Christ! Church attacked in New Zealand

[Kikó]

Horrible shooting in a mosque in New Zealand. Some videos on Twitter from the live stream which makes it look like some video game. 40 dead, 20 injured.

Horrendous.

[Queenslander]

He is an Australian white supremacist who is a diciple of the right wing over here. His views are those of the Liberal Party and the Murdoch Media. They have been feeding the dogs for over a decade this isnt in anyway a shock just in the wrong country.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Have you seen that statement by a Queensland senator (or is it an Australian senator for Queensland). Are they stuck in some kind of racist nightmare?

[Queenslander]

Have you seen that statement by a Queensland senator (or is it an Australian senator for Queensland). Are they stuck in some kind of racist nightmare?


He got his Federal seat running under the One Nation Ticket. Then left because he was too racist for Pauline Hanson.

Im too dumb to be nuanced. But yes rural Queenalnd is completely fucked it is embarrasing.

White mate Fraser got in on 19 primary votes though the used to be a cluster fuck for preferential scams.

[Kikó]

Yeah what an absolute arse.
1106432989011959808?s=19

[Ian]

Well he seems like a lovely fellow.

[Queenslander]

Attorney General of NSW has reminded everyone that sharing the livestream will get them 3 years in jail.

Myself and tens of thousands of other Australians will be visiting our local Mosques tomorrow which of course wont be on the news.

[Mazuuurk]

It does seem a little off to do a pun in the thread title for this, Keeks :D

[Magic]

What a tactless human you are, Kiko.

[Kikó]

It does seem a little off to do a pun in the thread title for this, Keeks :D

Been reading too many tabloids.

[Kikó]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1q4N7HXQAEmPDs?format=jpg&name=medium

[Queenslander]

Hodda?

[niko_cee]

I'm guessing that Fraser cretin is going to be an FNQ'er.

:face:

Surely the actual problem with the New Zealand immigration system seems to have been letting some nutter Australian in.

[Queenslander]

I'm guessing that Fraser cretin is going to be an FNQ'er.

:face:

Surely the actual problem with the New Zealand immigration system seems to have been letting some nutter Australian in.

Gladstone is a charming meth shithole.

[niko_cee]

Yeah, I'm not having him, although, without knowing how Australian senatorial elections work, I'd imagine he'd get quite a few votes from the Douglas-shire if they were allowed to vote for him.

[Queenslander]

Yeah, I'm not having him, although, without knowing how Australian senatorial elections work, I'd imagine he'd get quite a few votes from the Douglas-shire if they were allowed to vote for him.

Pride of FNQ

Senator Elections cover the whole State.

[Queenslander]

http://i63.tinypic.com/2liaouf.jpg

[Lewis]

That statement is merely the reverse of what you normally get from Palestinians and the like, so it's interesting to see it used in this context.

[hfswjyr]

In disbelief here. We're usually very far away from this sort of thing.


Jacinda Ardern said it was 'one of New Zealand’s darkest days' and many of the victims had chosen to make New Zealand their home. 'They are us,' she said. 'The person who has perpetuated this violence against us is not ... There is no place in New Zealand for such acts of extreme and unprecedented violence.'

"You may have chosen us, but we utterly reject and condemn you."

I first heard there was a mass shooting as I came out of a work meeting around 3 pm. I had a quick look at the news in the cafe, and went back to work. Did not expect the casualty count to be anywhere near this high.


To give a bit of context, we're a nation of barely 4.5 million. Half the size of London. There's not a lot of degrees of separation before we all know someone who was affected in this attack.

[Clunge]

Felt sick when I heard about this this morning. New Zealand is about as distant as can be from the UK but to see an attack of this magnitude as we've seen in Europe, the US and around the world in such a peaceful, unassuming nation is just horrendous. Hope you've not personally been affected too badly, and/or those around you.

[phonics]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1r0KX3X0AAWviI.jpg

Absolutely fucking mental statement.

[Kikó]

5th post in the thread.

[Spikey M]

22nd you numpty.

[bruhnaldo]

To give a bit of context, we're a nation of barely 4.5 million. Half the size of London. There's not a lot of degrees of separation before we all know someone who was affected in this attack.

Bless your heart.

[Bartholomert]

It takes a good guy with a gun to stop a bad guy with a gun. Evil will always exist in the world, only a tyrannical government would criminalize the exercise of basic civil liberties, and when it does, this is the end result. So very sad.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Those famous New Zealand tyrants.

[Lewis]

It turns out that one of my colleagues used to run ballistics seminars for the Army, so I got a great talk on wounds and that today. Apparently, getting shot in the arse is not all it's cracked (arf) up to be, since you are surprisingly likely to end up with a colostomy bag or having your cock taken off, but you have a decent chance taking someone down if they only have a handgun. Good to know.

[phonics]

1106544880753541120

Absolute insanity.

Oh and here's another psychopath who thinks... I'm not sure? That he should have applied for a permit to shoot muslims?

1106542079335952384

[niko_cee]

Gohmert.

:harold:

[Pepe]

:lol:

[mugbull]

Turkish Delight using this as an excuse to promote the NRA is almost as laughable as that statement that insane senator put out

[Baz]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1q4N7HXQAEmPDs?format=jpg&name=mediumWow.

[mugbull]

Also, I have a theory that 4chan and all its spin-offs are the source of most of the evil in the western world

[phonics]

For clarity, That’s 8chan. It was formed after 4chan banned child porn.

[Yevrah]

Only a matter of time before some complete nutjob streamed himself doing this. The media have continually given oxygen to mass shooters and terrorists by plastering their images and 'manifestos' all over their coverage of events.

Truly fucked up shit.

[phonics]

You could literally download this guys manifesto from the Daily Mail embed which was a new low.

[Shindig]

I'm all in favour of restrictions on the press during times of this delicate nature. Pity they'd never be able to push those through.

[Clunge]

I’m a journalist who has previously worked in national newsrooms and national online newsdesks (I now work in trade press) and I can honestly say, 1. I am so glad I haven’t set foot in one for a good three years or so as the escalation in what desks will publish (and I don’t mean journos coming up to them and saying ‘boss, I’ve sourced this, what do you think?’, I mean the editors demanding reports skim social media, Liveleak, etc, for this snuff) has been extraordinary, and 2. I never had to / did do anything of the sort. I think the worst I ever had to do was around the time Isis was chopping off heads right, left and centre and I had to go trawling through some of that.

I don’t have the stomach for it, not the desire on any level to be responsible for it being broadcast. But some younger reporters, 20-21, will be doing this as their first ever jobs in journalism. Mock me all you want, but PTSD / equivalents is going to be a massive issue for my generation of journalists who have experienced the most brutal atrocities second hand. And that’s obviously not to diminish what war correspondents in the field see and experience. But spending an 8-9 hour shift tracking down, watching and editing such footage while doing the basics like interviewing eyewitnesses and victims is harrowing and deeply troubling. I simply couldn’t stomach it and backed away long before I got sucked in any deeper.

I mean, the Mail had gifs of the shooter’s video running on its homepage. It’s depraved.

[-james-]

I skipped through the video. He/they have clearly positioned the camera so that it looks like he's in a first person shooter game. The resemblance is absolutely freakish. It will absolutely inspire copycats.

[Yevrah]

You stick a camera on your head while holding a gun and that’s what it’s going to look like unfortunately.

One thing is for sure, today has heralded the end of missions like ‘No Russian’ in mainstream video games.

[phonics]

You stick a camera on your head while holding a gun and that’s what it’s going to look like unfortunately.

One thing is for sure, today has heralded the end of missions like ‘No Russian’ in mainstream video games.

A video on your head would make it look nothing like a video game. You attach it to the lower rib cage. If FPS view was real, all the characters would be about 5'2 with their head somewhere between their lungs and walk at about 30 mph.

[Yevrah]

Well he stuck a camera on his head and it does look like a video game, so get back in your box.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I saw it completely by accident this morning (checking twitter bleary eyed at 6.45am not even knowing the atrocity had happened) and I can confirm it looked like a video game.

I've always found the dominance of violence as a topic of video games slightly weird but no doubt someone can tell me why that is the case.

[Shindig]

It's a contrivance more than anything. I want to dig into more about why designers opt for it but I guess it's an easy option to put the player into a 'good fight' or something. Film predates the medium so, in some respects, they follow the popular action memes of cinema.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I’m a journalist who has previously worked in national newsrooms and national online newsdesks (I now work in trade press) and I can honestly say, 1. I am so glad I haven’t set foot in one for a good three years or so as the escalation in what desks will publish (and I don’t mean journos coming up to them and saying ‘boss, I’ve sourced this, what do you think?’, I mean the editors demanding reports skim social media, Liveleak, etc, for this snuff) has been extraordinary, and 2. I never had to / did do anything of the sort. I think the worst I ever had to do was around the time Isis was chopping off heads right, left and centre and I had to go trawling through some of that.

I don’t have the stomach for it, not the desire on any level to be responsible for it being broadcast. But some younger reporters, 20-21, will be doing this as their first ever jobs in journalism. Mock me all you want, but PTSD / equivalents is going to be a massive issue for my generation of journalists who have experienced the most brutal atrocities second hand. And that’s obviously not to diminish what war correspondents in the field see and experience. But spending an 8-9 hour shift tracking down, watching and editing such footage while doing the basics like interviewing eyewitnesses and victims is harrowing and deeply troubling. I simply couldn’t stomach it and backed away long before I got sucked in any deeper.

I mean, the Mail had gifs of the shooter’s video running on its homepage. It’s depraved.

What sort of people get into editorial positions to behave like that, or is it further up the chain from them?

It's like they are addicted to getting literally any eyeballs/attention at literally any cost, presumably as they will all go out of business otherwise.

[randomlegend]

It takes a good guy with a gun to stop a bad guy with a gun. Evil will always exist in the world, only a tyrannical government would criminalize the exercise of basic civil liberties, and when it does, this is the end result. So very sad.

You were seeming like you'd grown up a bit in your comeback thread, but you're still the same reprehensible little cunt as always.

[phonics]

What sort of people get into editorial positions to behave like that, or is it further up the chain from them?

It's like they are addicted to getting literally any eyeballs/attention at literally any cost, presumably as they will all go out of business otherwise.

When your salary relies on per thousand clicks rather than thousands 'read' your priorities change very quickly. Newspaper subscriptions sold adverts based on the analog version of impressions and now have to sell based on the equivalent of the number of people who call Mystic Megs phoneline.

[Clunge]

What sort of people get into editorial positions to behave like that, or is it further up the chain from them?

It's like they are addicted to getting literally any eyeballs/attention at literally any cost, presumably as they will all go out of business otherwise.
Few go into it to behave like that, if any. The pressures from above and the constant feeling like your on a burning rope ladder though quickly turn your head though. If you don't do it, someone else will. And it only needs one or two to get promoted up the chain every 2-3 years to fill the boss roles. Believe me, there is absolutely no shortage of candidates out there willing to do this, even if they might initially not know what they're getting themselves in for.

And yes, it's part addiction, it's part knowing you'll just be ditched (and journalism is very clique'y meaning word will spread about your actions). If you get ditched by one of the big online newsdesks, all the other ones will know. And once you're a little further up the chain, there are enormous business pressures for clicks/eyeballs.

[Yevrah]

How was he apprehended?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Few go into it to behave like that, if any. The pressures from above and the constant feeling like your on a burning rope ladder though quickly turn your head though. If you don't do it, someone else will. And it only needs one or two to get promoted up the chain every 2-3 years to fill the boss roles. Believe me, there is absolutely no shortage of candidates out there willing to do this, even if they might initially not know what they're getting themselves in for.

And yes, it's part addiction, it's part knowing you'll just be ditched (and journalism is very clique'y meaning word will spread about your actions). If you get ditched by one of the big online newsdesks, all the other ones will know. And once you're a little further up the chain, there are enormous business pressures for clicks/eyeballs.

It's fucked isn't it? I mean long term fucked, in the sense that there isn't commercial demand for good reporting, or is there some way of salvaging it?

[Disco]

I've always found the dominance of violence as a topic of video games slightly weird but no doubt someone can tell me why that is the case.

It's no more dominant than in other forms of media really.

[Shindig]

The internet fucking moulded this twat. Memes and shit written on his guns and a playlist to match.

[Disco]

'The internet' did nothing, it's simply an extension of society which assholes are as free to use as the rest of us.

[Jimmy Floyd]

It's no more dominant than in other forms of media really.

Is it? I'd say a clear majority of games are themed around shooting/punching/blowing things up/all of the above. Not many antiques, love songs or romcoms. And I say this as someone who pretty much only enjoys games that aren't to do with those things, so I'm always out looking for them.

[Disco]

Is it? I'd say a clear majority of games are themed around shooting/punching/blowing things up/all of the above. Not many antiques, love songs or romcoms. And I say this as someone who pretty much only enjoys games that aren't to do with those things, so I'm always out looking for them.

More actual combat I suppose but no less violence.

[Yevrah]

It's a contrivance more than anything. I want to dig into more about why designers opt for it but I guess it's an easy option to put the player into a 'good fight' or something. Film predates the medium so, in some respects, they follow the popular action memes of cinema.

It's fun. It's as simple as that.

Kids were play-fighting long before they could do so on an X-Box.

[Shindig]

'The internet' did nothing, it's simply an extension of society which assholes are as free to use as the rest of us.

Nah, there's something to be said about the communities the internet breeds. It brings the arseholes together so much easier.

[Spikey M]

We finally ferret Yev out of the gaming section, and it's to defend computer games.

You're a Granddad, lad.

[Disco]

It's an interactive medium too, and a fairly young one, it remains much easier to make an engaging game based around combat and much much easier to get it published. There's plenty of interactive fiction though (unfortunately much of it is Japanese in origin/inspiration which is less accessible by definition) it just isn't the best fit for the medium at the moment.

I don't think there's any less emphasis on violence, it's been a while since I had a tv but when I did you'd struggle to find any drama that wasn't about killing or violence in some way.

[Yevrah]

We finally ferret Yev out of the gaming section, and it's to defend computer games.

You're a Granddad, lad.

I'm not really defending computer games as I don't necessarily believe there is absolutely no link between people playing them and violence perpetrated in real life. I suspect if there is a link, you have to be pretty fucking unhinged in the first place for games to tap into that, but I'd certainly say it's possible.

Either way, I wouldn't ban them as they're fun and millions upon millions of people enjoy playing them without doing so, so I'd say it's a acceptable degree of risk if a link is there.

[hfswjyr]

How was he apprehended?
Police rammed his car off the road, and dragged him out of the vehicle.

[Disco]

Does anyone else remember 'video nasties' (they killed Jamie Bulger), it's a good job we solved that problem.

[Yevrah]

Chucky was fucking terrifying.

[phonics]

I'd like to disown the absolute nonsense spouted about video games and concentrate harder on complete nihilist societal outcasts building communities in public forums communicating in what the majority thinks is edgy humor but for a small percentage is idelogically true. There's a reason you can look through the dudes 'manifesto' and it reads like a better researched mert post from when he was just copying the_donald memes. This is really, really, really bad and anyone that doesn't know at least what gamergate is has no chance of understanding what's happening on the internet at this point in time.

Meanwhile, lets see what the tabloids are saying:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1uvbitWoAIrNeo.jpg

[Spikey M]

concentrate harder on complete nihilist societal outcasts building communities in public forums communicating in what the majority thinks is edgy humor but for a small percentage is idelogically true.

'this'

A few decades back, these people were outcasts. They had no friends and nobody patting them on the back for what is, in delicious irony, a declaration of Jihad. Instead, people called the fucking police.

These days, 'the chans', Twitter, Facebook and Reddit have made it easy for like minded people to congregate, for better, or, well, this.

[Spikey M]

As an aside, the same forces that are giving us the Alt-right, Flat Earthers, Anti-Vaxers and murderous fascists are also giving us 27 Gender identities, Radical Feminism, Super Vegans and the Alt-Left.

[phonics]

It's not that they congregate in these places, it's that these huge forums aren't doing the equivalent of us banning Harold. The first internet age was telnet. The second was the likes of us on fBBS. We're living through the third and none of these places have mods that overlook these communities.

[phonics]

As an aside, the same forces that are giving us the Alt-right, Flat Earthers, Anti-Vaxers and murderous fascists are also giving us 27 Gender identities, Radical Feminism, Super Vegans and the Alt-Left.

Yep but none of these people end up going on murder sprees so I'm not sure it's quite the time for 'both sides'

[Yevrah]

Yep but none of these people end up going on murder sprees so I'm not sure it's quite the time for 'both sides'

But some of them could have a bigger impact on society as a whole.

[Shindig]

It's not that they congregate in these places, it's that these huge forums aren't doing the equivalent of us banning Harold. The first internet age was telnet. The second was the likes of us on fBBS. We're living through the third and none of these places have mods that overlook these communities.

The chans are anonymous boards, right? Oof.

[phonics]

Yev, before I reply to that post. I'm going to ask if you're still applying the 'I only post when I really care about a subject' thing?

[phonics]

The chans are anonymous boards, right? Oof.

Reddit and You Tube is just as much of a problem as any chan board. We centralised the internet and it was the worst thing to ever happen to the world.

[Spikey M]

Yep but none of these people end up going on murder sprees so I'm not sure it's quite the time for 'both sides'

Granted, but would you be surprised if a Radical Feminist ended up murdering a gym full of men? Or a vegan mowed down the entirety of a KFC restaurant? People aren't less mental just because they fall to the left. Less inclined to violence, perhaps, but it only takes a single nutt job.

[Yevrah]

Yev, before I reply to that post. I'm going to ask if you're still applying the 'I only post when I really care about a subject' thing?

I'm not sure what dictates how I post these days, but I'm interested in this subject, yeah.

[phonics]

Granted, but would you be surprised if a Radical Feminist ended up murdering a gym full of men? Or a vegan mowed down the entirety of a KFC restaurant?

Yeah I would considering this type of nutter is outdoing islamists in the attacking innocent people by a ratio of 3:1 and I'm not sure I've heard of a single mass murder in the name of veganism/radical feminism?

[Yevrah]

Granted, but would you be surprised if a Radical Feminist ended up murdering a gym full of men? Or a vegan mowed down the entirety of a KFC restaurant? People aren't less mental just because they fall to the left. Less inclined to violence, perhaps, but it only takes a single nutt job.

The left stuff will have a more pernicious impact.

[phonics]

I'm not sure what dictates how I post these days, but I'm interested in this subject, yeah.

Spikey managed to reply with an even fucking dumber post so just take that one and apply it to yours.

[Spikey M]

Actually, there was that Trans YouTuber that murdered an office of people last year. So it does, and is happening.

[phonics]

Okay he doubled down with the fucking moronic shit. Have a look at yourself.

[phonics]

Actually, there was that Trans YouTuber that murdered an office of people last year. So it does, and is happening.

Okay that's one...

[Spikey M]

Yeah I would considering this type of nutter is outdoing islamists in the attacking innocent people by a ratio of 3:1 and I'm not sure I've heard of a single mass murder in the name of veganism/radical feminism?

I haven't, and I said as much. I'm merely pointing out that the same insular forces are at play, and aren't necessarily a force for good.

[Yevrah]

All he's done is point out that it's a breeding ground for nutters on the right and left. You brought in the assumption that he was comparing what was worse.

It's like Henry. Labour can be an absolute fucking steaming pile of ineffective shit (as they are now), but he'll only criticise the Tories.

Grow the fuck up.

[Spikey M]

Okay he doubled down with the fucking moronic shit. Have a look at yourself.

For what? If pointing out that Wingnuts are apparent, and radicalising, on both the left and right, makes you uncomfortable then I don't know what to tell you.

[phonics]

I haven't, and I said as much. I'm merely pointing out that the same insular forces are at play, and aren't necessarily a force for good.

Then you're arguing against the wrong person trying to both sides a murder of nearly 50 people. What made you feel the need to bring up those movements here. You made a completely seperate post about it so you must have thought it was an important issue to address?

It's been proved over and over and over again that the majority of nutters who kill people are on their side. Stop being a dumbass about it.
https://i.imgur.com/kOGelnK.png

[Spikey M]

Then you're arguing against the wrong person trying to both sides a murder of nearly 50 people. What made you feel the need to bring up those movements here. You made a completely seperate post about it so you must have thought it was an important issue to address?

Nope. I've made my thoughts on the Far-Right clear, then I hit post, thought for a bit more and followed up with an aside rather than editing.

If you think I'm saying that the left is as violent as the right, I'm not. The right is demonstrably more violent. I was just pointing out that both the left and right are getting more extreme, and the previously mentioned websites are largely to blame.

[Queenslander]

Does he mean economic liberalism or social liberalism?

[Shindig]

Okay, that tweet has a fact compared with a hypothetical (albeit one based around a probable or definite event) situation. And I don't think we're doing that in the name of liberalism. Generation Soapbox can fuck itself.

[phonics]

Okay, that tweet has a fact compared with a hypothetical (albeit one based around a probable or definite event) one.

Yeah was a bad post hence the edit. It's midnight on a friday, I'm allowed a couple of drinks edit.

[phonics]

BTW love to get gaslit by nazis for years saying the ok symbol is just a troll and then the only time the press are allowed to take a picture of the fucker he pulls this

https://i.imgur.com/MdpJ0nc.jpg

[Spikey M]

It's been proved over and over and over again that the majority of nutters who kill people are on their side. Stop being a dumbass about it.
https://i.imgur.com/kOGelnK.png

Ha. Just seen the edit. Again, I made my thoughts on the far right pretty fucking clear. Then I mentioned some concerns about the far-left getting more and more loony too.

It really is very nice of you to prove my point.

[Yevrah]

Why is his face pixelated there but freely available everywhere else?

What in the fuck are we doing?

[phonics]

Why is his face pixelated there but freely available everywhere else?

What in the fuck are we doing?

A global story means that many local laws are broken.

[mugbull]

Why is his face pixelated there but freely available everywhere else?

What in the fuck are we doing?

That's what it looks like after getting roughed up by the cops in interrogation

[Spikey M]

Also:

"Then you're arguing against the wrong person"

I was fucking agreeing with you.

[Queenslander]

This isnt even the first terrorist attack by the right in this country. Mosques have been fire bombed plenty of times.

https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-29/firebombing-ant-islam-graffiti-attack-at-thornlie-mosque-school/7552394

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/melbourne-firebomb-terror-accused-driven-by-jihadi-beliefs/news-story/37602cab51537a3814c3c0ef0adf54a6

https://m.thechronicle.com.au/news/toowoomba-mosque-damaged-overnight-fire/2610025/

Etc.

All the warning signs.

[Spikey M]

Why is his face pixelated there but freely available everywhere else?

What in the fuck are we doing?

There's going to be a court case and he shouldn't be prejudiced. I mean, he filmed his self doing it, so I think we're cool, but anyone publishing his photo is walking a dangerous road.

[phonics]

Also:

"Then you're arguing against the wrong person"

I was fucking agreeing with you.

Sorry in that case.

[Boydy]

The left stuff will have a more pernicious impact.

How?

[phonics]

Everyone will be trans by 2050.

[Lewis]

The reason you get less 'far left' violence of this type is that there is no point of reference these days for left-wing violence. During the Cold War you had communists (and various off-shoot 'liberation' movements) running around the world over blowing things up and murdering people, because there was actually-existing communism providing ideological certainty to track towards, and their movements attracted the sort of disaffected flubs who now tend towards either this stuff or Islamism, as both of them - race/nation, religion - are actual things. Islamism is effectively the like-for-like replacement for communist violence, since it utilises the same sort of grievance rhetoric and substance in the West as communism used to, particularly where its converts are concerned.

Tied into that I think is an outlet issue. You don't really need to go shooting things up if you find yourself and your equally obnoxious opinions courted and verified on Twitter owing to your side being utterly culturally dominant. Give this daft cunt ten thousand re-tweets every time he posted 'ugh muslims right?' and he would have been happy.

[Spikey M]

Phonics. Mate. Love. Matey love.

Maybe if I put my political position on show, you'll know where I am, and not confuse me for a Nazi next time. Otherwise, you'll be on Reddit telling the boys about me and I'll be all over 74 Chan telling the Knights Templar about you, and we'll both end up covered in more blood than a whole pack of affordable tampons can deal with. #PeriodPoverty

I'm slightly left of centre. Socially, I'm a complete lefty, fuck the Royal Family, fuck the lords, moar freedom, moar Fred's, etc. Fiscally, I'm possibly a bit right of centre. I was all up in Nicky Cleggs arse back in 2010(?).

[phonics]

Phonics. Mate. Love. Matey love.

Maybe if I put my political position on show, you'll know where I am, and not confuse me for a Nazi next time. Otherwise, you'll be on Reddit telling the boys about me and I'll be all over 74 Chan telling the Knights Templar about you, and we'll both end up covered in more blood than a whole pack of affordable tampons can deal with. #PeriodPoverty

I'm slightly left of centre. Socially, I'm a complete lefty, fuck the Royal Family, fuck the lords, moar freedom, moar Fred's, etc. Fiscally, I'm possibly a bit right of centre. I was all up in Nicky Cleggs arse back in 2010(?).

I apologised to you for misunderstaing and the post you seemed to get annoyed at a post that was directed at Yev...

Please don't exaggerate what I believe, thanks.

[Spikey M]

I identify as a man. With a tiny head. But a big heart.

[Spikey M]

Lads. I'm 6 pints deep. I'll see you tomorrow.

[Spikey M]

Mate. Love.

[phonics]

BTW I'd hope that things like this put into perspective all the times y'all (and me) got into trouble for the f-word/the turk stuff/general arseholeishness. The only potential mass murderer that's participated here is banned and yet we still assume he's done a sentence.

[phonics]

Lads. I'm 6 pints deep. I'll see you tomorrow.

I'd guessed hence me being nice about it.

[Spikey M]

I just started eating chillies again :(

[Bartholomert]

Also, I have a theory that 4chan and all its spin-offs are the source of most of the evil in the western world

I have a theory that 4chan wouldn’t be a popular refugee for disaffected white males and right-wing extremism, if those same white males weren’t subject to a deliberate calculated policy of dispossession and discrimination, in a society which represses open discussion of basic truths.

The Left created this monster when they decided moral virtue compelled a path of self-annihilation for the West.

[-james-]

The "politics" boards on 4chan/8chan are largely responsible for this attack. There is no other place where this sort of thinking and behaviour are normalized and glorified.

[Bartholomert]

'this'

A few decades back, these people were outcasts. They had no friends and nobody patting them on the back for what is, in delicious irony, a declaration of Jihad. Instead, people called the fucking police.

These days, 'the chans', Twitter, Facebook and Reddit have made it easy for like minded people to congregate, for better, or, well, this.

They didn’t exist in meaningful numbers a few decades back. They are a symptom of a deeper social illness.

[Queenslander]

I have a theory that 4chan wouldn’t be a popular refugee for disaffected white males and right-wing extremism, if those same white males weren’t subject to a deliberate calculated policy of dispossession and discrimination, in a society which represses open discussion of basic truths.

The Left created this monstet when they decided moral virtue compelled a path of self-annihilation for the West.

Yeah we Australian white males have it so very hard.

What you think is happening doesnt exist in Australia mate.

[Spikey M]

Oh shit. Phonics, consider your shoulders rubbed, I'm tagging you back in.

[Bartholomert]

The "politics" boards on 4chan/8chan are largely responsible for this attack. There is no other place where this sort of thinking and behaviour are normalized and glorified.

The average 4chan poster has views which would be considered completely mainstream in our grandparents generation. Who has really deviated from the truth?

[Bartholomert]

Yeah we Australian white males have it so very hard.

What you think is happening doesnt exist in Australia mate.

He was responding to an issue of international dimension. Not Australia.

But Jesus Christ he’s a monster OBVIOUSLY and this is beyond fucked up. I couldn’t sleep last night and was sick to my stomach because I made the mistake of watching the video.

But it’s delusional to think this is happening in a vacuum.

[Spikey M]

Mert, you realise he would happily shoot you and your family in the face?

[Queenslander]

He was responding to an issue of international dimension. Not Australia.

I just assumed it was about this particular terrorist act. This blokes life could not have been easier for him.

[-james-]

The average 4chan poster has views which would be considered completely mainstream in our grandparents generation. Who has really deviated from the truth?

I'm pretty glad that social views have progressed from those held by my grandparents' generation tbh.

[Bartholomert]

Mert, you realise he would happily shoot you and your family in the face?

Yes. I also think tolerating the proliferation of Islamism and is accepting mass immigration from the Third World in the West is absolutely insane.

[Queenslander]

He was responding to an issue of international dimension. Not Australia.

But Jesus Christ he’s a monster OBVIOUSLY and this is beyond fucked up. I couldn’t sleep last night and was sick to my stomach because I made the mistake of watching the video.

But it’s delusional to think this is happening in a vacuum.

It isnt. The right in this country have been bombing mosques for 2 decades.

[Bartholomert]

I'm pretty glad that social views have progressed from those held by my grandparents' generation tbh.

It’s pure hubris to assume his generation was wrong about everything, and we’ve somehow realigned our societies in a way that is both an unprecedented deviation from historical precedent, and is universally superior to all societies which existed prior.

[phonics]

It’s pure hubris to assume his generation was wrong about everything, and we’ve somehow realigned our societies in a way that is both an unprecedented deviation from historical precedent, and is universally superior to all societies which existed prior.

There's people having gay orgies all over greek and roman pottery. What's your societal point?

Mert lives on the basis that he's so privileged and white enough that the ethno-state people won't murder him so he goes along with it.

[Queenslander]

Mert lives on the basis that he's so privileged and white enough that the ethno-state people won't murder him so he goes along with it.

Fraser Anning would not be pleased to be in the same room as Mert.

[-james-]

It’s pure hubris to assume his generation was wrong about everything, and we’ve somehow realigned our societies in a way that is both an unprecedented deviation from historical precedent, and is universally superior to all societies which existed prior.

Do we not live in age of the greatest prosperity of mankind? Not unreasonable to suggest that this has corresponded with an improvement in the ways people interact with one and other.

[mugbull]

The reason “that” generation thought the way they did was because they were uneducated and were never exposed to different cultures and ways of thought. That’s the root of that sort of mass conservatism. Modern culture may have a little bit more aimlessness due to our lack of religious foundation, but that’s still a fantastic tradeoff

[Giggles]

Phonics, the world's most foremost authority on everything .

[Spikey M]

I'm sober now.

I was still right. :cool:

[Shindig]

Y'know, we do see left-wing violence. Usually at protest level.

[Bartholomert]

The reason “that” generation thought the way they did was because they were uneducated and were never exposed to different cultures and ways of thought. That’s the root of that sort of mass conservatism. Modern culture may have a little bit more aimlessness due to our lack of religious foundation, but that’s still a fantastic tradeoff

This is a bizarrely simplistic take. For starters, the cultural shift in the 20th Century is probably heavily anchored in a global reaction to the horror of WWII, brought on by rising nationalism, scientific racism and an unwillingness of the United States to accept Jewish refugees to mitigate the Holocaust.

If anything “exposure to other cultures” seems to be the root of much of the complaints of the Right today?

And “a little bit more aimlessness”? Look up changing suicide, mental health, drug overdose, reported happiness, etc statistics for everyone in the United States White, middle class and below (men and women), this new world is hurting them...

[Bartholomert]

Do we not live in age of the greatest prosperity of mankind? Not unreasonable to suggest that this has corresponded with an improvement in the ways people interact with one and other.

The prosperity was created and is currently sustained (at least for now) on the back of the cultural and economic foundations of that generation. We’re just reaping the rewards, while our elites are falling over each other in undermining and destroying everything that enabled the standard of living we enjoy today. Why do you think the European economies have been completely stagnant for over a decade? Hint: it’s socialism.

[Jimmy Floyd]

There is literally zero socialism in Europe at the moment.

Of course there was a fair bit of it before 1990.

[Bartholomert]

There's people having gay orgies all over greek and roman pottery. What's your societal point?

Mert lives on the basis that he's so privileged and white enough that the ethno-state people won't murder him so he goes along with it.

The depiction of homosexuality as normal within the Greek city-states is greatly exaggerated ahistorical revisionism. And regardless, even if true, this would represent an extreme minority cultural moment in the wider scope of human history.

The point isn’t to discriminate against and disenfranchise those who participate in alternative sexual lifestyles for example, it’s to try and understand the macro evolutionary basis for past treatment, and to move forward in promoting a Truth which is most objectively effective in maximizing the physical and mental health of society. This requires open unstigmatized discussion of issues which encompasses all relevant fact, including those which are uncomfortable and taboo. This isn’t happening, and it’s radicalizing disaffected individuals who can conveniently blame their personal failures on the unacknowledgment of these obviously ignored facts, extrapolating from this a nefarious overarching policy of the elites to ignore their interests.

The girl I am trying to court is Jewish, and if I succeed my children will be Jewish. I am a second generation immigrant from an overwhelmingly Muslim country. My interest is to diffuse the Right-wing radicalism, and appeasement of Islamists and refusing to fairly debate (or allow the debate) the benefits of mass migration to the native population, is not helping. Fascists can be bad people and also right about some things at the same time.

[phonics]

Has anyone ever used so many words to say so little?


Simplistic utterances layered in language to shade the obvious absolute void of anything to substantiate within them. See, we can all do it. It’s not you being or sounding smart.

[Pepe]

Dem facts.

[Pepe]

Sorry, Facts.

[Giggles]

Has anyone ever used so many words to say so little?

Bartholomert. Always.

[Bartholomert]

There is literally zero socialism in Europe at the moment.

Of course there was a fair bit of it before 1990.

I use socialism in the general American sense of the word; high taxes, pervasive government intervention in the economy (especially healthcare), large welfare state, routine violation of basic civil liberties by the State, etc.

[phonics]

Wouldn’t that be America from like 1950-80?

[Bartholomert]

Wouldn’t that be America from like 1950-80?

1. No (EDIT: slight hedge, at least by modern European standards).
2. You can get away with being inefficient when you are competing with communists and a decimated Europe, and have a ethnically and culturally homogenous nation.

[Pepe]

High taxes aside, all of the others still apply.

[Yevrah]

It’s always staggered me that someone could go through the education system Mert has but be so absolutely useless at writing.

[Pepe]

It doesn't stagger me, unfortunately. Undergraduate education is a joke.

[Giggles]

Isn't it all just multiple choice over there? You probably wouldn't qualify for a job working in Spar across this side of the Atlantic with one.

[Bartholomert]

Isn't it all just multiple choice over there? You probably wouldn't qualify for a job working in Spar across this side of the Atlantic with one.

It’s not.

[Spikey M]

Change his name back.

[Giggles]

It’s not.

Colouring in?

[Shindig]

The name change is an odd request. Almost as if his proud political compass might impede his chances at whatever law firm he's delivering post to / shooting hoops for. At 27.

[Pepe]

Change his name back.

:D

[Bartholomert]

Has anyone ever used so many words to say so little?


Simplistic utterances layered in language to shade the obvious absolute void of anything to substantiate within them. See, we can all do it. It’s not you being or sounding smart.

1. Your sentence was incoherent.
2. The point of a discussion is to address the points made.

[Pepe]

http://www.gradeinflation.com/figure3.png

Duke. :happycry:

[Bartholomert]

The name change is an odd request. Almost as if his proud political compass might impede his chances at whatever law firm he's delivering post to / shooting hoops for. At 27.

It’s not my actual IRL political compass, more so that I don’t (and never have) actually believe a lot of the things I say. I’m more curious to see how other people respond to the arguments / statements for the entertainment value.

Anyways given people’s sour reaction I’m already reconsidering that policy, I might just stick to sports, no need to rock the boat.

[Boydy]

Change his name back.

Change your fucking avatar.

[Bartholomert]

http://www.gradeinflation.com/figure3.png

Duke. :happycry:

Bad look tbh. But maybe we were severely deflating grades in the past?

[Pepe]

Bad look tbh. But maybe we were severely deflating grades in the past?

Maybe. The average GPA is ~3.5 though, which is pretty lol. Maybe everyone who attends is brilliant...

[Shindig]

It’s not my actual IRL political compass, more so that I don’t (and never have) actually believe a lot of the things I say. I’m more curious to see how other people respond to the arguments / statements for the entertainment value.

You've been at this shit for a decade. Grow the fuck up.

[mugbull]

Has anyone ever used so many words to say so little?

He’s a lawyer, that’s literally his job

[Pepe]

Muggers has a good point.

[Shindig]

"Sorry, your honour. I was only trolling."

[Spikey M]

Are you 'mirin my waistlines sweet gains?

[Bartholomert]

"Sorry, your honour. I was only trolling."

Tbf when your client is more or less in the wrong, the arguments you make are are pretty comparable to trolling to see if you can gaslight the court into handing you some concessions (and conveying to the client some degree of due diligence so you can pick up your bill). Although in my experience you end up convincing yourself that your client is right by the time you're through with writing the briefs, due to whatever psychological factors.

[Pen]

Urgh. Yaeh, so much for self growth. You make quite a few contradictory points too, but it’s too much effort to deconstruct all that shit.

[Yevrah]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-manchester-47603951/christchurch-shootings-man-sent-friendship-message-after-attacks

That t-shirt and those specs are definitely going to stop a semi-automatic rifle.

[ItalAussie]

Mert, if you're just going to come back and troll, don't. Reaction-trolling on a thread about a tragedy like this for your own amusement isn't on.

[Ian]

People could just do the sensible thing and ignore basically everything he posts, of course.

[Kikó]

Utrecht shooting Evening Standard: Several injured after shooting on tram in Utrecht.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/several-injured-after-shooting-on-tram-in-utrecht-a4094321.html

[Bartholomert]

Utrecht shooting Evening Standard: Several injured after shooting on tram in Utrecht.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/several-injured-after-shooting-on-tram-in-utrecht-a4094321.html

Yeah Erdogan was pretty much framing the attack as an attack on all Muslims and strongly insinuating that retribution was righteous and necessary all week...clash between the native populations and Muslim immigrants is a ticking time bomb waiting to happen at this stage, just a matter of when...

No joke, I've strongly considered changing my name because I feel violent ethnic cleansing is a very real possibility during my lifetime (more likely in Europe than America I would think).

[phonics]

Shut the fuck up you fraud.

[Yevrah]

Utrecht shooting Evening Standard: Several injured after shooting on tram in Utrecht.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/several-injured-after-shooting-on-tram-in-utrecht-a4094321.html

The Tinder Box is warming up.

[Spikey M]

The Tinder box has been on fire since 2001 and had been smouldering since the Soviets had a nibble at Afghanistan.

[Yevrah]

We haven't seen anything yet.

[Kikó]

We've been relatively peaceful for the past couple of years. The world is still getting safer.

[hfswjyr]

Quite proud of how our little country has united together over the past few days. It's a very strange feeling of terrorism hitting home. I can only imagine some of you had felt the same after 7/7 in London, or elsewhere.

A few selected lines from the Prime Ministers address to Parliament today.

https://vimeo.com/325113231



Al salam Alaikum. Peace be upon you. And peace be upon all of us.

The 15th of March will now forever be a day etched in our collective memories. On a quiet Friday afternoon a man stormed into a place of peaceful worship and took away the lives of 50 people.

That quiet Friday afternoon has become our darkest of days.

But for the families, it was more than that. It was the day that the simple act of prayer – of practising their Muslim faith and religion – led to the loss of their loved ones lives.

Those loved ones, were brothers, daughters, fathers and children.

They were New Zealanders. They are us.

And because they are us, we, as a nation, we mourn them.




There is one person at the centre of this act of terror against our Muslim community in New Zealand.

A 28-year-old man – an Australian citizen – has been charged with one count of murder. Other charges will follow. He will face the full force of the law in New Zealand. The families of the fallen will have justice.

He sought many things from his act of terror, but one was notoriety.

And that is why you will never hear me mention his name.

He is a terrorist. He is a criminal. He is an extremist.

But he will, when I speak, be nameless.

And to others I implore you: speak the names of those who were lost, rather than name of the man who took them.

He may have sought notoriety, but we in New Zealand will give him nothing. Not even his name.




As I conclude I acknowledge there are many stories that will have struck all of us since the 15th of March.

One I wish to mention, is that of Hati Mohemmed Daoud Nabi.

He was the 71-year-old man who opened the door at the Al-Noor mosque and uttered the words ‘Hello brother, welcome’. His final words.

Of course he had no idea of the hate that sat behind the door, but his welcome tells us so much – that he was a member of a faith that welcomed all its members, that showed openness, and care.

I have said many times, we are a nation of 200 ethnicities, 160 languages. We open our doors to others and say welcome. And the only thing that must change after the events of Friday is that this same door must close on all of those who espouse hate and fear.

Yes the person who committed these acts was not from here. He was not raised here. He did not find his ideology here, but that is not to say that those very same views do not live here.

I know that as a nation, we wish to provide every comfort we can to our Muslim community in this darkest of times. And we are. The mountain of flowers around the country that lie at the doors of mosques, the spontaneous song outside the gates. These are ways of expressing an outpouring of love and empathy. But we wish to do more.

We wish for every member of our communities to also feel safe.

Safety means being free from the fear of violence.

But it also means being free from the fear of those sentiments of racism and hate, that create a place where violence can flourish.

And every single one of us has the power to change that.

On Friday it will be a week since the attack.

Members of the Muslim community will gather for worship on that day.

Let us acknowledge their grief as they do.

Let’s support them as they gather again for worship.

We are one, they are us.

Tatau tatau

Al salam Alaikum

Weh Rahmat Allah

Weh Barakaatuh


https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/19-03-2019/we-cannot-know-your-grief-but-we-can-walk-with-you-at-every-stage/?fbclid=IwAR3wtE-jCvS7CqF4HyIKHkI-DlH2BZYaSBKv7wwllo9K8qy8bGqsqfKmyQk

[Jimmy Floyd]

Of course. I was even on board with Ken Livingstone for a while after 7/7. That Mancunian performing poet, too.

[Lewis]

Bit 'People's Princess' that.

[Baz]

That Mancunian performing poet, too.Argh Kid? I wouldn't go that far. :sick:

[Yevrah]

The they are us line doesn’t work either.