss easy to make huge amounts of but there’s a lot of rogue recipes out there), peanut butter is a big fave, as are pulses which are all rounders with the fibre content as well, plus most of the plant milks are high in protein too. My apps tend to tell me I’m on the high end of protein intake from tea and coffees alone.

I’d agree gradual works in my experience - started more plant meals in 14, moved to only eating meat when ‘out’ after a year, veggie all times a year after that and now vegan for over two years. Each step was quite easy in honesty as I did gradually.

[SincereTheRebel]

What is the major benefits of this all?

[Pepe]

What is the major benefits of this all?

Avoiding an existential crisis.

[Pepe]

If people gave up meat wouldn't every pig and ninety-nine per cent of cows have to be annihilated overnight? If anything you're doing them a favour.

Nah mate, we will adopt them as pets.

[Pepe]

At least until pets are deemed immoral too, then we will secede some land to them.

[-james-]

My apps tend to tell me I’m on the high end of protein intake from tea and coffees alone.

Wut

[Disco]

At least until pets are deemed immoral too, then we will secede some land to them.

The irony is (at least over here) there are far more regulations surrounding the treatment of livestock than there are for pets.

[Mike]

How do you know when someones a vegan? They'll bloody tell you :D


Nobody reallllyyy likes fish

They don't have any feelings.

[Boydy]

How do you know when someones a vegan? They'll bloody tell you :D


Alright, LadBible.

[Giggles]

Lecture, not tell.

[-james-]

A load of vegan places in Glasgow use jackfruit as a meat substitute, and while it does taste pretty banging, I struggle to see how it's less ethically objectionable than eating a chicken from down the road, given jackfruit has to be flown over in tins from South east Asia.

I'm mostly vegetarian, I don't really see the point in completely absolutely abstaining (lol at parmesan deniers), mostly because basically all food will have caused harm to something at some point.

[Ian]

What the fuck is a parmesan denier and how annoyed am I going to be when I find out?

[Manc]

Welcome to the club. As others have said protein intake shouldn't be a cause for concern if you're smart about it.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Veganism baffles me, why constrain your life with needless rules? I can see why people (including me) eat less meat than they might have done 30 years ago, as there is far more non-meat food available that isn't complete shit.

[Giggles]

Whatever about not eating meat, why not dairy and eggs? Do the cows and chickens just multiply and roam free or do we dump them all in a big hole and chalk one up to extinction?

[Disco]

Giving up eggs I don't get, they come out of chickens anyway, you can't stop the damn things.

[Shindig]

Surely someone's tried a farm where the animals all die of natural causes? Australia seem to be getting around the cow's farting with some fancy seaweed.

[Spikey M]

Giving up eggs I don't get, they come out of chickens anyway, you can't stop the damn things.

I had this conversation with a vegan and her stand on it was that the farming of the chickens is cruel - caged, free range, whatever. However, she would eat eggs from pet chickens as long as she was sure they were looked after.

[Sir Andy Mahowry]

This one died due to a virus
Perfect

[Disco]

Given that 'natural causes' would be being torn apart by predators I don't reckon that would go down very well.

[Pepe]

This one tripped into my massive grinder.

[Shindig]

Old age, disease, etc. Would you gamble on a Bovine TB burger?

[Kikó]

Chickens, cows and pigs would all die out largely if we stopped eating them which would probably make their existance a little more enjoyable.

I'd be tempted to go vegan but the wife won't have it and fuck having separate diets.

[mugbull]

That would be a first, the husband trying to get the wife to go vegan and the wife refusing

[Kikó]

Alright 1960s.

[Spikey M]

Alright thumb print.

[Disco]

At least there's room for a whole thumbprint.

[Spikey M]

Well that's 1 genuflection for the day anyway.

[SincereTheRebel]

Being a vegan and all that. This is all because we are hoping to find the best solution to cheat death?

[Sir Andy Mahowry]

Being a vegan and all that. This is all because we are hoping to find the best solution to cheat death?

It's just so others can feel that they're better than the rest of us.

[Offshore Toon]

Beans, chickpeas, lentils etc. are meant to be good protein sources right?

Where do you stand on honey out of interest?
'Good' protein sources to some dainty little lad are different to mine. The amount of times I've picked up a packet that says "high in protein" and it only has about 5g per 100g is ridiculous. I don't consider beans a good source of protein.

I'm not a fan of honey, so I don't have to take a stance.
It probably depends, though. On what, I don't know yet. Avocados are supposedly troublesome too. There's a lot to read up on.

If your ethical framework is basically "minimize suffering," and because of that you are looking into veganism, wouldn't you be much more effective by donating a few bucks to a charity that provides malaria nets or whatever every time you eat a burger instead of going for the chickpeas? By not having to eat tofu you are also minimizing your own suffering, so it is a win-win situation.
I guess it depends on whether you trust the charity. I probably wouldn't. As I've gotten older I've realised the best way to help people is to change yourself and lead the way. I'm not saying this is the right choice, but it feels like it might be so I'm giving it a shot. There's a lot of research to be done before I'll be confident it's the right choice, but at the very least I'll learn along the way.

At least until pets are deemed immoral too, then we will secede some land to them.
They already are by some, but killing all dogs isn't really an option.

A load of vegan places in Glasgow use jackfruit as a meat substitute, and while it does taste pretty banging, I struggle to see how it's less ethically objectionable than eating a chicken from down the road, given jackfruit has to be flown over in tins from South east Asia.

I'm mostly vegetarian, I don't really see the point in completely absolutely abstaining (lol at parmesan deniers), mostly because basically all food will have caused harm to something at some point.
This is true. At the moment I'm thinking I'll just eat animals I don't like, so I've basically gone pescatarian as there's nothing in the sea that isn't either proper crap or a total bastard.

Veganism baffles me, why constrain your life with needless rules? I can see why people (including me) eat less meat than they might have done 30 years ago, as there is far more non-meat food available that isn't complete shit.
I've been thinking about it more and more to the point where its ruining my enjoyment of meat. It may be because of living in Brighton, hanging out with vegans or religiously going to Glastonbury but here we are.

[Lewis]

The high protein market is a belting racket. I saw some protein chocolate spread the other day in Asda. It's chocolate spread, but six quid owing to the fact it has twenty grams of protein per hundred grams. That is a pretty good ratio. Except it's still chocolate spread, so those hundred grams are six-hundred calories. Plus you would have to assume that somebody protein-conscious enough to buy chocolate spread with it in would be getting adequate supplies from elsewhere, so what's the point? Peanut butter mate.

[Offshore Toon]

Aye, it's stupid. Protein per calories is a much better way of looking at it. I'm intrigued to see if I'll lose weight or not. It might help me cut down on shit food, but I reckon it might go the other way due to higher carb intake and less fats.

[Lewis]

You'll get that weird skinny-fat build that a lot of them seem to have.

[Shindig]

I've been thinking about it more and more to the point where its ruining my enjoyment of meat. It may be because of living in Brighton, hanging out with vegans or religiously going to Glastonbury but here we are.

Fair enough. Pasta is alright an' all but I can't really live off it. Absence might make the heart grow fonder, to be honest. Like a 3am kebab that'll remind you what you've missed.

[niko_cee]

The high protein market is a belting racket. I saw some protein chocolate spread the other day in Asda. It's chocolate spread, but six quid owing to the fact it has twenty grams of protein per hundred grams. That is a pretty good ratio. Except it's still chocolate spread, so those hundred grams are six-hundred calories. Plus you would have to assume that somebody protein-conscious enough to buy chocolate spread with it in would be getting adequate supplies from elsewhere, so what's the point? Peanut butter mate.

Aye. I'm sure I saw one of those 'how not to throw all of your money into a flaming firepit like a fucking idiot' programmes where the teenage son was insistent on having some high protein milk at x times the cost of normal milk and the upshot was it was of absolutely no benefit to him.

Why are people obsessed with protein?

[Lewis]

For most people going about their day there is the idea that it fills you up more. But then as Offshore said you see shit like packets of beef jerky going for two quid that, because of how small they are, have about ten grams of it in, which won't have any effect either way.

[Smjffy]

As annoying as vegetarians and vegans are, you've got to cater for them and some of it isn't all too bad. I've recently started drinking Soya Milk instead of full fat for example. I'm even at the point of wondering why I haven't had it sooner, it's lovely and so much better. A good source of protein, no cholesterol and it's low in fat.

I personally don't give a shit about animals that aren't my 'pets' as I know where we are on the food chain but equally, if something tastes better and is better for me nutritionally than the norm then I shall go with the alternative.

Diets are overrated. You eat whatever you want so long as you do so in moderation and you get some form of exercise.

[Pen]

'Good' protein sources to some dainty little lad are different to mine. The amount of times I've picked up a packet that says "high in protein" and it only has about 5g per 100g is ridiculous. I don't consider beans a good source of protein.

I use this* stuff made out of dark soy beans as a substitute for mince in quite a few dishes (you can make a decent pasta bolognese with it) and it’s packed with protein(53%).

*https://vegesun.com/en/tuotteet/dark-soybeans/

[Andy]

For most people going about their day there is the idea that it fills you up more. But then as Offshore said you see shit like packets of beef jerky going for two quid that, because of how small they are, have about ten grams of it in, which won't have any effect either way.

Fewling full shouldn't really be an issue if you're following a vegan diet as you're more than likely going to be getting a load more volume.

I quite often make vegan meals and I'm never hungry after

Obviously it could become an issue with training especially if you're already used to 30%+ of your diet being protein.

Without knowing specifics I'd assume a normal vegan diet with a couple of protein shakes a day would be fine training wise.

[Offshore Toon]

It's definitely a recovery issue for me. I'm a big guy (118.5kg on last weigh-in) that goes to the gym, for a cycle/run and decent mooch the majority of days. I've got a lot of energy that I need to shake off in order to not be up till 4am.

You'll get that weird skinny-fat build that a lot of them seem to have.
I'll switch back before that starts to happen.

I use this* stuff made out of dark soy beans as a substitute for mince in quite a few dishes (you can make a decent pasta bolognese with it) and it’s packed with protein(53%).

*https://vegesun.com/en/tuotteet/dark-soybeans/
Thanks, I'll take a look.

[Andy]

Fair enough, that's 40kg more than me. I eat a fair bit if protein and struggle at my size.

I know there are a few prominent Vegan YouTube bodybuilders who post a fair few recipes, meal ideas, what they eat in a day etc.

[The Merse]

Plenty out there for those looking to build or maintain a big build whilst vegan. Some prominent IGers and Youtubeers, but I’d stick to those that are 40+ and been doing it for years - a lot of the young lads expect to just sub in tofu for chicken and end up sick as a dog off the back of not balancing things well and changing diet so aggressively whilst continuing their regimes otherwise. Not that I’m one for it - I’m twig like aside from the beer belly as even when I was actively working out 3 times a week I never had the discipline nor natural ability to build (nor inclination in honesty, happiest at 76kg on a 189cm frame).

[The Merse]

Also Offshore Toon that mince that Pen points to is the same as what’s sold in Holland and Barrett. Big old bag for 3.50, very protein dense so fills you up a treat. Bit tasteless without going in a decent sauce or cooking up with stock, mind. Also, gotta get cooking seitan. Ludicrously cheap and high protein per cal, but I stick to twice a week at most as any more and my shits turn into the kind that only a double hopped IPA of the particularly wicked kind would normally produce in me. https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/seitan#gut

[Offshore Toon]

I was actually wondering where I'd be able to get seitan. I'll check out H&B and some YouTube vids then. Cheers, boys.

[The Merse]

It’s pricey in the shops, for what it is. A pack of vital wheat gluten in H&B is about 2 quid and would the main part of three or four batches of 4 portions of Seitan each. The recipe I like is Gaz Oakleys (aka Avante Garde Vegan) which also calls for gram flour (cheap or sub in soya flour from H&B for more protein and again cheap for the volumes as one bag of that does me for months) and tofu (cheap), takes a good 20 mins prep and 40 mins on the stove but you can make shitloads at a time and it keeps well.