The UK Politics Thread [Wot did Jez do now...]

[Raoul Duke]

Lol at 'well integrated' in Tower Hamlets. The white Brits would have to be the ones integrating.

Another thing to take into consideration is that those who can speak multiple languages are just more likely to be more intelligent.

As for the Phonics stats on Tower Hamlets, the whites who can afford to leave are probably doing so, leaving the dimwits behind.

:evictory:

Well, no. It was primarily a white British area up until the war, with a fairly substantial Jewish population (more over towards Whitechapel though) and now has the majority of Bengali's in London here.

The kids speaking multiple languages will be speaking Bengali at home and English day-to-day at school, that's all.

The borough also contains Canary Wharf, so you get quite a lot people moving here for jobs in the City. There's a bunch of redevelopment and new flats going up that are bonkers expensive, so that will bring a different kind of person here and change the make-up of the place again. Plus it's right between Shoreditch and Hackney, so it's chock-full of hipsters.

[QE Harold Flair]

Tell us more about your first hand London experiences Kevin? Which borough is Hatfield in again?

I go there all the time, and I don't live in Hatfield. Not that one needs to live there to make the case I have.

[Raoul Duke]

Your 'case' being a) a video of old rich white guy John Cleese b) something tenuous about language which flies in direct opposition to the statistics posted earlier in the thread c) you're a racist thundercunt?

Ok chief.

[niko_cee]

Tower Hamlets always looked like it had a lot of money spent on schools. There were untold number of all-singing-and-dancing looking new schools along the Regent's Canal when you got into purple bin territory.

[Raoul Duke]

Yeah, despite various government shenanigans it's got pretty good schooling - along with the aforementioned hipster influx you also get a load of well-educated middle-class kids who want to be teachers moving in so the overall standard of teaching is likely higher than some no mark town in Scunthorpe or whatever.

[Kikó]

But what does John Cleese think?

[Jimmy Floyd]

Usually, in London, by the time an area has a reputation for being shit it has either gentrified or had money poured into it, and the real shithole is now elsewhere.

TH just has the issue of the politicians being bent more than anything on the ground.

[Kikó]

It has Shadwell as well :s

[QE Harold Flair]

But what does John Cleese think?

John Cleese thinks the correct thing, which is why I posted it.

[Kikó]

Tell us more about your trips to London Kev.

[Jimmy Floyd]

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/20/lynton-crosby-and-dead-cat-won-election-conservatives-labour-intellectually-lazy

Good article about how Super Lynton Crosby won the election. The hundreds of seething comments at the bottom are good as well.

[Lewis]

The yoof of Tower Hamlets might end up proving once and for all whether that lot can mix in (the women especially). If they out-perform everyone and still can't be arsed then fucking hell.

[Lewis]

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jan/20/lynton-crosby-and-dead-cat-won-election-conservatives-labour-intellectually-lazy

Good article about how Super Lynton Crosby won the election. The hundreds of seething comments at the bottom are good as well.


In early 2015, Sinclair and Muirhead had presented a poster depicting the Labour leader standing beside the deep end of a swimming pool wearing goggles, a rubber ring and inflatable armbands. There was no headline; the image said it all. But focus groups suggested the poster was perhaps too mean. The Saatchi team created a second draft of the poster, in which Miliband was joined by Salmond, dressed in a lifeguard’s uniform, with a speech bubble that read: “I’ll save you!” Salmond was no longer leader of the SNP, but his public profile had been boosted by the 2014 independence referendum and the Saatchi team used it to their advantage. The poster was received positively by focus groups. But the Saatchi team refined it further, depicting a gormless-looking Miliband peeping out of Salmond’s top pocket.

:lol:

[Disco]

They've just nicked that from Spitting Image.

[QE Harold Flair]

Tell us more about your trips to London Kev.

Us, or you? I'll pm you if you like?

[Kikó]

PM, I'd love to hear about your experiences.

[phonics]

I interned for Saatchi for a bit. We only got perfumes and shite. What I'd do to be on one of those teams, best job in the world.

[Lewis]

In other immigrant news, this (http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/jan/22/medical-school-students-wealthy-backgrounds?CMP=share_btn_tw) is all down to them isn't it? Unless Conservative England is just fairer and more fair.

[phonics]

Speaking of immigration, I did like that Polish MP who claimed Poland had taken in over A MILLION Ukranian refugees. This sounded a bit high so they checked. They'd taken 3.

[Kikó]

They've also taken 1000 of our troops to form a permanent base there.

[Jimmy Floyd]

In other immigrant news, this (http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/jan/22/medical-school-students-wealthy-backgrounds?CMP=share_btn_tw) is all down to them isn't it? Unless Conservative England is just fairer and more fair.

Also you can't just fill doctoring places with token northern thickos like you can with most other jobs.

[Lewis]

This (http://www.economist.com/blogs/bagehot/2016/01/out-campaign) is a quite interesting interview with Dominic Cummings (he runs Vote Leave).

[QE Harold Flair]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75ceVJ9dOUI

[GS]

It's an absolute no brainer to leave, frankly.

[Lee]

I got a newspaper called 'Europe and You' through the door this morning. Now you all know that I don't need any encouragement in the pro-EU cause but I'm not sure Karren Brady telling me we are better off in is the way to convince waverers.

[QE Harold Flair]

I have a feeling that the whole establishment wanting to stay in might work againt them. All the main parties are pro-EU, the BBC and virtually all of the media are as well. When the actual population is something around 50/50, it's hardly representative.The people don't like a stitch-up.

[Kikó]

I got that the other day Lee. I binned it before I read any of it so can you give me the gist?

[Boydy]

Why are you pro-EU, Lee? I can understand not being fussed either way and considering it safer to vote for the status quo but why are you actively pro-EU?

[Lee]

I have a feeling that the whole establishment wanting to stay in might work againt them. All the main parties are pro-EU, the BBC and virtually all of the media are as well. When the actual population is something around 50/50, it's hardly representative.The people don't like a stitch-up.

The polling on this is interesting. Most polls have in winning, but online polls tend to have it quite close, with out occassionally leading narrowly, whilst phone polls have had in about 20 points ahead recently.

I think the latter are closer to the trust given that phone polls tend to be more accurate (even in the badly polled 2015 general election) and referenda more often end with people keeping things as they are. That said, it's difficult to tell when we don't have a date and the campaign hasn't really got going. To stand a chance though the out lot need to choose a leader quicly and they need to paint a picture of why being out is positive. If they just bang on about the EU being shit they'll be fucked.

[QE Harold Flair]

Wasn't that poll conducted before the mass rapes and attempted cover-ups by the establishment in other EU countries?

The pro lot just endlessly bang on about the economy. Of course that's important, but most people who are against it are against the lack of fundamental democracy and accountability, and also the free movement of sexually dysfunctional gropers and general erosion of our society ands culture. To me, staying in will be the final nail in the coffin.

[Lee]

Why are you pro-EU, Lee? I can understand not being fussed either way and considering it safer to vote for the status quo but why are you actively pro-EU?

I identify as European. Our culture and history is shared across the continent and I see us as the same people. The principles of ever closer union are attractive to me and I think the institutions work. Of course it could work better - I'd have a directly elected president, for example, but it's pretty democratic despite the nonsense about it not being. I've posted about the institutions before and how they each are either elected directly or are nominated by elected national governments. The same goes for EU policy. It's never just proposed or decided by 'Eurocrats', which don't actually exist.

[Lee]

Wasn't that poll conducted before the mass rapes and attempted cover-ups by the establishment in other EU countries?

There were a couple, but yeah I think so. That will be forgotten about by the time people vote and in any case the vote is about the UK's place in the EU. We aren't in Schengen so we aren't going to have people just wandering into the country in the way Germany did. And what happens is a consequence of German domestic policy, not EU policy. Merkel wanted loads of immigrants for economic reasons. The issue with the summer migration, in EU terms, was shit external border controls. That does need fixing.

Also on the polling, I've just read that people aren't being asked the question on the basis of the referendum itself. I suspect the results would be even more in favour of remain if they asked in the context of the phoney renegotiation. I saw something months back on Political Betting which suggested a big swing towards remain if Cameron recommended staying in following renegotiation. People trust him.

[QE Harold Flair]

There were a couple, but yeah I think so. That will be forgotten about by the time people vote and in any case the vote is about the UK's place in the EU. We aren't in Schengen so we aren't going to have people just wandering into the country in the way Germany did. And what happens is a consequence of German domestic policy, not EU policy. Merkel wanted loads of immigrants for economic reasons. The issue with the summer migration, in EU terms, was shit external border controls. That does need fixing.

I don't think it will be forgotten. It doesn't matter if we are in Schengen - these perverts can get EU passports within a few years and then they can come here as they wish. These are the kind of issues which the pro lot knopw they can't deal with, and I hope it's hammered home by our side. And tell me, with the free movement of people, what do 'border controls' achieve?

[Boydy]

People trust Cameron? Jesus fucking christ.

[Lee]

I don't think it will be forgotten. It doesn't matter if we are in Schengen - these perverts can get EU passports within a few years and then they can come here as they wish. These are the kind of issues which the pro lot knopw they can't deal with, and I hope it's hammered home by our side. And tell me, with the free movement of people, what do 'border controls' achieve?

Well you control who comes into the EU and have free movement inside of it. Surely it's obvious the difference that could make? And even with an EU passport you don't just get waved in to the UK. If you think you get freedom or movement full stop then you don't understand our Schengen opt out. The whole point is that we have passport checks whereas if you go from, say, Belgium to France you don't.

I'm one of the 'pro lot' and I can deal with it, thanks, I just think you're wrong and I'm right. Such is the nature of debate.

[Lee]

People trust Cameron? Jesus fucking christ.

They elected his party to majority government less than a year ago. Why the surprise?

[QE Harold Flair]

People trust Cameron? Jesus fucking christ.

I don't think they will on the EU. He's a decent frontman, in general. But he doesn't really stand for anything.

[QE Harold Flair]

They elected his party to majority government less than a year ago. Why the surprise?

In the face of nothing else to vote for, let's be honest.

[Yevrah]

People trust Cameron? Jesus fucking christ.

Not just having a dig at you here Boyd, but this sort of reaction, at this juncture, from the left amuses me greatly.

'The People' trusted him far far more than the mongoloid.

[Lee]

In the face of nothing else to vote for, let's be honest.

Nige won't like you calling him nothing.

You do have a point but I think the main reason for them being re-elected is that people saw them as digging the economy out of the shit. Even if we boil it down to a lack of alternatives, that looks like being the same for the out campaign at the minute.

[Boydy]

Oh I know people hated Miliband. I just thought how they voted was probably a least worst option rather than actively trusting him.

[QE Harold Flair]

Well you control who comes into the EU and have free movement inside of it. Surely it's obvious the difference that could make? And even with an EU passport you don't just get waved in to the UK. If you think you get freedom or movement full stop then you don't understand our Schengen opt out. The whole point is that we have passport checks whereas if you go from, say, Belgium to France you don't.

I'm one of the 'pro lot' and I can deal with it, thanks, I just think you're wrong and I'm right. Such is the nature of debate.

I didn't mean 'deal weith it' in that sense. I mean your side are weak on this point. Fundamentally weak, which is why the in lot always go on about the economy and fear mongering about 3 million jobs lost, which is patently nonsense. The EU has not shown, in all its years, that it is effective in border controls. Besides that, there's so many undesirables already here, thanks to the legs open, border politics of rape fetishist, Angela Merkel the traitor, that it's a moot point. We want controls here, on our shores, not somewhere else in the EU.

And to your point earlier - the countries within Europe have vastly different cultures. I don't know why you want some vast monoculture? Even France, just across the ocean, has a vastly different culture and history to us, and that's to be celebrated.

[Lee]

I didn't mean 'deal weith it' in that sense. I mean your side are weak on this point. Fundamentally weak, which is why the in lot always go on about the economy and fear mongering about 3 million jobs lost, which is patently nonsense. The EU has not shown, in all its years, that it is effective in border controls. Besides that, there's so many undesirables already here, thanks to the legs open, border politics of rape fetishist, Angela Merkel the traitor, that it's a moot point. We want controls here, on our shores, not somewhere else in the EU.

We already have them. We are not in Schengen. People can't just saunter in.

[QE Harold Flair]

Nige won't like you calling him nothing.

You do have a point but I think the main reason for them being re-elected is that people saw them as digging the economy out of the shit. Even if we boil it down to a lack of alternatives, that looks like being the same for the out campaign at the minute.

4 million isn't nothing for UKIP, but we live in the voting system we do. The EU debate won't be won by personalities, so I don't think what you say matters in the least. Another mass rape and or atrocity close to home will probably seal the deal.

[QE Harold Flair]

We already have them. We are not in Schengen. People can't just saunter in.

Okay so who, with an EU passport, can't just saunter in?

[John Arne]

Not UK based politics, but here in Vietnam the congress is about to elect it's new General Secretary.

In totally unrelated news, most network SMS services have been suspended (annoying), The Guardian website is down, the BBC is down (it always is) and the Human Rights Watchdog website is down.

[Lee]

Okay so who, with an EU passport, can't just saunter in?

Nobody can. They check your passport and can turn you away. EU citizens don't have the right to enter the UK without having their passports checked. Perhaps you want to go further and implement visa arrangements for European visitors, you tell me.

[QE Harold Flair]

Nobody can. They check your passport and can turn you away. EU citizens don't have the right to enter the UK without having their passports checked. Perhaps you want to go further and implement visa arrangements for European visitors, you tell me.

Why would they turn away someone with an EU passport who doesn't have a criminal record? And yes, for those who want to live here a certain length of time, certainly.

[Lee]

Why would they turn away someone with an EU passport who doesn't have a criminal record?

What's your point? Why would we do that even if we weren't in the EU?

"Sorry Hans, we've already let our 50 Germans in today."

Our decision making at borders can hardly be laid at the feet of the EU.

[Lee]

Why would they turn away someone with an EU passport who doesn't have a criminal record? And yes, for those who want to live here a certain length of time, certainly.

The Syrian terrorist with an EU passport probably won't be applying for residency.

[QE Harold Flair]

Why not? Were the 9/11 terrorists not living in the US?

Not that I mentioned terrorists.

[Lee]

Why not? Were the 9/11 terrorists not living in the US?

Not that I mentioned terrorists.

They had visas. :D

Anyway terrorists adapt. And you know that security is one of the reasons people argue for tighter border controls.

[QE Harold Flair]

They had visas. :D

Anyway terrorists adapt. And you know that security is one of the reasons people argue for tighter border controls.

You're the one who brought terrorists up. I was focusing on the mass rape and moral/sexual dysfunctionals. It isn't all about criminals - the reason I brought up those without criminal records coming in is because I think 3 people have been caught out of the hundreds who were molesting western women. No passport checks are going to stop this kind of repressive, women hating, demented culture getting here. Even visas won't stop it completely, but it's much better. Getting into Australia for any lenghth of time is not easy, and that's how it should be. You should have to bring something to the country you go to live in, and that should be determined at the border.

The left are so often guilty of ignoring reality and thinking in a eutopian manner. Yes, it would be nice if we could all just live borderlsss and happily. That isn't going to happen, and it ignores the world we live in.

[Lewis]

I identify as European. Our culture and history is shared across the continent and I see us as the same people. The principles of ever closer union are attractive to me and I think the institutions work. Of course it could work better - I'd have a directly elected president, for example, but it's pretty democratic despite the nonsense about it not being. I've posted about the institutions before and how they each are either elected directly or are nominated by elected national governments. The same goes for EU policy. It's never just proposed or decided by 'Eurocrats', which don't actually exist.

I have a bit of time for old fashioned federalism. It's fundamentally wrong to say we share culture and history with the Europeans, but it is nevertheless a coherent principle with its own logic to it. These idiots who say we have to stay in because INFLUENCE (NATO, nuclear weapons, fifth largest economy, UN Security Council) or having to pay more for Spanish phone calls are a joke.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The London establishment seems to have decided we should stay in because fairness, and also Peter Bone is a nasty Tory. Reckon that complacency will see them have a SCARE in the campaign before ultimately winning.

[Lewis]

I think the evil TORY PRESS will all end up wanting to leave. The Telegraph is probably the biggest doubt because of all its shady business connections, but even then they will lead the campaign in spirit.

[Jimmy Floyd]

As long as Big Dave C wants in, they'll all stick behind him. There are too many dinner parties at stake.

[GS]

Scotland // Jeremy Corbyn makes me...
More likely to vote LAB: 13%
Less likely to vote LAB: 30%
(via Panelbase / 08 - 14 Jan)

Scottish Parl. voting intention (list):
SNP: 48% (-)
LAB: 19% (-3)
CON: 17% (+2)
LDEM: 7% (+1)
GRN: 5% (-1)
UKIP: 2% (-1)
(via Panelbase)

Scottish Parl. voting intention (const.):
SNP: 50% (-2)
LAB: 21% (-2)
CON: 17% (+3)
LDEM: 6% (-)
GRN: 3% (-)
UKIP: 2% (-)
(via Panelbase)

Labour regressing in Scotland as well now.

[Toby]

As well? It's not exactly new. If anything their rapid decline here has probably accelerated what has happened elsewhere.

[GS]

I meant more in terms of the "Corbyn effect", as there had been some discussion when he was elected that his positions on the left would help him reclaim some of Labour's lost ground. Instead, it's getting worse.

That said, one must question how much of that is attributable to Corbyn / Labour being shit and the continued honeymoon of the SNP post-referendum.

[Lewis]

The Conservatives seem to be very happy with their numbers, but there is still clearly a ceiling of about twenty per cent. With that in mind, I think it's time that they ramped up the unionism. Big Ruth should lead the next orange march, and in the meantime she can do her best to implicate Jock Stein in historic nonce allegations.

[Toby]

I'd suggest a good chunk of those 50% will be voting for the SNP in the same sort of "least bad" way people used to vote for Labour. It's hard to articulate just how useless the opposition parties are in Scotland, and they show no signs of improving. Even Ruth Davidson, who speaks well and gets heaped with praise by the media, polls terribly with half of the country still saying they don't know anything about her.

Anyway, it's a strange poll to post as indicative of anything, given it's comfortably the lowest the SNP has polled in the constituency vote for several months, and that the Labour vote is more or less unchanged from its settled average.

[Toby]

The Conservatives seem to be very happy with their numbers, but there is still clearly a ceiling of about twenty per cent. With that in mind, I think it's time that they ramped up the unionism. Big Ruth should lead the next orange march, and in the meantime she can do her best to implicate Jock Stein in historic nonce allegations.

They should be embarrassed that they haven't overtaken Labour as the second largest party. The opportunity was (and probably still is) there, but they don't seem to be trying all that hard to take it.

[GS]

It's a poll which was recently conducted and the results of which were posted today - hence why I put it on here. As Lewis says, one suspects that general percentages are unlikely to change i.e. SNP ~50%, Labour ~20% with the Tories unlikely to get above the ceiling of 20%. UKIP nowhere.

I thought the Corbyn poll was interesting for two reasons. 1) 57% of people don't see it as making any difference (probably because, as you say Tobias, the SNP are perceived as being the least shit option) and 2) For those who do have view his leadership as having an impact, it's overwhelming negative to Labour's chances.

I can't imagine Kezia Dugdale is making much progress either. There's just no intellectual heavyweights in the Labour leadership north or south of the border.

You do have to wonder what the Tories can realistically do at this point. Ruth Davidson is probably as good a leader as they can get, yet she's clearly going to be incapable of detoxifying the Tory brand by herself.

[Lewis]

They should be embarrassed that they haven't overtaken Labour as the second largest party. The opportunity was (and probably still is) there, but they don't seem to be trying all that hard to take it.

Not really. Bitterness is a way of life up there, so it's not like people are going to start voting Conservative just because Labour are shit.

[Toby]

Not really. Bitterness is a way of life up there, so it's not like people are going to start voting Conservative just because Labour are shit.

Bitterness these days is presented in whichever way you voted in September 2014, and they're clearly the strongest party in an "anyone but the SNP" sort of way. There are plenty people of both sides who abandon any other principles to extend their nationalist/unionist views.

[GS]

Do you think the Tories could increase their share of the vote by presenting themselves as the "Unionist party for Scotland" are something similar? As some way of distinguishing themselves from Labour in the "not the SNP" camp?

Genuine question.

[Toby]

They already do that, I just don't think they do a very good job of it.

But yes, I think they could become the second biggest party by painting themselves as the only capable opposition to the SNP. Perhaps the problem in that is that it is inherently short termist and not a platform on which they could ever become a governing party.

[GS]

How are they doing that? Davidson seems to be doing a good job, but I assume they suffer from "guilty by association" with the national party and its aforementioned toxic reputation (probably originating from the time of the Thatcher government) in Scotland.

[Toby]

Well, they're the Conservative and Unionist party, and pretty much everything they ever do involves targeting anti-SNP sentiment. Their problem is that Big Ruth is the only one who's even close to a recognisable figure, and even she isn't a household name. They just don't have the visibility to gain votes from less interested voters, and I don't really know how they get that.

There are plenty of "shy Tories" in Scotland, whatever anti-Thatcher sentiment may come across. They should definitely be doing better on the regional list, at the very least.

[Lewis]

Bitterness these days is presented in whichever way you voted in September 2014, and they're clearly the strongest party in an "anyone but the SNP" sort of way. There are plenty people of both sides who abandon any other principles to extend their nationalist/unionist views.

Unionists have the safety of a referendum, so they can safely waste their vote (or even vote for the SNP it seems) without putting the country at risk. Independence twats don't have that luxury, because if the SNP fade away then it goes off the agenda.

[GS]

The issue is surely that if you're a Tory with any ambition, you're going to go off and work with the national party. There's no real incentive to "stay in Scotland" where it's going to be SNP-dominated for the foreseeable future and where you have no chance of exercising actual power. In the same way that Scottish Labour was intellectually lightweight because anyone half-decent went off to run for national office instead - and that was even when Labour were getting into power after devolution.

Nothing they can do at this stage - they can get a national majority by ignoring Scotland, so they might as well let Labour and the SNP tear each other apart and "stay above the fray" as a "serious and natural party of government".

[GS]

Unionists have the safety of a referendum, so they can safely waste their vote (or even vote for the SNP it seems) without putting the country at risk. Independence twats don't have that luxury, because if the SNP fade away then it goes off the agenda.

This is also a pertinent point. It would be interesting to see the stats on how SNP voters view independence. As Lewis says, there must be a decent minority there would vote SNP as the least shit option but wouldn't be voting for independence.

[Toby]

The issue is surely that if you're a Tory with any ambition, you're going to go off and work with the national party. There's no real incentive to "stay in Scotland" where it's going to be SNP-dominated for the foreseeable future and where you have no chance of exercising actual power. In the same way that Scottish Labour was intellectually lightweight because anyone half-decent went off to run for national office instead - and that was even when Labour were getting into power after devolution.

Nothing they can do at this stage - they can get a national majority by ignoring Scotland, so they might as well let Labour and the SNP tear each other apart and "stay above the fray" as a "serious and natural party of government".

Maybe if they're just careerist wankers, but people like Ruth Davidson do well because they do actually care about Scotland and do actually think what they're proposing is best for the country - something majority Conservative governments with barely any votes here clearly aren't.

[Toby]

Which, again, is an argument they could be using to their advantage, especially where SNP seniority sits the other way.

[Boydy]

http://www.itv.com/news/2016-01-25/revealed-secret-labour-report-calls-on-party-to-atone-for-its-past/

[Jimmy Floyd]

I think you'll find that is all wrong and the way for Labour to win is actually to move sharply to the left and engage with non-voters.

[Boydy]

I really like Tim Montgomerie:

http://capx.co/nice-is-not-the-same-as-left-and-mean-is-not-the-same-as-right/

[QE Harold Flair]

He's quite correct and I've said similar thngs many times.

[QE Harold Flair]

UKIP's excellent Steve Woolfe coldly and calmly deals with 2 deliberately lieing, misrepresenting Labour cronies:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzHxP1Krj7Q


David Lammy claiming the Indians fought for the EU project in the second world war :happycry:

[Kikó]

He's barking up the wrong tree with that.

[QE Harold Flair]

Why do you say that?

[Lewis]

I really like Tim Montgomerie:

http://capx.co/nice-is-not-the-same-as-left-and-mean-is-not-the-same-as-right/

I've never seen the appeal. He just seems to re-package bollocks old wet Toryism as 'insight'.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I reckon idiocy has reached its zenith with this story about how Damian Lewis was signed up to help with some thing at a state school near where he lives in Norf London, but 'local figures' complained that it was inappropriate because he went to Eton, and (literally) Ms Dynamite should open the fete or whatever instead.

[Jimmy Floyd]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/damian-lewis-pupils-protest-against-etonian-actors-planned-appearance-at-london-comprehensive-a6835271.html

There we are. Every single paragraph of that is pure gold, especially the last one.

[Boydy]

It seems more appropriate to have past pupils to launch the 50th anniversary celebrations but if Damian Lewis lives near by and wants to pitch in too, why not let him?

As much as I don't like Eton and what it represents, I'd not go protesting against that.

I didn't know Akala is Ms Dynamite's brother. He's cool.

[QE Harold Flair]

It seems more appropriate to have past pupils to launch the 50th anniversary celebrations but if Damian Lewis lives near by and wants to pitch in too, why not let him?

As much as I don't like Eton and what it represents, I'd not go protesting against that.

I didn't know Akala is Ms Dynamite's brother. He's cool.

He'a a complete tw*t. I remember him being on some BBC show about the EDL and Tommy Robinson was there. He was the archetypal victim merchant, even though he's successful and rich and spewed lies and misrepresentations left, right and centre. The Beeb must love him.

[Lewis]

lol at Dave getting shit for saying a 'bunch of migrants' and everything, but he only said it because Jezza had him ON THE ROPES, so fuck him.

[phonics]

It seems more appropriate to have past pupils to launch the 50th anniversary celebrations but if Damian Lewis lives near by and wants to pitch in too, why not let him?

As much as I don't like Eton and what it represents, I'd not go protesting against that.

I didn't know Akala is Ms Dynamite's brother. He's cool.

Akala's a dude. In that incredibly rare group of 'Rappers I've met that aren't complete dickheads'. Ms Dynamite was pretty cool too (in the sense that she acted like a pro)

[Reg]

Who's in the complete dickheads group, phonics?

[John]

Everyone else, I'd imagine. I know a couple of aspiring rappers and even they are huge dickheads. The idea of a Scottish hiphop scene makes me laugh every time it enters my mind.

[QE Harold Flair]

Akala's a dude. In that incredibly rare group of 'Rappers I've met that aren't complete dickheads'. Ms Dynamite was pretty cool too (in the sense that she acted like a pro)


This proved to be his breakthrough album, containing the single "Shakespeare" – a reference to his self-proclaimed title "The Black Shakespeare"

Sounds like a bit of a dickhead to me.

[phonics]

Who's in the complete dickheads group, @phonics (http://www.thethirdhalf.co.uk/member.php?u=1)?

Everyone on High Focus (stole a bunch of weed from the Green Room and proceeded to try sell it back to the staff), whichever members of So Solid Crew are left (there was loads of them and I guess they'd had a few roster changes a decade or so after '21 Seconds'), Stig of the Dump (is one of those 'i'm such a dickhead i embrace it' type of dickheads) and a variety of no-name UK rappers who have passed by the way side.

The cool list is Akala, Mystro and Akil (from Jurassic 5).

Dr. Syntax was so quiet he puts himself on the cool list just by not being a prick. Definitely the most middle class rapper alive though.

edit: Christ how could I forget El-P. WHAT A DICKHEAD.

[niko_cee]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/damian-lewis-pupils-protest-against-etonian-actors-planned-appearance-at-london-comprehensive-a6835271.html

There we are. Every single paragraph of that is pure gold, especially the last one.

Aye.

That last paragraph is amazing.

[John Arne]

How many u-turns is Cameron going to do on "this bunch of refugees".

It seems to have gone (depending on media position, it seems); stay out, we take our fair share / let them all in - Britain is built of refugees / they are all rapists!! / scum

[GS]

What I don't understand is the refusal to recognise that the refugees / migrants in Calais are not "fleeing war torn countries". Maybe they were originally, but they're now in France. Ergo it's not our problem.

[phonics]

Would you accept no migrants unless they'd boated all the way round the Mediterranean and landed on Dover?

[GS]

Well, the whole point of asylum seeking is that you want to move to a safe country because your life is in danger or the country is a warzone. If they reach a "safe haven", then they are no longer asylum seekers - they are, from that point on, economic migrants. France is a safe haven, therefore they are no longer fleeing a warzone / a shithole where their life is in danger.

That Calais and Dunkirk have been allowed to become giant refugee camps where people are attempting to illegally enter Britain is a massive concern. It is no longer asylum seeking once they're in France - it's economic as to why they're eschewing the French system in preference to Britain. We have discretion over who we allow in for economic motives, and it is not incumbent upon us to open the doors. One need only look at Germany to see what can happen when you unilaterally declare the country "open".

The French have a lot to answer for here, given they've allowed this shambles to grow.

We should be very clear on where the line is between refugee and economic migrant - we have enough of the latter through our membership of the EU. We are not responsible for every problem in the world.

[phonics]

What problems are we responsible for, out of interest?

[Pepe]

I agree that the French are partly responsible. They should have just let all of them go into the UK rather than do border policing for you.

[GS]

Hard to say, but the alternative is "doing a Merkel" and watching the whole thing swiftly unravel.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The French are always to blame, even when they're not.

The Daily Mail front page tomorrow is about the lollest thing I've ever seen. Does this stuff not go through meetings?

[phonics]

Hard to say, but the alternative is "doing a Merkel" and watching the whole thing swiftly unravel.

Nice cop out.

[GS]

Incidentally, I see the best solution the EU have been able to come up with is to force Greece to become the buffer zone for Schengen. As if it's not bad enough that they've economically waterboarded them for years.

[QE Harold Flair]

Would you accept no migrants unless they'd boated all the way round the Mediterranean and landed on Dover?

We shouldn't accept them, either. I think you mean refugees as well since we have no duty to economic migrants. Easy mistake, mate.

[Lewis]

What problems are we responsible for, out of interest?

Ironically, you would probably expect a lot of the African migration (proper Africa, not North Africa) to stop if they were allowed to develop their economies by trading freely with the European Union. Instead we pay farmers to bin things.

[Toby]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CZwuOGpWkAA5921.jpg

What a monster.

[Boydy]

Bit harsh on Camilla.

[Toby]

GS will like this one:

692701283564830720

Indulgent essay in 5... 4... 3...

[Jimmy Floyd]

If Corbz stays they will go under 100 seats I reckon. I would lol, but it means we're in a pernanent Etonian dictatorship, like it's the 1700s.

[GS]

GS will like this one:

692701283564830720

Indulgent essay in 5... 4... 3...

No need for an essay, given the point has been made time and time again that Labour aren't electable and boundary changes + Scotland + Corbyn leaves them nowhere to go.

[Lee]

So that health spokeswoman is getting £62.50 an hour as a locum consultant? She's getting done over then, you're lucky to find one for less than £95 per hour.

[Henry]

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jan/28/britain-war-yemen-saudi-arabia-military-advisers

So, the UK is effectively at war with Yemen, and we don't even seem to know about it.


Since Saudi-led forces intervened in the conflict between President Hadi and Houthi rebels last March, around 6,000 Yemenis have been killed, perhaps half of them civilians. With the country under naval blockade, what the UN was already calling a “humanitarian catastrophe” six months ago has been unleashed. Eight in every 10 Yemenis are now dependent on humanitarian aid, and most do not have “adequate access to clean water or sanitation”, according to the UN.

Bombing raids have shredded the country’s healthcare system: 130 medical facilities have been targeted, including those run by Médecins Sans Frontières – “a total disregard for the rules of war”, as MSF says itself. The risk of famine looms: the UN believes more than 14 million people are food insecure, half of them severely so, while nearly one in 10 have been driven from their homes.

Those nice Saudis.

[Lewis]

That means we're effectively losing a war to Yemen. :moop:

[Jimmy Floyd]

I'm effectively Genghis Khan.

Some nat MP has started a fight with J.K. Rowling on twitter, with lol consequences.

[Lewis]

Does anybody else think that Dave has this European Union benefits ROW the wrong way round? He wants a four year ban on in-work benefits, but if the idea is that he wants people to have contributed before drawing benefits wouldn't it make more sense to just say non-nationals can't move here and jump straight on the dole? If the people are actually working then preventing them from accessing what their taxes pay for is just robbing them.

[GS]

Dave is pushing for what he thinks he can sell as a MAJOR WIN. The whole thing is a sham.

[QE Harold Flair]

I was only half watching Question Time the other night and I missed this bit. If you want a proper example of the left's desperate equivocation attempts, here it is.

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/labour-mp-faces-calls-to-resign-after-comparing-cologne-attacks-to-birmingham-night-out/ar-BBoTrpK?li=BBoPOOl


The Labour MP Jess Phillips is facing calls to resign after comparing the organised sexual assaults committed by gangs of migrants in Cologne to the regular harassment of women on the streets of Birmingham.
The city's residents and business owners have hit back, saying her comments were "irresponsible, highly inaccurate and misleading".
Ms Phillips, the MP for Birmingham Yardley, suggested this week that the recent attacks in Germany are no different to the situation women find themselves in the centre of Birmingham.
Her remarks have incensed locals who have called on her to resign from her post and "identify the error of her ways in what she said".
Mike Olley, manager of the West Side business improvement district, said that Birmingham's Broad Street is "not like the Wild West".
Speaking on BBC Radio 4's Today programme, he said that sexual harassment is "not an institutionalised part of what goes on there"
On New Year's Eve in Cologne, Germany, dozens of women found themselves trapped in a crowd of around 1,000 men, who groped them, tore off their underwear, and shouted lewd insults.
German authorities have since said that almost all of the New Year's Eve sex attackers have a "migrant background".
Superintendent Andy Parsons, Police Commander for Central Birmingham, said that Ms Phillips' comments "aren't born out certainly in terms of crime statistics".
He added: "But I also appreciate it's not just about statistics. I've got recent experience myself policing New Year on Broad Street, it was extremely busy and the atmosphere was one of celebration rather than one of sexual overtones.
"In a night time economy ?there will be activity that is alcohol fuelled - but is it fair to compare it to incidents in Cologne on New Year? I don't think it is."
However, some acknowledged that sexual harassment is a problem in the city.
Michael Mclean, chairman of Broad Street Pub Watch said that sexual harassment is "something that we see and if I turned round and said that we didn't, I'd be lying".
He went on: "Does it happen? Yes it does. Is it true what people are saying relating it to the cologne sex attacks? Absolutely not. The correlation between the two is a massive over exaggeration."
A woman called Jane who has worked at a hotdog stand in central Broad Street told the Today programme: "Obviously you'll get the occasional vulgar guy that will try and grope you or say insulting things to you.
"We're had a few incidents - like last night there were girls hovering over a car. Now I wouldn't have done that. Obviously the guys were trying to get attention from them."
Another resident named Stacey told the programme: "The one time fairly recently I went into that bar over there and I had someone touch my bottom, trying to instigate conversation. I turned around and was like 'no, that's no happening'. I feel a bit little bit like, why do you feel like you can touch me?"
The row began on Thursday night when Ms Philips responded to a question from a Question Time audience member who suggested that the situation in Germany showed "mass immigration doesn't work".
The Labour MP said: "There is violence against women and girls that you are describing, a very similar situation to what happened in Cologne could be described on Broad Street in Birmingham every week where women are baited and heckled.
"We have to attack what we perceive as being patriarchal culture coming into any culture that isn't patriarchal and making sure we tell people not to be like that."

This is the same trog who laughed about men's suicide rates, of course.

[QE Harold Flair]

I predict she will lose her seat within a month. She's a liability, and even a vagina won't save her.

http://i64.tinypic.com/30kspq1.jpg

[GS]

Andrew Neil was discussing some statistics on this. There have been five reports of sexual assault on Broad Street in Birmingham in the past 12 weeks. This obviously doesn't bear comparison to the hundreds discussed in the context of Cologne etc.

It seems a somewhat dense point to make on her part, but then one suspects that any number of MPs are not there for their intellect but rather because they are "good party people".

[Jimmy Floyd]

She's the most outspoken opponent of Jezmania, so I'm sure they'll have her hanged or something.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Gideon has been annoying me of late. Declares his clearly wank Google tax deal to be a 'major success', nobody agrees, and then days later he sends Sajid Javid around the Sunday programmes to declare it 'not a glorious moment'.

He's very Gordon Brown these days. Hopefully Boris (or someone not called Theresa May) nobbles him in the leadership.

[Disco]

He has basically no charisma so while he may be able to get the party machine behind him Boris would carry more of the popular vote just by having mad hair and having been on proper telly.

[Lewis]

He's been 'very Gordon Brown' since about 2006.

[Jimmy Floyd]

He has basically no charisma so while he may be able to get the party machine behind him Boris would carry more of the popular vote just by having mad hair and having been on proper telly.

The leadership vote is done by the two top choices of the MPs being put to the party at large, and I'm pretty sure the party at large would vote for Boris should he get himself on such a ballot against any other candidate. Osborne's task is therefore to stop him from doing so, though frankly he'd have to be up against a real twat for the party to swing behind him I think. He's an electoral liability but doesn't seem willing to accept this.

[GS]

Gideon has apparently been alienating many MPs with his antics, particularly over the EU referendum. I think he's in danger of pissing away his chance of leading the party. Theresa May is an odious individual. Boris is probably dangerous, but he comes across well and the average man on the street tends to quite like him. It's not a fantastic cast. Osborne would probably be the least incompetent, but he appears to be on the autism scale for social skills and people think he's a smug twat.

[QE Harold Flair]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gduTK82djYY


It's nice to see a non BBC audience. Of course this got no coverage.

[Lewis]

The news was rather unimpressed with this European Union stitch-up. He's such a gimp.

[GS]

The newspapers have stuck the boot in massively over the reform package as well.

It's a shame almost all of the top Tories are spineless, as they'll all line up to say this is 'great' and 'addresses our concerns'.

[Pepe]

http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2016/02/03/465407797/britain-to-foreign-workers-if-you-dont-make-50-000-a-year-please-leave


non-Europeans on skilled worker visas — known as Tier 2 visas — are not welcome to stay unless they are making at least 35,000 British pounds (about $50,000 a year).

Disgusting.


"It seems to me absolutely right," he says. "They've been here five years. If they're going to settle, they should be making a proper contribution in terms of productivity, which will be reflected in their pay."

:face:

[Toby]

I have a close friend who would otherwise have been eligible for indefinite right to remain in September, but if that goes through he'll pretty much have to leave. He's away at the moment trying to get everything sorted so he can apply for a three year extension before then, so maybe if that is approved he'll have time to make up the difference.

But the £35,000 limit rules out things like nurses and a lot of teachers. Only nurses who specialise in postnatal intensive care and teachers of STEM subjects are included on the shortage list so others will have to fuck off, and that seems to be causing uproar from whatever unions represent them.

[Jimmy Floyd]

There speaks a man (Dave, not Toby) who doesn't know how pay actually works.

[phonics]

It's going to be hilarious when this bumps up the salaries of a bunch of foreigners to make it legal for them to stay. That's literally the only effect it'll have.

[QE Harold Flair]

http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2016/02/03/465407797/britain-to-foreign-workers-if-you-dont-make-50-000-a-year-please-leave



Disgusting.



:face:

Yes, and UKIP are the answer. What Cameron wants is to flood us with non-skilled migration from the shitty parts of Europe, which is fucking ridiculous. Those with skills, from anywhere in the world (except terrorist lands), should be welcomed. Ands that is UKIP policy, in fact.

As for nurses, why the fuck can't we train our own? Constantly stealing them from other (often poor) countries, who could do with them themselves you know, is not the long term solution.

[Lewis]

You wonder 1) how somebody came up with that policy; 2) how many people read it and thought 'Yeah, that makes sense' before signing it off. Equally, you wonder whether it is a case of their not thinking there will be any negative consequences or simply not being bothered provided it gets the right headlines.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The latter. They're only in power to try and win the next election.

[Pepe]

As for nurses, why the fuck can't we train our own? Constantly stealing them from other (often poor) countries, who could do with them themselves you know, is not the long term solution.

According to RL you can, but you don't pay them enough so no one wants to do it, hence having to bring these 'unproductive' foreigners to do it.


The latter. They're only in power to try and win the next election.

:nod:

A politician's job is to be elected. Once he is, his work is done.

[GS]

It's a thoroughly ridiculous idea because skilled workers from outside the EU are exactly the sort of people we should want to attract. I didn't touch on it in the EU thread earlier on, but part of the issue here is that continued open door migration from the EU means that the government will, inevitably, look to tighten the areas they actually have control over - all so they can say they've hit some target to cut migration. It doesn't matter that the immigrants we're missing out on are skilled workers.

It's one of the reasons why, in my view, we should leave the EU - we would be much better equipped to control the inflow of economic migrants - with a focus on skilled workers regardless of origin. This is something we are clearly unable to do under the current system.

[QE Harold Flair]

Is anyone watching this grief merchant on This Week now? When it was pointed out that blacks are OVER respresented in a particular field he was whinging about he says 'oh we can't get too obsesed with figures'. Couldn't make this up.

[Lewis]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35504185

I'm sure Jezza will sort this out.

[Jimmy Floyd]

The Guardian's front page tomorrow screams: SOARING STATE SCHOOLS THREATEN PRIVATE SECTOR

http://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/styles/story_large/public/thumbnails/image/2014/02/03/19/michael-gove.jpg

[GS]

It's a shame that Dave caved in and moved Gove from the DfE.

[QE Harold Flair]

Muslim women accuse labour Muslim men of misogyny and bullying. Also say that Islam and women's rights are not compatible. Muslim women racist?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/12143624/Labour-accused-of-misogyny-toward-Muslim-women.html

[Boydy]

The Guardian's front page tomorrow screams: SOARING STATE SCHOOLS THREATEN PRIVATE SECTOR

That is a worry to the Guardian, to be fair, given all their writers are effectively paying school fees for nothing now.

[QE Harold Flair]

George Galloway putting the more left wing case for leaving the EU:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnHZBmBuphk

[phonics]

696941741652447232

[phonics]

Apparently we need to vote IN to STOP THE TERRORISTS.

Weren't some of you lot calling him the 'best PM evs'? The mans a fucking joke.

[QE Harold Flair]

696941741652447232

Yes, they also spent vast amounts of money making sure UKIP were quashed.

[Disco]

At least it was well spent.

[QE Harold Flair]

If you think that level of non-democracy is a good thing, yes.

[Henry]

So, David Cameron's mother signed a petition against his cuts. :lol:

[phonics]

Oh and this one

696774538617458691

Good to know that fucking the vulnerable runs the family

[QE Harold Flair]

Right-wing - uncaring and evil monsters. The left has a monopoly on morality (in their own minds).

[Kikó]

Typical left wing fascists silencing the right.

[Lewis]

Oh and this one

Good to know that fucking the vulnerable runs the family

He's a Muslim, so let's blame it on that.

[QE Harold Flair]

Hadn't heard from Rosie in months. Glad she's keeping well.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYxtt6vdiCg

[Toby]

You're about the last person I'd have expected to see post a video of cross-party backslapping at a crap joke.

[QE Harold Flair]

That's not what I find funny, it's his constant reference to random people's emails and letters. I know that's not what they're laughing at but there's quite often a chortle when he reads out the name of anyone.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I would just make them up to wind Cameron up.

'Delroy emails and asks...' *uncomfortable shifting already* '...whether the rhythm and blues musical ensembles of the day, which are worth £200 million to the UK economy, can expect further measures to aid their growth.'

[QE Harold Flair]

Dear, oh dear. The 'gender pay gap' myth being used again on The Daily Politics now. It doesn't fucking exist!

[Byron]

Okay I'll bite.

Have you got some proof of that? I've never realy studied it, so I don't know if it exists or not.

[simon]

inb4 Milo Youtube video.

[QE Harold Flair]

Okay I'll bite.

Have you got some proof of that? I've never realy studied it, so I don't know if it exists or not.

Yes, lots. Check myth number 5. Now this is the US, but it's the same argument. In actual fact, women under 40 earn MORE than men for the same work in this country.

http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/

(http://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/)
MYTH 5: Women earn 77 cents for every dollar a man earns—for doing the same work.

FACTS: No matter how many times this wage gap claim is decisively refuted by economists (http://www.consad.com/content/reports/Gender%20Wage%20Gap%20Final%20Report.pdf), it always comes back. The bottom line: the 23-cent gender pay gap is simply the difference between the average earnings of all men and women working full-time. It does not account for differences in occupations, positions, education, job tenure or hours worked per week. When such relevant factors (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/01/no-women-don-t-make-less-money-than-men.html) are considered, the wage gap narrows (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christina-hoff-sommers/wage-gap_b_2073804.html) to the point of vanishing.


Wage gap activists say women with identical backgrounds and jobs as men still earn less. But they always fail to take into account critical variables. Activist groups like the National Organization for Women have a fallback position: that women’s education and career choices are not truly free—they are driven by powerful sexist stereotypes. In this view, women’s tendency to retreat from the workplace to raise children or to enter fields like early childhood education and psychology, rather than better paying professions like petroleum engineering, is evidence of continued social coercion. Here is the problem: American women are among the best informed and most self-determining human beings in the world. To say that they are manipulated into their life choices by forces beyond their control is divorced from reality and demeaning, to boot.

Why do these reckless claims have so much appeal and staying power? For one thing, there is a lot of statistical illiteracy among journalists, feminist academics and political leaders. There is also an admirable human tendency to be protective of women—stories of female exploitation are readily believed, and vocal skeptics risk appearing indifferent to women’s suffering. Finally, armies of advocates depend on “killer stats” to galvanize their cause. But killer stats obliterate distinctions between more and less serious problems and send scarce resources in the wrong directions. They also promote bigotry. The idea that American men are annually enslaving more than 100,000 girls, sending millions of women to emergency rooms, sustaining a rape culture and cheating women out of their rightful salary creates rancor in true believers and disdain in those who would otherwise be sympathetic allies.

My advice to women’s advocates: Take back the truth.

[phonics]

Exactly, that's a crap study, it doesn't mean there isn't a gender pay gap though.

What the Adam Smith institute was calling for was a comparison of like to like jobs whereas from 2018 the government will only collect the median amount of men and women hired by a company which is just shit.

[QE Harold Flair]

Exactly, that's a crap study, it doesn't mean there isn't a gender pay gap though.

What the Adam Smith institute was calling for was a comparison of like to like jobs whereas from 2018 the government will only collect the median amount of men and women hired by a company which is just shit.

No, there is a gender pay gap, but it's got nothing to do with 'sexism'. It's because men have better jobs because they work more hours, take less holidays and take much less leave in terms of childcare. And the most obvious one is that men tend to be more goal and money orientated in terms of work than women.

[phonics]

Men get paid more because they are superior to women in every way. But there is no gender wage gap. Okay.

[phonics]

The 'gender pay gap' myth being used again on The Daily Politics now. It doesn't fucking exist!

Just going to quote this before Harold goes on a semantic argument.

[QE Harold Flair]

Men get paid more because they are superior to women in every way. But there is no gender wage gap. Okay.

Where did I say any such thing? If anything, having more of a focus on family life is more laudible than an autistic and pathological drive to earn more money and climb the ladder.

Quote all you like, I've already provided eveidence that the gender pay gap, as they use it, does not exist. Women earn MORE than men for the same work.

[Davgooner]

He's right in that the headline figure is total bollocks. That doesn't highlight like-for-like pay discrepancies, but does highlight that certain professions and fields and still almost exclusively male, which is an issue.

[phonics]

Where did I say any such thing?

I literally quoted you saying 'It doesn't fucking exist' directly above this post.

edit: Don't bother getting in a strop and posting six paragraphs by the way. I'm not Toby or Lewis. I'm done. I just wanted to show you predictable you are.

[QE Harold Flair]

He's right in that the headline figure is total bollocks. That doesn't highlight like-for-like pay discrepancies, but does highlight that certain professions and fields and still almost exclusively male, which is an issue.

Is it an issue that miners are almost exclusively male? Or does that not matter?

[QE Harold Flair]

I literally quoted you saying 'It doesn't fucking exist' directly above this post.

edit: Don't bother getting in a strop and posting six paragraphs by the way. I'm not Toby or Lewis. I'm done. I just wanted to show you predictable you are.

And it doesn't. IN THE WAY IT IS BEING USED. It doesn't exist in any kind of sexist way - it exists because women make different lifestyle choices and tend towards a more balanced home/work life than men.

[Davgooner]

Is it an issue that miners are almost exclusively male? Or does that not matter?

I don't give a shit about miners, no.

[QE Harold Flair]

I think what it comes down to is that people with certain worldviews get mad about facts. Such as men working loneger hours and being more work orientated than women. I'm not sure what there is to be mad about.

[Lewis]

The 'wage gap' as it tends to be reported is balls, and when ladies moan about male-dominated professions they only tend to mention the well-paying comfortable office ones. It's a complete non-issue really, but the fact it can never be solved is perfect for politicians and the other SOMETHING MUST BE DONE bastards looking for something to solve with posturing and shit legislation.

[phonics]

I missed This Week so I got a lol out of this when catching up

http://i.imgur.com/7tVDkcG.png

Andrew Neil :cool:

for those unaware

http://news.images.itv.com/image/file/897720/stream_img.jpg

[Lewis]

Speaking of gaps, it's full steam ahead on the boundary review. They need a better review than the last one though. It was a right shitfest, cutting across all sorts of historic boundaries and what have you. Just make places like Liverpool and Birmingham one big seat and you're sorted.

[GS]

I actually think it's difficult to disagree with the principles behind the boundary review. That it causes difficulty for Labour is obviously unfortunate for them, but given there exists a bias in the system in their favour they're on somewhat thin ground when claiming it's being undertaken for "political reasons".

[QE Harold Flair]

Douglas talking to Italaussie:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GRi-nBirci0


:evictory:

[Lewis]

Did he mention his support for everything that has led to the instability and dislocation?

[QE Harold Flair]

I don't think he supported the post-war policies, which is what led to the instability and dislocation.

[Lewis]

He supported taking the Libyan government out (and with it Europe's southern border, hence the boats) and wanted to get rid of the Syrian one. The European response to it all has been piss poor, but it was a response to something largely caused by bollocks policies on our part.

[GS]

The governments in the west place too much stock in supporting 'rebels' when a situation kicks off.

[QE Harold Flair]

He supported taking the Libyan government out (and with it Europe's southern border, hence the boats) and wanted to get rid of the Syrian one. The European response to it all has been piss poor, but it was a response to something largely caused by bollocks policies on our part.

It's always a case of damned if you do, damned if you don't. The common denominator here is Islam and how incredibly fucked up the arabs are.

[Lewis]

How would we have been damned by not intervening in Libya and Syria?

[QE Harold Flair]

How would we have been damned by not intervening in Libya and Syria?

Well there would have been people shitting themselves about human rights abuses, and why aren't we doing anything. Check Rwanda.

[Lewis]

Oh no. Not complaints. Where will we house them all?

[QE Harold Flair]

The point being, there's no way of knowing what would have happened if 'the other option' was chosen. These Muslamic Arabs will always find a way to make THE WEST think it's THE WEST's fault.

[Lewis]

It sounds like a great way to absolve yourself of advocating disastrous policies when said policies were based on a refusal to engage with historical precedent, readily-available information, and common sense. How could we have known that Libya was a non-country held together by corruption based around a particular family that, whilst shithouses, effectively suppressed the worst elements of Islamism whilst receiving European Union money to keep African migrants at bay? I don't know. There was simply no way of knowing that.

[QE Harold Flair]

It's pretty easy being wise after the event. It's not as if those shithouses were going to be in power forever.

I'm fairly certain nobody predicted ISIS and the millions of muslamic migrants before or during the Iraq war.

[Lewis]

The Muslims going mental was a more likely prediction than everybody bumming under the rainbow together, which is why we support these people in the first place (or did when adults were in charge). It's the very definition of a conservative (that is to say historically-minded) foreign policy. If it can go to shit, it will; so leave it alone.

[QE Harold Flair]

Douglas Murray (QE) does NOT tolerate white guilt.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDiLAJLMxvU

[Lewis]

That Labour broadcast needed more Jezza and less Hardworking Families. The MPs featured all sounded like thickos as well.

[phonics]

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[phonics]

They're literally telling mum jokes and invoking the dead in PMQs today. What a shambles.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Corbyn has the biggest open goal in history this week - the government in open internal warfare - and he does this. Complete thicko idiot.

[QE Harold Flair]

Not a single, dissenting voice on the EU there.

[phonics]

Not a single, dissenting voice on the EU there.

Where?

[QE Harold Flair]

PMQ's

[phonics]

PMQ's

If you'd have been paying attention to Laura Kuenssberg (but she's a woman so I assume you stopped listening immediately) after PMQs she noted that there's been a whip to stop anti-EU questions so the party can seem more united than it is when it comes to the NHS/ Jr. Doctors nonsense. Hence why all the questions were 'Would the Right Honorable Prime Minister tell everyone this good thing in my constituency is great please?'

edit: Although they did manage to sneak in that one about the Government backing 'Stay' and that being unfair to 'Leave' which I thought was a bit lol.

[QE Harold Flair]

After PMQ's, you say? Well strike me for not paying attention to that. The explanation only makes it worse.

[phonics]

702546674586140672

So he's just going to be sat there unable to do a part of his job?

[QE Harold Flair]

It's going to be very difficult for the 'leave' side since every party is officially in 'remain'. How is that representative of the country as a whole, when it's around 50/50? If it weren't for big businesss, I reckon the common man is very much in favour of leaving.

[Toby]

How is that representative of the country as a whole, when it's around 50/50?

None have changed from the stated positions before the election, so people knew what they were going in for.

[QE Harold Flair]

None have changed from the stated positions before the election, so people knew what they were going in for.

That's besides the point. Parties are supposed to represent the population, and this perhaps shows how they don't really represent the common man at all.

[Toby]

That's besides the point.

It's not. All major parties had clearly stated views on Europe, and people voted by huge majority for parties that did not actively support leaving the EU.

Half the country might support leaving, but they didn't care enough about that issue alone to vote for a party that explicitly agreed with them on it.

[Boydy]

If only a political party that was against the EU had stood at the election.

[QE Harold Flair]

If only a political party that was against the EU had stood at the election.

Obviously nobody is going to vote en masse for fringe parties. 4 million was a massive vote, all in all. But general elecetions are quite different from Europe, as I I'm sure you must be aware. Guess who won the European elections?

[QE Harold Flair]

It's not. All major parties had clearly stated views on Europe, and people voted by huge majority for parties that did not actively support leaving the EU.

Half the country might support leaving, but they didn't care enough about that issue alone to vote for a party that explicitly agreed with them on it.

I know all parties had stated their views. Those views do not represent the views of their consituents. Labour used to be for the working class, didn't it?

[Toby]

I know all parties had stated their views. Those views do not represent the views of their consituents. Labour used to be for the working class, didn't it?

Are you saying people were too stupid to vote for who they actually wanted?

Clearly those who support leaving did not rank it as their number one priority, or parties supporting that would have received more than an eighth of the vote.

[QE Harold Flair]

Are you saying people were too stupid to vote for who they actually wanted?

Clearly those who support leaving did not rank it as their number one priority, or parties supporting that would have received more than an eighth of the vote.

No, in the European elections people voted for UKIP. Pretty clear message. Let's not pretend people voted in the general elections for parties based on their position on Europe. Very few did. That doesn't change the fact that the working class want out and have few representatives of that view, officially. Corbyn doesn't really believe in the EU, either. So much for the 'principled man'.

[Toby]

Let's not pretend people voted in the general elections for parties based on their position on Europe. Very few did.

Well, exactly. Because it's not as important to them as other issues.

[QE Harold Flair]

Of course it isn't. Although the massive shift to UKIP has shown it's become more of an issue than it was previously. There are many on the left who just couldn't make that leap, obviously. Where are their representatives?

[Toby]

Dunno, none of them seem to care enough to run.

[Lewis]

UKIP 'won' the European elections with a quarter of the vote, which means most people voted for pro-European parties.

[QE Harold Flair]

UKIP 'won' the European elections with a quarter of the vote, which means most people voted for pro-European parties.

That's how to twist it.

[Lewis]

This Tim Farron broadcast is making the best of it.

'Mate, you don't want... Westminster? It's just a load of... Politics is in your living room.'

Palmerstone, Gladstone, Asquith, Lloyd George...

[Jimmy Floyd]

702546674586140672

So he's just going to be sat there unable to do a part of his job?

This stuff and his Boris stuff the other day has left me wanting a leave vote to happen just to piss Cameron off. Highly unpleasant man.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Palmerstone, Gladstone, Asquith, Lloyd George...

Ashdown... Clegg. Sessions.

[GS]

Ashdown... Clegg. Sessions.

:D

It looks quite petty from Cameron - how is Gove meant to do the job if he has having documentation withheld from him? Corbyn was a shambles again - any leader worth his salt should be making huge inroads at the minute, but he's just incapable of doing it.

[Lewis]

He should thank him for the afternoons off. It throws it back in his fat face, but it also makes a lol point.

[Lewis]

German threatens to leave Britain if we leave the European Union (http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/feb/24/leave-uk-brexit-german-london-human-rights). If it was good enough for Rudolf Hess, son... And is your name a pun?

[QE Harold Flair]

:D

It looks quite petty from Cameron - how is Gove meant to do the job if he has having documentation withheld from him? Corbyn was a shambles again - any leader worth his salt should be making huge inroads at the minute, but he's just incapable of doing it.

"I've got an email here from GS, which says I should be making huge inroads"

https://media.giphy.com/media/r2iNrWU9B147m/giphy.gif

[Jimmy Floyd]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35678048

All good retro stuff, but what strikes me most is less the Wee Jimmy Krankie part and more the bit where Corbyn is a boring, shit speaker. If you're going to be a left wing crank, at least spit some decent rhymes.

[Boydy]

Trident is another one of those things, like the EU, that people on either side seem to get really worked up about but I don't really see what all the fuss is about.

[Lewis]

Graham Stuart was doing one of his street surgeries in Hedon this afternoon, telling all the old biddies why we have to stay in Europe, so somebody parked a UKIP-branded Land Rover in the square to hassle him.

[GS]

Trident is another one of those things, like the EU, that people on either side seem to get really worked up about but I don't really see what all the fuss is about.

Opponents of "the nuclear deterrent", Trident or otherwise, appear to labour under the presumption that everybody agrees with their view on world peace and international cooperation. I mean, Sturgeon saying "it's the exception to possess them" is a right laugh, as if that's somehow an argument. There's a reason, lads. Do you think Kim Jong-Un is going to bin off the nuclear programme if the Americans said they were going to unilaterally scrap nuclear weapons? Would he fuck. Hence you don't get rid of your own.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Malawi don't have them, so we should get rid imo.

[GS]

Jezza turned up as well. On one hand, fair play for adhering to your principles etc. etc. On the other, surely he realises by now that doing this sort of thing highlights the divisions in his own party, which become the story rather than the many (many) things the government should be held to account over.

You'd think he'd stop being selfish, but it would seem they're more interested in beating the 'red Tories' than they are the actual Tories. Top work, lads.

[Boydy]

GS What do you make of the proposal for lowering corporation tax in NI? I don't think I've asked you about this before.

Prompted by seeing Gerry on TV giving it the big one about being progressive in the south and not going into a regressive government with FF or FG.

[GS]

In principle, I'm in favour of reducing the tax rate to try and stimulate growth, but I think there's a worrying trends which suggests that some parties see it as some sort of silver bullet for outside investment. That's unlikely to be the case, and it would present considerable short-term funding shortfalls.

Cutting the rate to, say, 12.5% would result in a significant decrease in tax income, and there's analysis which has been completed which indicates that it would take years (upon years upon years) to reach present day levels where you've successfully plugged the gap through increased volume. That means you would be reliant on 'indirect' (i.e. not directly related to CT but probably stimulated by the cut) taxation arising from job creation and subsequent increased spending in the province, but until that time we'd have to use a not inconsiderable chunk of our block grant to fund something which may not generate the sort of thriving economic scene you'd need it to in order to justify it.

I think it's unlikely that existing companies based here would do much else other than redirect the savings of the cut out through increased intracompany transfers or dividends to shareholders based in GB, particularly the multinationals. It might lead to some direct job creation or additional investment from companies with significant operations already here, but not in the sort of numbers which would justify a massive cut.

The main issue, I think, is that what do we really have going for us? Dublin can get away with it because it's a big city with excellent connections for business. They have a huge port and a 20M+ passenger airport with direct connections to major hub airports like JFK, Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Istanbul, Heathrow, Charles de Gaulle, Amsterdam etc. Beyond this, there are plenty of direct flights to other major business locations. It also has an infrastructure (e.g. a vast number of hotels) which can cope, and a wider political stability which we don't have. It's therefore a reasonable location to base your business irrespective of the highly generous tax rate - but the tax rate is such that it will make a tangible difference to the decision as to where to base (or indeed increase) your European presence. We would be wholly reliant on the tax rate itself. Rather than using it as a 'clincher', it's the entire fucking argument.

In those circumstances, why would you invest in Northern Ireland when you can just go down to Dublin where it already works, the government isn't in danger of collapsing after a police raid on the parliament building and you already have an infrastructure and business connections which make your life easy? It's just not the silver bullet the executive want it to be.

So, on balance, I wouldn't bother because we can surely use the money for something more worthwhile.

[Lewis]

I'm fascinated by the 'silver bullet' (as you put it) stuff. The NORTHERN POWERHOUSE strikes me as a spectacular example. Ooh, devolved transport. That should sort Bradford right out whilst its elected officials bumble around doing nothing for anybody.

[GS]

People are desperate for easy answers and quick wins, as if there's only one thing holding somewhere back.

[Jimmy Floyd]

Politicians have a constant dilemma between needing people's votes in areas which have lost out from globalisation, but not wanting to do anything to reverse it or mitigate its effects. Stuff like the Northern Powerhouse idea is a good example of their solution to this dilemma, lip service which will actually achieve fuck all if not make things worse.

[Boydy]

Doesn't a corporation tax cut mean we'd face a cut in the block grant as well? So we couldn't even use that to cover up the hole.

[GS]

Doesn't a corporation tax cut mean we'd face a cut in the block grant as well? So we couldn't even use that to cover up the hole.

My understanding was that we could use the block grant to fund it if we wanted to, but we wouldn't be getting any extra money to do it. Quite fucking rightly too.

I think there are probably some EU restrictions (they remain continually aggrieved with the Irish for undercutting their 'partners' in the Eurozone with an obscenely low CT rate), but we can probably play the Troubles card again if we need to.

[QE Harold Flair]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyZqyX4Reh4

[Toby]

Scottish Government has announced it's Council Tax freeze will be lifted from April next year, albeit with a 3% cap on annual increases. Only other change - the bands remain the same - appears to be a proposed tax on vacant properties.

A couple of months before an election seems like a terrible time to announce such an uninspiring policy.

[Jimmy Floyd]

They could probably announce a total ban on porridge and still win 50% of the vote.

[Toby]

And don't forget the heroin!

[Jimmy Floyd]

It is a one party state though. The only opposition party with any level of competence or likeability in its leadership, the Tories, are also really unpopular. All the nats need to do is avoid catastrophes and corruption, so inspiration is never going to be at the top of their list.

[Toby]

It's a country with one dominant party - don't be the wank who tries to make it sound like North Korea. They're dominant because the others are useless. This decision is already looking unpopular with a lot of the individuals and media outlets that drive a lot of support for independence (and the SNP), so there's definitely some opportunity to capitalise. In all likelihood nobody will, but it's still a risky move given it goes so much against what they've been saying for the past ten years.

[GS]

Gideon has BACKED DOWN on yet another major policy decision. He's becoming useless.

[Toby]

Voting against English Sunday shopping laws is seriously shitebag behaviour from SNP MPs.

Although it's some genuinely backwards shit that there are laws against that in the first place.

[Lewis]

I suppose it gets the lol Scottish deficit story off the news.

[Jimmy Floyd]

I like the Sunday trading restrictions. One of the few areas where bean counters are not given free rein to rule the world.

[Lewis]

Dan Jarvis gave a speech (http://labourlist.org/2016/03/tough-on-inequality-tough-on-the-causes-of-inequality-full-text-of-dan-jarvis-speech/) this morning. If he's their best hope then fucking 'eck stick with Jezza.

[Boydy]

I got bored after the fifth shit joke about the army.

[phonics]

Not so much politics as modern media embarassing itself again

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[Lewis]

I'm confused. Do they think that the Sun based its story on that quote?