London - Another Attack

[Dquincy]

On London Bridge.

Being reported van mounting pavement and stabbing people as well.

[Yevrah]

Like I said, we're sleepwalking into an awful future.

[Lewis]

Sounds like a Transformer.

[Dark Soldier]

First reply, kudos Yev.

[Yevrah]

Cheers DS - I hope I'm that alert when a fucking van driven by an Islamic fundamentalist moron comes careering toward me.

[Dark Soldier]

I pray you're safe if it occurs. Ten pages of the same shit here we go lads!

[Yevrah]

:drool:

[rush]

Without meaning to go all Arnie Pye, Eye in the Sky; I live on the road behind London Bridge and must have been about 30 seconds' away when it happened.

It's pretty chaotic around here; everything is closed off, so I've just come home.

I just hope no one has been killed, although going by the reports of what happened I would be surprised...

[Pepe]

Still believe car crash statistics have nothing to do with terrorism?

[Dquincy]

I really think it's time we start banning terrorists from this forum.

[Dquincy]

Without meaning to go all Arnie Pye, Eye in the Sky; I live on the road behind London Bridge and must have been about 30 seconds' away when it happened.

It's pretty chaotic around here; everything is closed off, so I've just come home.

I just hope no one has been killed, although going by the reports of what happened I would be surprised...

That is a bit too close for comfort. When/how did you realise something was kicking off?

[Shindig]

Really putting me off going to London in a few months.

[Dquincy]

To think people thought 2016 was a rough year.

Corbyn will sort this mess out (by talking with the enemy, not by pressing the red button).

[Shindig]

I mean, the fallout from Manchester's pretty grim. What with the community leaders saying they expressed concern whilst the anti-terror plods have no record of any conversations taking place. Meanwhile the rise of the lone wolf perp means someone could just decide one day to go under the radar.

[GS]

What happens when we won't meet their "demands"?

[rush]

That is a bit too close for comfort. When/how did you realise something was kicking off?

We (me and my partner) were in a bar when we got texts from other people asking if we were alright; looked at our phones, went outside and saw police cars/helicopters swarming.

Looked round the corner and down the road that leads to Borough High Street (where it happened); people were streaming back the other way towards us so we turned back and came home straight away.

Again, it isn't a case of 'I was in the area so it could have been me blah blah', but I feel oddly guilty that I can hear what must be ambulances/paramedic helicopters attending to people who are obviously injured and are in short walking distance.

[Dquincy]

Met police reporting an Incident at Borough Market as well. This only 100 yards from London Bridge, however.

[Yevrah]

Police are now searching for three suspects, a BBC reporter at the scene says.

He says there are also reports that some people have been stabbed.

Joint van attack and market stabbing by the look of it.

[Dan]

I can't help but find it very coincidental that it happens just before the election :sherlock:

Terrible stuff, and like Yev says it's a very worrying prospect for the future of our world when these sorts of attacks seem to happen every couple of weeks & there doesn't seem to be any way of making progress towards rectifying it.

[Lewis]

Shit Rushie you alright lad? It could have been you. :|

[John]

There have been a few tweeted pictures of the van involved and it's sitting with all doors open, suggesting probably four attackers.

Someone get a livestream of a police radio monitor up. This could be the new board's Boston.

[John]

I can't help but find it very coincidental that it happens just before the election :sherlock:

You're right. It is completely coincidental.

[Pepe]

Is it though. :sherlock::sherlock::sherlock:

[Pepe]

I'll wait for Boydy to give us the rundown on the conspiracy theories.

[Dquincy]

3rd incident now being reported in Vauxhall. Which is also nearby.

[Yevrah]

I've heard numerous people mention that and it's absolute hatstand stuff.

[Dquincy]

What?

[Yevrah]

What?

The conspiracy theory stuff, not a third incident.

[Dan]

America orchestrated 9/11 too, didn't you know?

"More than one fatality", apparently.

[Yevrah]

"More than one fatality", apparently.

We're going to need an updated graph.

[Yevrah]

The Metro live stream on Facebook (I'd link to it but I'm old) has a bloke saying there's an active shooter still out there.

[Lewis]

Stand down. They're of 'Mediterranean origin', so most likely Corsican nationalists.

[John]

Man on Sky now has just been held in a restaurant basement for an hour and a half by police and reckons there were at least two spells of 'intend gunfire'.

[Yevrah]

Man on Sky now has just been held in a restaurant basement for an hour and a half by police and reckons there were at least two spells of 'intend gunfire'.

The beeb just showed a video of a pub being raided by police and the pissed up punters being shouted at to get down below the tables. I'm not quite sure why.

[Yevrah]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4569638/Car-ploughs-20-people-London-Bridge.html


Seven people are feared dead after three men with 12-inch hunting knives reportedly stabbed pedestrians after mowing down up to 20 people with a white van on London Bridge.

The men, described as being 'of Mediterranean origin', reportedly jumped out of the van and began 'randomly stabbing people' along Borough High Street in central London at 10pm.

The car, believed to be a B&Q vehicle, reportedly veered in an 'S shape' at 50mph across the bridge and has driven towards the Shard and is south of the river.

'Rapid gunfire' was heard in the London Bridge area as armed police are thought to have shot shot dead two of the men, with a search underway for the third man.

One woman said she saw three people with what appeared to be their throats cut on London Bridge amid reports that at least seven people have been stabbed, leaving bodies 'strewn' on the road in central London.

One person has been killed at London Bridge - and one of the casualties is reportedly a police officer.

Armed police have also responded to reports of stabbings in nearby Borough Market and shots have been fired.

Absolute carnage.

[John]

Lol at the bloke on Sky just now using it as some free publicity for his pub.

[Magic]

What the fuck is Mediterranean origin?

[Yevrah]

Stand down. They're of 'Mediterranean origin', so most likely Corsican nationalists.

The Beeb reporter has just given a 5 minute debrief of witness reports, not one of which mentioned the ethnicity of those involved and the studio anchor hasn't asked either.

I mean...

[Yevrah]

What the fuck is Mediterranean origin?

An attempt to avoid the elephant in the room/the words that must not be mentioned.

[phonics]

The farce that is 'people don't link Islam with terrorism' carries on I see.

If you don't do it 'in the name of Islam' it's not even called terrorism these days.

[Yevrah]

The farce that is 'people don't link Islam with terrorism' carries on I see.

If you don't do it 'in the name of Islam' it's not even called terrorism these days.

I haven't heard terrorism mentioned once so far on the BBC coverage. I'm assuming that's now also on the banned list.

[John]

It's been every tenth word on Sky. May has already said it's being treated as terrorism.

[Yevrah]

It's been every tenth word on Sky. May has already said it's being treated as terrorism.

Yeah, the beeb have literally just gone with that (they're always miles behind). Shortly after glossing over an eyewitness reporting shouts of "this is for Allah" being heard.

Clearing up the definition of terrorism should definitely be number one on the COBRA meeting agenda.

[John]

Sky have just had their security correspondent on saying it's almost certainly an ongoing incident, and not a case of cleaning up an aftermath.

Jesus, they've called in the RNLI and are evacuating the area by shuttling people along the Thames. Hopefully this is just an overzealous response because it's happened so soon after Manchester.

[7om]

How's the tinderbox looking, Yev? Any sparks yet?

[phonics]

Yeah, the beeb have literally just gone with that (they're always miles behind).

It's called having standards.

[Waffdon]

Getting the snacks out.

[Lewis]

Number one on my agenda is not letting this stuff influence the way I live my life. Alright, I haven't been killed. I haven't even been run over, let alone partially blown up going about my business. And where I live is hardly likely to be the scene of a terrorist incident. Nevertheless, if I let these twats - and that is all they are - make me more security conscious or move me ask certain questions, then, really, they might as well have repeatedly stabbed me in the street.

[Yevrah]

Sky have just had their security correspondent on saying it's almost certainly an ongoing incident, and not a case of cleaning up an aftermath.

Jesus, they've called in the RNLI and are evacuating the area by shuttling people along the Thames. Hopefully this is just an overzealous response because it's happened so soon after Manchester.

I don't know what footage Sky are showing, but the BBC have had a reporter near police that you could clearly see were ready to go and shortly shot off after that.

I'm guessing they're evacuating the area due to the one guy still on the loose. One witness report said he saw a load of cannisters around the scumbag's waist, so they were all properly tooled up.

[Yevrah]

Number one on my agenda is not letting this stuff influence the way I live my life. Alright, I haven't been killed. I haven't even been run over, let alone partially blown up going about my business. And where I live is hardly likely to be the scene of a terrorist incident. Nevertheless, if I let these twats - and that is all they are - make me more security conscious or move me ask certain questions, then, really, they might as well have repeatedly stabbed me in the street.

If there's a regular threat of John Rambo's rampaging through pubs stabbing the shit out of pissed up Londoners, then I suspect this part of the standard response won't last much longer.

[John]

Everything else all night has had it as three attackers. I made it at least four based on a picture of the van. It now appears to be five.

Me > eyewitnesses and police.

[Yevrah]

How's the tinderbox looking, Yev? Any sparks yet?

It's progressing in the way that someone who appreciated the potential severity of this fucked up situation a while ago might have imagined, yes.

[Lewis]

If there's a regular threat of John Rambo's rampaging through pubs stabbing the shit out of pissed up Londoners, then I suspect this part of the standard response won't last much longer.

It's the standard response for a reason. I reckon it would need something genuinely obscene (like pulling off that 'liquid bomb plot' from ten years ago) to alter it.

[John]

The best piece of footage so far is one Sky keep running, in which a late night jogger in leggings and headphones just clearly does not give a shit while all manner of police vehicles and ambulances scream past.

[7om]

Why is this BBC pleb so interested when every police car goes by? He looks like a right wet flannel gimp.

[Yevrah]

An eyewitness describing a woman staggering into the Mudlark pub under London Bridge, bleeding from the neck whose throat had been cut.

:serious:

[7om]

An eyewitness describing a woman staggering into the Mudlark pub under London Bridge, bleeding from the neck whose throat had been cut.

:serious:

People always say "you never know how you'd react in a crisis until you actually experience it". I'm pretty confident I'd shit my pants on the spot if I saw this.

[Yevrah]

It's alright though, he said it won't change his way of life and he'll continue to tolerate people from all religions.

Tolerate is such an ugly word and I've never really got why it's used in this context.

[John]

Sky had a guy describing one of the attackers coming in to the restaurant he was in, stabbing a woman immediately, then being driven back out the front door by the entire place throwing chairs and glasses at him.

They also keep replaying an interview from someone claiming to be ex military just talking complete arse. 'At first I thought it was fireworks, but then I realised that it was gunfire. Some people might have thought it was fireworks but of course being ex military I knew immediately what it was.' Alright, mate, which is it?

[7om]

Eyewitness claims the guys were shouting, 'in the name of Allah' while stabbing people. Oh dear.

[randomlegend]

Stuff coming out about explosions (seemingly controlled) now.

What a load of fucking horrible old shit this really is.

[CJay]

Crazy. I'm considering booking a trip to London, but the wife isn't keen anymore.

What does Cobra actually do? A meeting is called after every one of these incidents but do they actually do anything useful?

[Lewis]

That reads like a seventies joke.

[7om]

I'm just going to come straight out and say it: the board needs Harold back.

[ItalAussie]

I haven't heard from my parents yet, which is slightly worrying.

Now, knowing them, this is almost certainly because they went to sleep at 9pm, and won't even know about any of this yet. But at the same time, you can't help but dwell on worst-case scenarios until they stop being a possibility.


EDIT: Yep. Early to bed. Had no idea that anything had happened until just then.

[John Arne]

6 dead, plus the 3 perpetrators. Police managed to kill the 3 within 8 minutes of the first incident.

They ran people down at London Bridge in a vehicle, then drove to Borough Market and exited the vehicle and started stabbing.

[Spikey M]

Cheers DS - I hope I'm that alert when a fucking van driven by an Islamic fundamentalist moron comes careering toward me.

If it makes you feel better, you're statistically more likely to die a long, slow and painful death whilst being riddled with cancer.

[Spikey M]

Any news on what 'mental health issue' they had? Surely we can just call Islam a fucking mental health issue at this point.

[GS]

"I'm not happy with the shoot to kill policy."

This shit is fucking grim. One thing you can say is that we clearly do a good job on gun smuggling etc. which is why they only have knives. Imagine what could have happened if they had fucking rifles.

[Yevrah]

If it makes you feel better, you're statistically more likely to die a long, slow and painful death whilst being riddled with cancer.

I'm statistically more likely to die by almost any other means, aren't I?

It won't change my way of life anyway, the terrorists win if it does.

[Yevrah]

I'm still tickled by the of 'Mediterranean origin' description.

Sadiq Khan is talking absolute shit here, repeatedly banging on about them hating our way of life, our democracy and that the election has to go ahead as a result. As if any of this shit would stop if it didn't and I suspect they're not that fussed anyway.

6 people dead, 48 injured and seemingly our only move is to change the threat bulb and hold an election.

[Henry]

I wonder if these guys had any connection to the Manchester scumbag.

[Yevrah]

I wonder if these guys had any connection to the Manchester scumbag.

From the probably ill informed speculation so far, probably not it seems. There are just so many of these fucks out there now.

[GS]

You realise that the IRA undertook a similar attack in 1987. Multiple armed assailants on their way to attack, and kill, British citizens. They were also shot dead, by the SAS.

I'm really not trying to be a cunt. I think anybody under 35 doesn't really "get" it. But crap like this was leading the news bulletins for years. They may have different political goals - but the methodology of coercing people into your way of thinking by terrifying them to such an extent they don't raise any objection is the same.

Corbyn stood for a minute's silence to "honour" those who were shot in 1987. Now ask yourself how you'd feel if some public figure stood up in the next week and had a minute's silence to honour these three scumbags. Then ask yourself if that "doesn't matter".

The election must go ahead. They shouldn't have stopped campaigning today either.

[Giggles]

The IRA were right though.

[Kikó]

Agree with that. They need to carry on with the election and campaigning.

It's tiresome these attacks. You've got to be a bad knob to think this is what your God wants from you.

[Shindig]

Three in three months for London alone. You don't even get the dumb home video any more of them standing in front of an ISIS flag stating how 'politics made me do it'.

[Dquincy]

I wonder if these guys had any connection to the Manchester scumbag.

I think they may have timed it for that concert thing in Manchester today.

[Dquincy]

Eyewitness claims the guys were shouting, 'in the name of Allah' while stabbing people. Oh dear.
It was "Allen" they were shouting. Basically, it's Allen Stanford's fault.

[Yevrah]

Three in three months for London alone. You don't even get the dumb home video any more of them standing in front of an ISIS flag stating how 'politics made me do it'.

And 5 foiled in that time as well. That's a run-rate of over one a fortnight. :sick:

[Jimmy Floyd]

'Mediterranean origin' is the new 'olive complexion'. Love it.

[Magic]

To really fuck shit up they should be hitting innocuous villages/towns/cities and hitting places like Tesco on a Sunday, the local cinema on a blockbuster release, soft play areas etc.

That would put the shits up me, constantly attacking London doesn't affect me in the slightest but the MEN Arena one did, I must admit.

[Pepe]

I, for one, am ready to change my lifestyle over this. Where should I start?

[phonics]

I'm not sure. The PM says I'm 'too tolerant of extremism' and that's the problem.

She also won't be publishing the terror funding report because it'll point to the country we just sold a load of weapons to.

Those two paragraphs are completely unrelated.

[Max Power]

The scary thing is the nature of the attack. It must be near enough impossible to foil the plot because there is no plot. I could swerve my car onto the pavement this afternoon and wipe out some people if I wanted to. A big 9/11 type has lots of components and more chance for people to fuck up.

[CJay]

This terrorism threat level indicator is really pointless. Papers continually report it as if it has any meaning whatsoever.

[Queenslander]

The amount of Virtue Signalling the wife bashers are spouting down here has at least given the Asians and Aboriginals some breathing room.

[rush]

Shit Rushie you alright lad? It could have been you. :|

Ha, the closest I ended up coming to being involved was helping a few people outside the flat find the best way to get home (I know; I'm a true hero).

[-james-]

The scary thing is the nature of the attack. It must be near enough impossible to foil the plot because there is no plot. I could swerve my car onto the pavement this afternoon and wipe out some people if I wanted to. A big 9/11 type has lots of components and more chance for people to fuck up.

We're watching you.

[Max Power]

I am a disaffected young male who struggles to integrate...

[Gray Fox]

Apparently from the first call in, it took the police 8 minutes to arrive, survey the scene, find the 3 suspects and shoot them all dead.

If that's true that's some amazingly rapid response there.

[Yevrah]

It's true and yeah, they nailed it.

[Giggles]

They need to be shooting these cunts earlier. Like, weeks earlier.

[Kikó]

I agree. We should abandon the usual justice system and start mass state executions.

[Spikey M]

Nah. Lynchings.

[Giggles]

Human rights should start at home.

If anyone is up to enough to be on a list of possible suspects then they are fair game. Lock them up at least, why wait until they kill a few people first?

[Kikó]

People need to commit a crime to go to prison generally. There is some action that needs to happen whether that's home arrest, removing internet access or having a tag but you can't just put people into prisons without any crime.

[Giggles]

People need to commit a crime to go to prison generally. There is some action that needs to happen whether that's home arrest, removing internet access or having a tag but you can't just put people into prisons without any crime.

This isn't a 'generally' situation.

But yeah, sacrifice the public going about their business. So long as nobody can say you're not being fair.

[Shindig]

What we need is a hashtag.

[Yevrah]

Human rights are human rights, they're not negotiable and you can't pick and choose when you want to apply them.

[Giggles]

Human rights are human rights, they're not negotiable and you can't pick and choose when you want to apply them.

By applying them to terrorists you're taking them from their victims.

[Bernanke]

Read about the Russian tactics in combating Islamic extremism. Apparently a decade ago they said fuck it and decided to go after the attackers families in Chechnya. It was declared that the family of any terrorist would be arrested and jailed, since it was the families responsibility to prevent members of their family from carrying out attacks. Thousands of people went missing as families were rounded up.

End result? The rebel movement losing all of its leadership, and "activity" (whatever the fuck that means) down 90% over a 10 year period.

Start locking up their mums and May might not have to take away our internet porn and whatnot.

[Byron]

By applying them to terrorists you're taking them from their victims.

And by turning up and turfing these people out/arresting them before they've committed a crime all you're doing is ensuring that Muslims feel like they have no place in this society, which in turn makes them more sympathetic of these scumbags/bombing places themselves.

I don't like to advocate Godwin's Law here but you have to take any sentence you would say about Muslims, change the word Muslim to Jew and ask yourself 'Do I sound like a fucking Nazi'?

[Pepe]

Giggles on Muslims is always good value.

As for going for their family, that's exactly what Trump wanted to do.

[Giggles]

And by turning up and turfing these people out/arresting them before they've committed a crime all you're doing is ensuring that Muslims feel like they have no place in this society, which in turn makes them more sympathetic of these scumbags/bombing places themselves.

I don't like to advocate Godwin's Law here but you have to take any sentence you would say about Muslims, change the word Muslim to Jew and ask yourself 'Do I sound like a fucking Nazi'?

Had the Jews undertaken a deliberate campaign to blow up and stab Germans on their streets or at events?

I'm not talking about locking them all up. I'm talking about anyone who has been up to enough to be under suspicion, there's thousands apparently. Nip them in the bud before they can act.

[Bernanke]

Of course Trump did, Vlad probably showed him the stats on how successful it was.

[Pepe]

Of course Trump did, Vlad probably showed him the stats on how successful it was.

Good point.

[Yevrah]

By applying them to terrorists you're taking them from their victims.

There's no taking or giving. You either decide you want to abide by human rights or you don't. If you decide you do, then you need to apply them to everyone. The clue's in the name.

[Giggles]

There's no taking or giving. You either decide you want to abide by human rights or you don't. If you decide you do, then you need to apply them to everyone. The clue's in the name.

They're not applying them to the victims though, so they are choosing.

[Yevrah]

They're not applying them to the victims though, so they are choosing.

'They' are not in a position of power and nor do they claim to give a shit about human rights, we should and we do.

That said, and as I said in the last thread, internment will clearly happen if this keeps up.

[hfswjyr]

Fighting words from May. If she means what she says, looks like they've read Yevrah's post and are looking to change the strategy now.

[Byron]

Had the Jews undertaken a deliberate campaign to blow up and stab Germans on their streets or at events?

I'm not talking about locking them all up. I'm talking about anyone who has been up to enough to be under suspicion, there's thousands apparently. Nip them in the bud before they can act.

Does it matter? You're advocating taking a section of society and locking them up when they haven't committed a crime. If you can't see what's wrong with that then I'm not sure what to tell you.

It's very basic law. People are treated as law-abiding citizens until such time as they commit a crime, none of this 'you've been on surveilance, therefore we're going to lock you up before you commit a crime'

[Giggles]

I never said a thing about locking up a section of society. I said to lock up anyone who is already earmarked by the authorities as a threat. This list of thousands we keep hearing about.

[Boydy]

Action was needed in the UK as well as overseas, she added. “While we have made significant progress in recent years, there is – to be frank – far too much tolerance of extremism in our country.

“So we need to become far more robust in identifying it and stamping it out across the public sector and across society. That will require some difficult, and often embarrassing, conversations.

Those conversations could be embarrassing, couldn't they? (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/may/31/sensitive-uk-terror-funding-inquiry-findings-may-never-be-published-saudi-arabia)

[Pepe]

Nothing to do with Saudi Arabia.

[Spikey M]

The Wests biggest crime is making that backward nation of goat fuckers and woman stoners relevant on the world stage.

[Lewis]

Looking back, we should have never used oil for things.

[Yevrah]

Those conversations could be embarrassing, couldn't they? (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/may/31/sensitive-uk-terror-funding-inquiry-findings-may-never-be-published-saudi-arabia)

I can't think what else she could have meant that would be embarrassing other than actually addressing that.

The funding for those Wahhabi mosques needs to be cut and the mosques themselves bulldozed to the ground.

[Lewis]

I've seen a few people sharing that as if not publishing an unfinished report (which doesn't mean it won't still be used to inform policy when it is finished) is really damning. Theresa May probably signed it off, forgot about it, and now oh where is it and you say Jeremy Corbyn supports terrorists just because he does?!

[Spikey M]

Looking back, we should have never used oil for things.

Nah, should have just Empired it.

[Lewis]

Then they would all live here.

[Spikey M]

As good Christians.

[Henry]

You realise that the IRA undertook a similar attack in 1987. Multiple armed assailants on their way to attack, and kill, British citizens. They were also shot dead, by the SAS.

I'm really not trying to be a cunt.

Worse, you're being a lying cunt.

The 1987 incident that you refer to was in Gibraltar, where the IRA were planning an attack on the British military, not random civilians. Three IRA members, entirely unarmed, were shot dead (rather than arrested) as per the illegal "shoot to kill" policy that had been adopted at the time. So it's not remotely similar, and your attempting to draw a parallel with the event in London to score political points is pathetic.

[Spoonsky]

Earlier last night: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/jun/03/juventus-fans-injured-turin-square-panic-firecrackers

I was there, and thought it seems a bit lol now it was genuinely terrifying. I spent about thirty minutes thinking there was an ongoing attack, with no clue where my friend was. Then I spent the whole night in the hospital waiting room, surrounded by crippled guys in Juventus shirts. It was only today that I realized I still had tiny pieces of glass embedded in my knee so I got those taken out earlier. Really an insane night.

[Magic]

#jft1500

[Shindig]

Wouldn't be the first time Juve fans have been caught in a crush.

[Spikey M]

#SomehowAboutLiverpool

[Giggles]

#SomehowAboutLiverpool

Sssssh, they like to brush that one under the carpet. Tragedy only befalls them.

[Magic]

Sssssh, they like to brush that one under the carpet. Tragedy only befalls them.

I'm praying there isn't a terror attack there purely for that very reason.

[Lewis]

Don't play your new stuff, Liam, you dickhead. Nobody came for that.

[Spikey M]

You don't see a tambourine often these days

[Lewis]

Noel not bothering confirms my theory that he's the actual wanker one and Liam is really a top, top lad.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I usually have Absolute on in the car and they absolutely bum Noel to death, which leads me to believe you're right.

[Yevrah]

Don't play your new stuff, Liam, you dickhead. Nobody came for that.

Seriously poor form doing that at a charity gig.

We should have told Bowie to fuck off when he pulled that shit at the London Olympic ceremony too.

[Magic]

He's not there as Oasis so well within his rights.

[SvN]

We should have told Bowie to fuck off when he pulled that shit at the London Olympic ceremony too.

What?

[Dark Soldier]

Are you positive about anything these days Yev?

[Lewis]

He means George Michael doesn't he?

[niko_cee]

Don't play your new stuff, Liam, you dickhead. Nobody came for that.

:D

The disinterest in the crowd was palpable.

His voice sounded quite ropey as well. Chris Martin's hilarious interjections distracted from that though. I didn't see all of it. Did Ariana manage to coax Morrissey out for a quick rendition of Panic?

[Dark Soldier]

The Sun's headline tomorrow

http://i.imgur.com/7KThua6.jpg

wut :rotate: :ae:

[wullie]

Ariana did her big hit about being sore after a bumming, so Liam could have at least done Wonderwall.

[Raoul Duke]

This is weird/related (?): https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jun/05/saudi-arabia-and-bahrain-break-diplomatic-ties-with-qatar-over-terrorism

[GS]

It's almost as if the cripplingly simple way that some people want to look at it is wrong.

[Henry]

It's not simple at all.

If you read the article, it explains that they're doing it because of the Muslim Brotherhood, who aren't that extreme as far as things go, but who challenge the rule of the Saudi royals.

The Saudi's have also taken many actions against Al Qaeda and ISIS and execute prisoners for membership (often based on dodgy trials of course) but again that is primarily because they represent a threat to their authority. They're quite happy to spread the Salafist philosophy on which they're basesd and they're also quite happy to fund (or allow their citizens to fund) and utilise those groups abroad, as a check against Iran.

So they use the word "terrorist" in a highly perjorative way, to mean "people we don't like". Much as Bashar al Assad does.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Anything that casts the Qataris as villains is good news in my book, even if it comes from other villains.

[Disco]

Has the point been made that these guys must have been fucking crap to only get seven people? They had a van and there were four(?) of them yet they managed to kill less than 2 each (bush league KDR right there), the idea that these were trained ISIS militants seems somewhat laughable. It smacks of desperation from a handful of complete and utter mongs.

[niko_cee]

They also picked a fairly crappy time to do it. A weekday morning anytime between 7 and 10 and there are ten times as many people on that bridge.

[Lewis]

If Qatar has the balls to go all Iron Bank then this might end up being one of those historic mistakes people write/lol about years down the line.

[Spoonsky]

If it takes a war in Qatar to move the World Cup, so be it.

[phonics]

I love how the bigger Qatar issue is acting alongside Iran rather than the proper dodgy shit they've been knee deep in for years.

[Pepe]

Has the point been made that these guys must have been fucking crap to only get seven people? They had a van and there were four(?) of them yet they managed to kill less than 2 each (bush league KDR right there), the idea that these were trained ISIS militants seems somewhat laughable. It smacks of desperation from a handful of complete and utter mongs.

Trust Americans to show the rest of the world how it's done:

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/06/05/531578459/disgruntled-employee-at-orlando-business-kills-5-people-police-say?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20170605

[Disco]

Trust Americans to show the rest of the world how it's done:

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/06/05/531578459/disgruntled-employee-at-orlando-business-kills-5-people-police-say?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20170605

Perfect example of the advantage Yanks have with their stupid gun laws, 1 untrained schlub is able to get to 5-1 while over here a whole team with a van only manages 1.75.

[niko_cee]

Romanian baker Florin Morariu:

When they told him that three men were stabbing people in the market, he headed outside with two crates to tackle the attackers.

"I just threw the crate at [one of the attackers].

"I threw the first crate and I knew he was going to dodge it. While he was dodging it, I walked towards him and hit him in the head with the other crate."

:D

[Spikey M]

Trust Americans to show the rest of the world how it's done:

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/06/05/531578459/disgruntled-employee-at-orlando-business-kills-5-people-police-say?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20170605

If only his colleagues had had guns.

[Magic]

Lol at the attackers. They held beliefs that erm most Muslims do? Showing again the line between normal and extreme is very blurred indeed.

[Bam]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/05/london-terrorist-appeared-channel-4-jihadi-documentary-tried/

[Lewis]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jun/05/martyn-hett-killed-terrorist-saudis-terror-regime

lol

[niko_cee]

When I signed up to a consulting job in public diplomacy for the Saudi Ministry of Foreign Affairs I was unaware of what I was taking on

For the love of god.

[randomlegend]

Abu Haleema (one of those from Bam's link) apparently works part-time as a bus driver :serious:

Little disconcerting.

[Bernanke]

The story of the Millwall fan fighting the attackers with his bare fists while shouting "Fuck you, I'm Millwall!" is amazing.

A fundraiser for him online is up to £30.000 at this point. :|

[phonics]

Ever since the Glasgow thing, I have to doubt the veracity of peoples comments after these attacks.

[John]

It's a great thing he's done there, but you imagine someone for whom that's his first thought in a fight would be a proper arsehole in every day life.

[Magic]

It's a great thing he's done there, but you imagine someone for whom that's his first thought in a fight would be a proper arsehole in every day life.

He's a Millwall fan, so obvs. The sort that would probably glass you without a second thought.

[Lewis]

You need people like that in a war, otherwise you don't have bouncing bombs and Lawrence of Arabia.

[Magic]

No, you need gentlemen, honourable courageous people, not stupid cunts who want fist fights with 'pakis'.

Look at the elites, not a cunt among them.

[Disco]

Bullshit, you want wall to wall sociopaths.

[-james-]

Footage of the police showing up is doing the rounds on twitter and stuff. It's pretty impressive. Bang, bang, bang, dead.

[Yevrah]

Any linkage?

[Lewis]

They charged straight at the coppers as well, which would suggest that they were out of their heads on something or other.

[Yevrah]

Ketamin I suspect.

[Bam]

Ketamin, the drug of choice for all good Muslims.

[-james-]

https://twitter.com/TRobinsonNewEra/status/872521775594315777

[Yevrah]

Cheers.

Had a strange sensation of being proud to be British watching that, which I haven't felt for ages.

Is the chap they started attacking before the rozzers showed up the guy they accidentally shot? Is he ok?

[Dquincy]

Cheers.

Had a strange sensation of being proud to be British watching that, which I haven't felt for ages.

Is the chap they started attacking before the rozzers showed up the guy they accidentally shot? Is he ok?

Amazing response by the police.

I heard the fella that got accidentally shot was in the pub adjacent looking out the window, so not the poor bastard getting stabbed on the street. Hope he survived, he got totally shafted by them.

[Magic]

Cheers.

Had a strange sensation of being proud to be British watching that, which I haven't felt for ages.

Is the chap they started attacking before the rozzers showed up the guy they accidentally shot? Is he ok?

Pretty weird you felt proud.

[Raoul Duke]

The story of the Millwall fan fighting the attackers with his bare fists while shouting "Fuck you, I'm Millwall!" is amazing.

A fundraiser for him online is up to £30.000 at this point. :|

As I read it, they came into the pub shouting about Alan's Snack Bar etc. and he responded with 'Fuck off, I'm Millwall' and then it kicked off.

[Dquincy]

Pretty weird you felt proud.
Not really. He's proud of our police service responding so efficiently to a terror attack.

You nonce.

[Dquincy]

As I read it, they came into the pub shouting about Alan's Snack Bar etc. and he responded with 'Fuck off, I'm Millwall' and then it kicked off.

He probably didn't even realise they were terrorists. He just saw some ethnic men and went all ' Millwall ' on them.

[Magic]

Not really. He's proud of our police service responding so efficiently to a terror attack.

You nonce.

No he said proud to be British.

[Offshore Toon]

I wonder what kind of racial slurs are shouted at terrorists that are excused from being made public. No way your first reaction to getting stabbed isn't 'you dirty p*ki bastard.'

[Yevrah]

Yeah, it's pretty irrational and maybe it is more being proud of our police force (who get a lot of stick, sometimes quite rightly) for responding in that manner than being proud to be British. But then it is our police force.

[John]

Our armed police, when responding to that sort of shit at least, don't seem to fuck about at all. When they pitched up at the Lee Rigby scene one of the attackers had already been shot before the officer was even out of the car.

[7om]

That's a pretty spectacular video. Ruthlessly efficient when you consider the whole thing is over in seconds after the police car shows up.

[Giggles]

How can you make out what's going on in that video?

[Yevrah]

I had to watch it a couple/few times to do so.

Basically the three scumbags were trying to get into one of the pubs, which was on lockdown. An unlucky bloke walks past, one scumbag lunges at him and stabs him before they all pile in. As he's on the floor the police turn up from both ends of the street, straight out of their cars and straight at the scumbags, firing 50 or so bullets to take them down.

[phonics]

Had a strange sensation of being proud to be British watching that, which I haven't felt for ages.

I know it's been commented on but I'd like to highlight how weird this sentiment is.

[Yevrah]

Go on then....

[John]

There's presumably been some hint of a threat at Silverburn, the shopping centre right by my house, today. They've announced they'll be conducting 'random customer bag searches' starting this morning.

[Yevrah]

"Random"

:D

[Yevrah]

That probably needed a Harold smilie rather than the one I chose, but you get the idea.

[John]

Indeed. The comments under their announcement on Facebook were a laugh. A hundred people asking what criteria they'll be using to decide who to search, and a hundred replies of 'the searches will be completely random.'

There were also quite a few people asking what authority they have to search people's bags, the answer to which should have been 'you're on our fucking property and we want to know what you're carrying', but they replied with some rubbish about safety being their number one priority and hoping people would understand.

[Mazuuurk]

I'm pretty far from Nationalistic, but after the Terrorist attack here and how well our Police responded, I also felt a strong sense of pride of them, which given the Police represents the state in some respect, isn't too far from being proud of your country.

(I'm also proud of my country for a bunch of other things, mind you).

[John]

Saudi Arabian team supposedly refused to take part in a minute's silence for the victims of the London attack before their game against Australia. Get the SAS in there and wipe the fuckers out.

[Offshore Toon]

In light of recent events, I wouldn't be surprised if there was another attack today at a polling booth. Then again, the time to do it would have been early doors to stop the maximum amount of people from turning up.

[John]

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/london-bridge-terror-attack-saudi-arabia-football-team-criticism-minutes-silence-a7778976.html

https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/styles/story_large/public/thumbnails/image/2017/06/08/13/saudi-arabia-tv-2.jpg

Fuckers.

[phonics]

Love our allies.

[Magic]

Why would they do a silence? We only ever give them shit.

[Magic]

Some users claimed that observing silences ahead of football matches was not a part of Saudi culture. However, Saudi side Al-Ahli Saudi FC observed a minute of silence ahead of their Qatar Airways Cup match against Barcelona last year.

:D

Cheers henn0rz.

[Mazuuurk]

Trump says these guys are great, so you ain't got shit.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Not observing a silence is the Arabic for 'mate' or 'pal'.

[Adamski]

There's presumably been some hint of a threat at Silverburn, the shopping centre right by my house, today. They've announced they'll be conducting 'random customer bag searches' starting this morning.

They'll be there a while if they're doing "random" searches in that neck of the woods.

[Dquincy]

Saudi Arabian team supposedly refused to take part in a minute's silence for the victims of the London attack before their game against Australia. Get the SAS in there and wipe the fuckers out.

Could. Not. Give. A. Shit.

[Lewis]

It's desperately sad and poignant but among those who died is someone who's British, there are French, Australian, Canadian, Spanish. In terms of our witnesses that we've spoken to so far, out of the 300-odd people, there are about 20 different countries of origin. And the London British population comes from all kinds of backgrounds and every kind of faith and ethnicity. We believe of course that that's what makes our city so great. It's a place where the vast majority of time it's incredibly integrated and that diversity gives us strength.

Oh brilliant love.

[Shindig]

If one went off in Durham, you'd get the same mix. That's tourism, Officer.

[John Arne]

Another whacko with a knife has just been arrested outside Parliament.

[Yevrah]

So I see another moron was at it again this morning, but in better news, he got away alive. Which is interesting for when we catch the fucker.

[Lewis]

The so-called Islamic State are so-called claiming it. Lads...

[Lewis]

https://s26.postimg.org/4b4449a09/DJy_Wt_NFXk_AEx2_Dq.jpg

:lol:

[Magic]

I really am not interested unless it's at least 15 dead.

Not being a cunt, just the truth.

[Lewis]

Sounds a bit like your social life at the minute.

[Magic]

I wish I knew 15 people.

[Shindig]

The only potential interest to me is if it's another autist.

[GS]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJ884bPXkAA_Ppv.jpg

[Lewis]

I wonder what odds you can get on him actually being closer to thirty than twenty.

[GS]

Probably, given they'll all have burnt any identification documents they have.

[Yevrah]

There is no actual way to get rid of this filthy cancer, is there?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Waiting for them to get bored of it is the best way.

[Spikey M]

There is no actual way to get rid of this filthy cancer, is there?

It'll pass eventually. Then some other cunts will kick off. My money is on a Feminist-gender neutral coalition.

[Adamski]

Fucking hell Spikey, last thing we need is Mokbull getting even more uppity.

[Spikey M]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-41302571

This is how it starts.

[Shindig]

"Look out, he's got a knife!"
"THAT'S NOT MY PREFERRED PRONOUN!"

[mugbull]

Dumb af, he (they) sounds like a complete loser though. Only a suicidal person would walk towards cops brandishing a knife saying SHOOT ME although yeah, why not use a taser...

[phonics]

If a grown man can't take down a 21 year old female without a gun, he should quit the police force.

Why's this in here?

[Henry]

There is no actual way to get rid of this filthy cancer, is there?

We have the same discussion on here every time, amid cries of "do something" and dark hints that we have to restrict civil liberties.

Salafi ideology does not arise ex nihilo, and our current priorities are not even aimed at getting rid of it. It is being spread overwhelmingly by Saudi Arabia. Until the west stops enabling it by being best buddies with them, as a society we have no right to complain.

[Pepe]

If a grown man can't take down a 21 year old female without a gun, he should quit the police force.

Why's this in here?

Man? It's the US. There were probably fifty cops, twenty firefighters, three priests and the swat team on standby.

[Lewis]

Whatever the pros and cons or our relationship with Saudi Arabia, I think we are still entitled to a little moan when some cunt blows a bunch of people up. Although I suspect you can't really win on that argument. If the West isolated Saudi Arabia as it has North Korea any acts of terrorism inspired by their shite would no doubt be pinned on us doing that.

[randomlegend]

"They have been the driving force behind Pride Alliance for the past two years," the group said, using Schultz's preferred pronoun.

Lolled.

[Pepe]

Whatever the pros and cons or our relationship with Saudi Arabia, I think we are still entitled to a little moan when some cunt blows a bunch of people up.

For sure.


Although I suspect you can't really win on that argument. If the West isolated Saudi Arabia as it has North Korea any acts of terrorism inspired by their shite would no doubt be pinned on us doing that.

That's a good point. There is a big gulf between being best buds and going all N. Korea on them, no? Could not sell them weapons and share intelligence with them, for example.

[Jimmy Floyd]

As soon as we alienated them in any way, the Henrys of this world (not necessarily Henry himself) would become their best mates, as they have with Iran, Russia, Venezuela and so on.

[Lewis]

Most people who talk about sorting Saudi Arabian influence out seem to see it as a case of stopping them funding mosques and what have you, and, since you couldn't just put a specific ban in place on Saudi Arabia funding mosques (you could, but it would be RACIST like the MUSLIM BAN), doing that would presumably need some sort of comprehensive sanctions regime to be put in place to stop the state and individuals shuffling money around.

[Henry]

I've posted this before. Time for another outing: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-yousaf-butt-/saudi-wahhabism-islam-terrorism_b_6501916.html

In particular.


The most fundamental way to make the message clear to the House of Saud would be to threaten to stop buying oil from them. Given the relatively cheap oil prices these days it need not be an empty threat.

Now, we can argue about the pro's and con's of doing this or that, and whether going down the North Korea route is palatable.
But throwing your hands up in the style of Yevrah complaining about there being no way to confront this shit is dishonest. If we must "do something", then it requires "doing something" about Saudi Arabia. There is no fucking mystery here.

[Magic]

Huff Post. :harold:

[bruhnaldo]

Isn't Saudi Arabia the country with the folks who have mansions just to house their 37 Bugatti Veyron's and the citizens get a check from the government because there's so much oil surplus or some shit?

I doubt they'd be bothered?

[Henry]

Isn't Saudi Arabia the country with the folks who have mansions just to house their 37 Bugatti Veyron's and the citizens get a check from the government because there's so much oil surplus or some shit?

I doubt they'd be bothered?

They're in fairly dire straits as far as their long-term finances go, actually. As you say, they basically write a cheque to their citizentry to buy them off. They're already having to cut that back, and shit may hit the fan if they are forced to do so any further.

[Kikó]

Saudi's are in a big drive to privatise all the national industries - we have the Aramco listing soon for example https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jul/13/city-regulator-plans-rule-change-to-allow-aramco-flotation-in-london

[Pepe]

Most people who talk about sorting Saudi Arabian influence out seem to see it as a case of stopping them funding mosques and what have you, and, since you couldn't just put a specific ban in place on Saudi Arabia funding mosques (you could, but it would be RACIST like the MUSLIM BAN), doing that would presumably need some sort of comprehensive sanctions regime to be put in place to stop the state and individuals shuffling money around.

Seems to me that trying to stop terrorism in The West by establishing a different set of policies in the Middle East is probably not very smart, since Western intervention is probably what caused the issue in the first place. I would think that the best way to go would be to try stopping so hard to 'solve the issues,' considering how fucking shit we are at it.

[GS]

As soon as we alienated them in any way, the Henrys of this world (not necessarily Henry himself) would become their best mates, as they have with Iran, Russia, Venezuela and so on.

This is regrettably true. There's a lack of intellectual rigour in some of these circles that extends no further than believing that American policy is imperialist and therefore the opposite policy must be pursued.

In the event we ostracised the Saudis, they'd simply look for alternative allies, and we'd be no further along. If anything we'd be in more difficulty owing to a loss of regional intelligence. The line of attack would thus become that we've pushed them into the "arms of the enemy" and it's our own fault.

On a separate issue, it may help if we didn't wave potential terrorists into the country to appease a temporary political difficulty.

[Lewis]

So once you have collapsed the Saudi Arabian economy (assuming China and India play along), then what? I reckon an even worse band of Islamic mentalists would take over.

I find a lot of this Saudi Arabian stuff to be a bit like that post-war myth the Germans created for themselves about four blokes using their dazzling leather coats to somehow dupe them all into becoming maniacs. If only the House of Saud wasn't in charge, the non-country full of illiterate, stone age camel fuckers could finally shed their adherence to superstition and backwards cultural norms and become thriving beacons of civilisation like the Sultanate of Aceh or Mahdist Sudan.

[GS]

There are certainly some fine Middle Eastern examples of what happens when a previously stable, albeit unpalatable, government collapses and is replaced by a vacuum of competing interests.

It's a country where women can't drive and they still make a public spectacle of executing people. The current King (and Crown Prince) are acting as blocks and mitigating the nutjob element, if anything. Undermining them domestically would only make it much, much worse if they actually collapsed. It would be Syria in overdrive.

[Henry]

So once you have collapsed the Saudi Arabian economy (assuming China and India play along), then what? I reckon an even worse band of Islamic mentalists would take over.

I find a lot of this Saudi Arabian stuff to be a bit like that post-war myth the Germans created for themselves about four blokes using their dazzling leather coats to somehow dupe them all into becoming maniacs. If only the House of Saud wasn't in charge, the non-country full of illiterate, stone age camel fuckers could finally shed their adherence to superstition and backwards cultural norms and become thriving beacons of civilisation like the Sultanate of Aceh or Mahdist Sudan.

Who said anything of the sort? This is a difficult situation which has taken a long time to get like this. Any effort to mitigate it will also take a long time, so stop trying to misrepresent hard solutions as a quick fix.

As for the "worse band of Islamic mentalists", who are they exactly? The opposition in Saudi Arabia, such that it is, consists of people like the Muslim Brotherhood, a marginal Shia minority and Al Qaeda type lunatics. They're all heavily repressed. Any change of leadership is going to come from within the current regime to one extent or another - if it comes to that, as I'm willing to bet that they care more about maintaining their rule than being able to fund extremism abroad.

These are of course the standard lines from those who don't actually care enough about terrorist attacks to want to do anything serious to stop them. It's why you hear fuck all about this in the media and the repeated terrorist incidents are portrayed as originating solely from losers with an internet connection. Quick - censor Google! That will stop them!

[Lewis]

These 'hard solutions' are rubbish though. Let's say they go along with the oil threat, go all out to preserve their rule, and the foreign extremism funding dries up (and as a bonus we avert the worst Islamic mental vs Islamic mental civil war imaginable, because Egypt, Turkey, and Qatar graciously sit this one out). Great. But how long until Indonesia forgets what has been imported? What do you do to stop Pakistan being completely shit? Will Bangladesh join the 21st century whilst we are still living in it? Unless you want to try coercing them as well; but how do you really do that other than bolstering lots of ruthlessly secular government who would more than likely have to do away with thousands upon thousands of beardy troublemakers? It's all rather reminiscent of when you used to advocate tax policies predicated upon the entire developed world adopting them.

There is a large part of the world dominated by a shit, pre-modern culture. That Pakistan in 2017 has electricity and readily available shoes doesn't alter the fact that it is for all intents and purposes a medieval society. We can't realistically destroy it, so we can only do what we can to stop it (or any more of it) coming over here. That is the only long-term solution beyond whatever policing measures can be taken without completely eradicating muh freedoms.

[Henry]

But how long until Indonesia forgets what has been imported? What do you do to stop Pakistan being completely shit? Will Bangladesh join the 21st century whilst we are still living in it?

I suggest that it would probably get significantly better (in terms of fanatic Salafists) gradually over many years. It's a start. You can't unwind this shit overnight. That's not a reason to continue with the much more "rubbish" strategy of enabling it and simultaneously pretending that there's nothing to be done.


It's all rather reminiscent of when you used to advocate tax policies predicated upon the entire developed world adopting them.

That's actually Thomas Piketty, and it is recognised that such a policy (a global wealth tax) is currently not feasible, however great an idea it is.

[Spikey M]

I remember watching a documentary on the targeting of prisoners in particular. It's a genius and terrifying idea. Take a violent criminal, convince them god wants them to kill everyone and you're golden.

How the government let the prison system become flooded with extremist text is beyond me.

[Boydy]

Remember when they stuck all the nutters in Iraq together in a prison and let them formulate plans?

[Magic]

I might go in to prison and try and indoctrinate people with compassion and love.

[Spikey M]

"But didn't you murder your wife mate?"

[Magic]

You can't just walk in to prison, mate.

[Yevrah]

We have the same discussion on here every time, amid cries of "do something" and dark hints that we have to restrict civil liberties.

Salafi ideology does not arise ex nihilo, and our current priorities are not even aimed at getting rid of it. It is being spread overwhelmingly by Saudi Arabia. Until the west stops enabling it by being best buddies with them, as a society we have no right to complain.

You need to disabuse yourself of the notion that if the west were to kick Saudi Arabia out this all goes away. Not everything that happens is always entirely our fault.

[Magic]

Madman with a gun running around Oxford Circus. Unsure as to whether it's a Salami or not.

EDIT: Explosions heard now apparently. 'rist confirmed.

[SvN]

Hopefully turns out to be nothing.