Hillsborough Inquest

[Magic]

Basically finding that the #96 were unlawfully killed.

Guess this means a barrage of lawsuits?

[Gray Fox]

Only took the 27 years.

Hopefully this means the families of the victims suing left right and centre.

[Magic]

Brilliant, more public money down the drain. What it needs is a crap load of jail terms.

[Gray Fox]

A lot of the people involved are mostly old, dead or dying. The time for jail terms has long since passed.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Who exactly are they going to sue? South Yorkshire Police? The family of some dead Sheffield Wednesday administrator from 27 years ago?

[phonics]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cg9mS66WMAIFXGT.jpg

Crikey, can you imagine sending a letter out like that today?

[Gray Fox]

Who exactly are they going to sue? South Yorkshire Police? The family of some dead Sheffield Wednesday administrator from 27 years ago?

A verdict of unlawful killing says to me someone must therefore be at fault. You'd imagine it would be South Yorkshire Police that will bare the brunt of it. Along with anyone involved in helping the cover up(assuming they're still alive).

[Magic]

It's taken out of context #ATTHETIME.

Didn't most of the public feel that it was footie hooligans that were to blame?

[Gray Fox]

Didn't most of the public feel that it was footie hooligans that were to blame?

Yep. Newspaper reports of the incident combined with police cover up both pointed the blame back to the fans. What had happened in Heysel not long before really didn't help either.

[John]

That letter is great, but who was writing to him about THE 96 years after he was relevant?

[Disco]

It's understandable when the footage of people rushing the gates outside is presented as the cause that people would conclude it was the cause.

[John Arne]

That letter is great, but who was writing to him about THE 96 years after he was relevant?

The Hillsborough documentary first went out in 1996... so could have prompted that letter.

EDIT: Nope, scrub that. Apparently the documentary aired at the end of the year.

[Jimmy Floyd]

A verdict of unlawful killing says to me someone must therefore be at fault. You'd imagine it would be South Yorkshire Police that will bare the brunt of it. Along with anyone involved in helping the cover up(assuming they're still alive).

How do you sue a police force? Are the damages coming out of today's crime fighting budget, or is retired PC Ploddlethwaite who was negligent on the day coughing up from his jar of pennies under the bed?

[Gray Fox]

How do you sue a police force? Are the damages coming out of today's crime fighting budget, or is retired PC Ploddlethwaite who was negligent on the day coughing up from his jar of pennies under the bed?

I've no idea. Nothing like this happening before comes to mind. The families might not even take any further action to be fair. They might see this as a chance to put the issue to bed.

[SvN]

The families might not even take any further action to be fair. They might see this as a chance to put the issue to bed.

That's a bloody good joke mate. As if they're going to pass up the chance to earn a few quid.

[John Arne]

The police have been sued lots of times - and obviously, any financial damages would come out of "today's crime fighting budget" - where else would it come from?

[John]

The police have been sued lots of times - and obviously, any financial damages would come out of "today's crime fighting budget" - where else would it come from?

Not by a few hundred people at once.

I'd lol my head off if one of them was robbed and kicked off in the press about the police taking two hours to turn up.

[Gray Fox]

That's a bloody good joke mate. As if they're going to pass up the chance to earn a few quid.

Like I say, I've no idea where it goes from here. No doubt there'll at very least be one family who will try.

The Jury has found the Police contributed to a dangerous situation and were in error. They also found that Kevin Williams was potentially still alive over 30 minutes after being pulled out of the crowd. The police denied ambulance access for a long time and so he could have been saved.
They've also found the Liverpool fans did not contribute to a dangerous situation.

It's pretty open for anyone who does want to sue to be fair.

[John]

They've also found the Liverpool fans did not contribute to a dangerous situation.

:D

They were the dangerous situation.

[Jimmy Floyd]

What I'm really asking is: does this verdict constitute the much sought after justice, or does the search go on?

[Gray Fox]

What I'm really asking is: does this verdict constitute the much sought after justice, or does the search go on?

I'd say that's justice done.

[SvN]

Michael Owen reacts:

http://i.imgur.com/uuEl5CK.png

[Byron]

Difference between a cow and a tradegy?

Scousers can't milk a cow.

[John]

Is a tradegy a prodigy in training?

[Davgooner]

Predictable verdict.

[Magic]

Interesting, they were saying the law in 1989 will apply, NOT current law (you'd imagine, especially with HSE that they would have been fucking crucifixions with today's law). Also the criminal court will acknowledge the inquest's findings but no more.

The CPS head honcho was saying (a fair point too) that inquests and criminal differ in that it is absolute questioning for the jury (i.e not probable, not might have etc).

So they need to be found guilty of being DIRECTLY responsible for things like manslaughter due to negligence, perverting course of justice etc. Very difficult I'd imagine to get a jury to unanimously agree on that. Though they'll easily convict a couple of moshers of a satanic, sexual rape/murder of three boys without any evidence at all. Good system.

[Magic]

At these inquests, he admitted he had given “no thought” to where the people would go if he opened the gate. He had not considered the risk of overcrowding. He had not foreseen that people would naturally go down the tunnel to the central pens right in front of them. He had not realised he should do anything to close off that tunnel. The majority of the 2,000 people allowed in through gate C went straight down the tunnel to the central pens, and gross overcrowding there caused the terrible crush. Of the 96 people who died, 30 were still outside the turnstiles at 2.52pm. They went in through gate C when invited by police, and were crushed in the central pens barely 10 minutes later.

Fuck. :|

[Lewis]

They should sue Michael Owen for unlawful crying and gut dropping.

[Baz]

Most people originally involved in The Hillsborough Committee (:harold:) stepped away a long time ago due to some people being appointed they didn't agree with. Probably wish they'd seen it through, now they know the verdict.

Not really sure what'll happen next, really. At least the traffic around Warrington won't be quite as bad.

[Disco]

Michael Owen reacts:

http://i.imgur.com/uuEl5CK.png

Either I'm reading the timestamp wrongly or he posted that a full seven hours before the verdict was given. What a bunch of idiots.

[SvN]

Think it's just a different timezone.

[GS]

:D

They were the dangerous situation.

The issue was specifically addressed by the jury:

QUESTION 7: Behaviour of the supporters

Was there any behaviour on the part of the football supporters which caused or contributed to the dangerous situation at the Leppings Lane turnstiles? Yes or no.

Jury verdict: No.

Was there any behaviour on the part of the football supporters which may have caused or contributed to the dangerous situation at the Leppings Lane turnstiles? Yes or no.

Jury verdict: No.


Whatever anyone thought previously, this has been the result of a two year inquest and these are the findings of a nine-man jury. I don't see any reason why the verdicts delivered today shouldn't be accepted by people.

[Lewis]

Would the jury have had to put their careers/lives on hold for two years? Why would you?

[Baz]

Cos your job sucks.

Plus justice.

[Gray Fox]

It'll be interesting to see every paper bar one with a full page spread on this tomorrow.

As they were explicitly banned from entering the room for the inquests.

[Magic]

Would the jury have had to put their careers/lives on hold for two years? Why would you?

I'd love to essentially have two years off. Full pay, right?

[SvN]

https://www.gov.uk/jury-service/what-you-can-claim

Looking at that, they can fuck off if they think I'm ever doing jury service.

[Magic]

LOL at those expenses.

[SvN]

If I were to do a trial that lasted 10 days, I'd basically be earning less than 50% of my usual wage. How they can insist that this is compulsory is an absolute joke. I'd never really investigated this before, but I assumed they'd cover your wages while you were there.

[Baz]

When I was called up for jury service, I wasn't even bothered about the money cos I didn't like my job. My boss wrote a letter saying I couldn't be excused from work because I was too important and they just cancelled it. :(

[SvN]

Suddenly makes sense why juries are often filled with spastics and pensioners.

[Jase]

With any luck the CPS will follow up on this and begin criminal proceedings against those that were responsible that are still alive, but I'm not holding my breath.

[Shindig]

Seems like you could sue several parties in this, including Sheffield Wednesday.

[GS]

The coverage is quite interesting, although of tomorrow's papers I think the most ill-judged has to be the Socialist Worker:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cg_jahaWIAEbWzy.jpg

[Shindig]

Christ, that's an angry publication.

[CJay]

I'm not really au fait with everything surrounding this - why is The Times not putting this on the front page for tomorrow?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Some ivory tower bean counter at News Corp or whatever it's called now will have calculated not to. Pretty fucking stupid really. I don't think any editorial or journalistic staff would ever make that decision in that direction.

[Davgooner]

The Sun has apologised for the third time. :moop:

[phonics]

Some ivory tower bean counter at News Corp or whatever it's called now will have calculated not to. Pretty fucking stupid really. I don't think any editorial or journalistic staff would ever make that decision in that direction.

And then they got called out for it and included it anyway.

Last nights:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cg_4e4KWIAEJu2K.jpg:large

This morning:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ChCCNshW4AAWYox.jpg:large

[Shindig]

The Sun has apologised for the third time. :moop:

No front page coverage apparently so INJUSTICE.

[SvN]

RAWK are going mental about The Times and vowing to boycott it. :baz:

[SvN]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypE5TG2UPNk&

I'd never seen this, a fascinating watch.

[Henry]

The Sun has apologised for the third time. :moop:

Good, although it appeared just as calculating as all of their apologies. Scumbags.

[Gray Fox]

Families are suing South Yorkshire and West Midlands Police for an estimated £20m.

[SvN]

I'm gobsmacked.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I'm sure they will also be suing Our NHS for the mistakes made by the ambulance service mentioned in the verdicts.

[Henry]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cg_3O5dW0AAE-c5.jpg

Also, this is the first thing I found when googling that.

David Cameron Verified account
‏@David_Cameron

I would like to pay tribute to the extraordinary courage of #Hillsborough campaigners in their long search for the truth.
4:10 AM - 26 Apr 2016

Avrosse ‏@Avrosse Apr 26

@David_Cameron fuck off tory scum

[phonics]

Speaking as a Social Media Strategist #CameronHypocrisyIsBreathtaking isn't a great hashtag.

[Giggles]

I hadn't been following this at all (but it's ruining my podcasts poday), but are they trying to say it was completely the police now? Jesus Christ.

[Disco]

If you look at the timeline and history of the ground it's hard to argue otherwise.

[GS]

I hadn't been following this at all (but it's ruining my podcasts poday), but are they trying to say it was completely the police now? Jesus Christ.

You should probably read about it before launching into ill-advised posts such as this.

[Giggles]

You should probably read about it before launching into ill-advised posts such as this.

I'm trying my best to avoid the moaning for the last 20 whatever years, I'm certainly not going to go reading about it. All I know is that if someone opens a door for me, whether they were right to or not, I know if there's someone inside it then don't stand on them.

[Magic]

Idiot.

[Shindig]

Channeling his rage at Spurs' title failure at a legitimate disaster. Who'd have thought it?

[Disco]

Even for Giggles that's impressive levels of idiocy.

[Giggles]

Channeling his rage at Spurs' title failure at a legitimate disaster. Who'd have thought it?

Keep up.

[Chrissy]

Giggles, it was the polices job to manage the crowd. They not only failed to do so but directed them into a cramped full space.

[Magic]

And it was a crush, not a stampede.

[Lee]

Jimmy McGovern's drama on this has just started on ITV. It's well worth a watch if you've not seen it before.

[Magic]

Actually couldn't watch it. Fuck.

[Disco]

Jimmy McGovern doing Hillsborough? I'll just slit my wrists now and save myself 90 minutes.

[Giggles]

Does this verdict finally mean they'll shut the fuck up now? Well, once this initial bout of it is done with.

[Disco]

Probably, I don't think the legal system allows you to go for double or quits.

[GS]

Does this verdict finally mean they'll shut the fuck up now? Well, once this initial bout of it is done with.

Let's be fair here, the court case this week does 'prove' that there was a massive cover up. I think it demonstrates that they were right to continue the campaign over the numbers of years that they did.

[Kikó]

Now it's time for accountability. A pseudonym for compo.

[Lee]

They'd probably be happier with some of the bastards responsible in prison. But who can begrudge them a bit of cash if that's what it comes to? Loads of people were effectively murdered by the apparatus of the state, institutions of which were then complicit in a decades long cover up.

People in public service absolutely should be held accountable when they fuck up. We're paying them, for fuck's sake.

[Giggles]

Murdered.

Christ, I'm out of this one anyway. Back to the snooker.

[Lee]

That people still believe this was anything to do with Liverpool fans is remarkable. The only argument they ever had was that ticketless fans turned up and the ground ended up too full. An argument which is completely undermined by the adjacent pens being near enough empty. Ticketless fans turned up to every match back then. The police would know that and it was their job to deal with that. They didn't. They treated football fans like fucking animals. Whether there were ticketless fans in there or not, they absolutely were not the cause of the disaster.

Some people let tribalism inform their views on this.

"Liverpool loves victimhood."

"Well, look at Heysel."

Fuck right off. It was a cup match. That could have been any club at that cup semi and it seems likely that the same result would have borne out. If it hadn't happened that day it probably would have happened five or ten years later. People on here who go to football matches for fun could have found themselves in a similar situation. The worst thing is the cover up. A cover up which the public services, and without fucking doubt the government of the day, were either participant in or aware of. You can understand a bloke out of his depth making a fuck up catastrophic enough that people wind up dead. But the lie? Doctor statements and smear people who have just stood immobile, wedged into a pen by the bodies of the dead? Fuck me.

[Disco]

Add to that the history of the stadium (a litany of crushes and problems during matches none of which involved Liverpool) and to still try and infer it was the fault of supporters is quite something.