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Thread: Summer 2021 Plane Tracking Thread

  1. #1501
    The Artist Formerly Known as Taz
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    I saw something about us being without our AFCON trio along with our Brazillian trio (due to some isolation rules) for a game with Man Utd. Tbf we'll rape them with Kaide Gordon but it would be nice to pull out 1 senior attacker out the blue

  2. #1502
    Senior Member niko_cee's Avatar
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    Chelsea and Italy defender Davide Zappacosta, 29, is set to join Atalanta on a four-year deal.
    I'm not being funny but how many players do Chelsea actually [still] own?

  3. #1503
    Just Luca, but still a DJ Luca's Avatar
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    If today wasn't a shockingly clear indication that we need a controlling DM, I don't know what is. Flog Marshall for half whatever he's worth to whatever shit French team needs a striker, do the same for 'JLingz' and get on with bringing Ruben Neves in.

  4. #1504
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by niko_cee View Post
    I'm not being funny but how many players do Chelsea actually [still] own?
    A lot. Drinkwater, Barkley and Bakayoko are all currently commuting in to Cobham for training.

  5. #1505
    Senior Member Lofty's Avatar
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    I thought that was a funny snippet of commentary the other day, talking about how good Chelsea's academy must be because so many ex youth players of theirs are at other PL teams now. That's just weight of numbers surely.

  6. #1506
    Senior Member SincereTheRebel's Avatar
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    Checking their wiki, Baba Rahman and Musonda are also still officially Chelsea players

  7. #1507
    Senior Member SincereTheRebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lofty View Post
    I thought that was a funny snippet of commentary the other day, talking about how good Chelsea's academy must be because so many ex youth players of theirs are at other PL teams now. That's just weight of numbers surely.
    That means they are good then. Add to the fact that they are still extremely successful at collecting trophies without those good academy players. It should be admired.

  8. #1508
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    We produce fucking loads of players who are top two divisions quality. Obviously getting into a top 4 first XI you are going to have to be an elite level talent, which not many people are.

  9. #1509
    I used to be funny.
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    If the academy was that good, they'd all be playing at Chelsea. They make their names and reputations elsewhere.

  10. #1510
    Senior Member Lofty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SincereTheRebel View Post
    That means they are good then. Add to the fact that they are still extremely successful at collecting trophies without those good academy players. It should be admired.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Floyd View Post
    We produce fucking loads of players who are top two divisions quality. Obviously getting into a top 4 first XI you are going to have to be an elite level talent, which not many people are.
    Chelsea also poach loads of kids and send them out on loan forever before selling/releasing them, not sure they can really claim those as a job well done when it is more about hoarding talent away from rivals.

  11. #1511
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shindig View Post
    If the academy was that good, they'd all be playing at Chelsea. They make their names and reputations elsewhere.
    That would have to be by far the best academy in the history of any sport, or possibly in any field of human endeavour.

  12. #1512
    Senior Member SincereTheRebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lofty View Post
    Chelsea also poach loads of kids and send them out on loan forever before selling/releasing them, not sure they can really claim those as a job well done when it is more about hoarding talent away from rivals.
    We have been doing it on FM for year. Chelsea just copied us, and it worked.

  13. #1513
    Senior Member Spikey M's Avatar
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    Chelsea's youth recruitment is superb. Their willingness to promote from their youth teams is less so, but then they don't need to I suppose.

  14. #1514
    Senior Member Jimmy Floyd's Avatar
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    If we were coming 14th every year we could play them all, but a team challenging at the top is only ever going to promote people - Mason Mount, Reece James, etc - who are good enough.

  15. #1515
    Senior Member niko_cee's Avatar
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    Chelsea certainly have an impressive youth hoovering set-up. Their youth teams have been pretty much the benchmark for 15 years or so, each time with a different set of multi-named prospects.

    Quote Originally Posted by Luca View Post
    If today wasn't a shockingly clear indication that we need a controlling DM, I don't know what is. Flog Marshall for half whatever he's worth to whatever shit French team needs a striker, do the same for 'JLingz' and get on with bringing Ruben Neves in.
    United should go for Bissouma.

  16. #1516
    Senior Member Andy's Avatar
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    Tino Liveramento looks like an absolute boss from his first couple of games.

  17. #1517
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luca View Post
    If today wasn't a shockingly clear indication that we need a controlling DM, I don't know what is. Flog Marshall for half whatever he's worth to whatever shit French team needs a striker, do the same for 'JLingz' and get on with bringing Ruben Neves in.
    It's going to be another season of having a mostly very good team but with a GLARING hole that leaves us coming up short.

  18. #1518
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    And a manager who appears to put players on the pitch and go "Yeah, I dunno, can't you guys just figure this out for me?" if the opposition aren't very generously playing in the one specific way we're decent at exploiting (Hi, Leeds.)

  19. #1519
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Ole probably won't turn out to be good enough, but he's not as bad as people want to make out. You don't finish second with a manager who's completely clueless, no matter how good the squad is (look at Chelsea under Lampard).

    He has done a very good job of improving the squad and will generally leave the club in a drastically better position for the next manager.

  20. #1520
    Administrator Kikó's Avatar
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    I think the plan at least in the first half was obvious and based around trying to score from set plays. Unfortunately we fucked them all and lost momentum. Winning after conceding isn't easy.

  21. #1521
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Tottenham are trying to buy Traore from Wolves.

    Atletico seem to have decided on Cunha for their striker.

  22. #1522
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    I genuinely think Ole is on the cusp of something, which admittedly, could very easily go the other (wrong) way. He's clearly not a very good tactician, but if he can find a way of beating the shite that sits deep against him then he could have a pretty successful side on his hands. He absolutely needs to rid the squad of the wasters though, of which there are many.

  23. #1523
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    We're nearly three years in. If he was going to work out how to fix the flaws we've had for all of his reign other than that entertaining first couple of months I feel like he'd have done it by now.

    He's just plugging players into the team and hoping they'll fix the stuff he can't figure out.

  24. #1524
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    I don't know. He had SUCH a dysfunctional squad when he came in. Even now, with all the money spent and despite pretty much all his transfers being good, the midfield is still absolute wank. VdB probably wasn't the optimum use of funds in hindsight but otherwise Bruno is our only player in that position.

    I think anyone would struggle to win the league with McTominay and Fred as your starting midfield pair.

  25. #1525
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    We're nearly three years in. If he was going to work out how to fix the flaws we've had for all of his reign other than that entertaining first couple of months I feel like he'd have done it by now.

    He's just plugging players into the team and hoping they'll fix the stuff he can't figure out.
    Well quite and he's doing that because like Sir Gareth Southgate, tactics are not his forte. But that doesn't mean he can't be successful and as long as progress is being made, no matter how small, while he's learning on the job then I think he's worth persevering with for another year or two. I'd have gone all out to get small pockets when he was available but now that ship's sailed I'm not overly sure who would be worth binning Ole off in favour of. You can tell when a manager is going to be rancid/is rancid (hello David Moyes) and for me you need to bin those guys off sharpish, Ole doesn't fall into that bracket.

  26. #1526
    DEATH TO THE WEIRD Raoul Duke's Avatar
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    My wishlist for him to still get shot of:

    Phil Jones ()
    Matic
    Martial
    Lingard
    Van de Beek
    Fred

    In descending order.

    He's cleared out a lot of timewasters though. Then there's people like Mata who are fine as squad/cup players. Hard to know if Donny is any good as he never plays...

  27. #1527
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    I would genuinely get rid of Marcus Rashford too, but I know I'm probably alone in thinking that.

  28. #1528
    Senior Member Andy's Avatar
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    The United squad is class, they should have won comfortably. Every single United sub would have started for us yesterday.

  29. #1529
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    As others have said, it's just a bit unbalanced and being managed by someone who doesn't know how to change a game beyond how far motivating players works.

  30. #1530
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raoul Duke View Post
    My wishlist for him to still get shot of:

    Phil Jones ()
    Matic
    Martial
    Lingard
    Van de Beek
    Fred

    In descending order.

    He's cleared out a lot of timewasters though. Then there's people like Mata who are fine as squad/cup players. Hard to know if Donny is any good as he never plays...
    I suspect Van de Beek was brought as cover/rotation for Fernandes but Fernandes wants to play 10000 games a season so "Donny" has had hardly any games.

    I think the fact you want rid of Matic, Fred and VdB says it all about the quality of the midfield. That would leave Pogba (who's clearly better further forward) and McTominay as the only senior central midfielders.
    Last edited by randomlegend; 23-08-2021 at 11:30 AM.

  31. #1531
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    The team he played against Leeds gets the most out of who he needs to get the most out of in ninety per cent of games, so he should have just stuck with that; but, for somebody who specialises in like-for-like substitutions, he can't rotate starting players for shit. If McTominay had an injury just play that team with Donny van de Beek in and assume he's good enough to handle Southampton.

  32. #1532
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Liverpool won the league/Champions' League with a stodge midfield, because their used their shit hot attackers consistently and properly. Ole Gunnar Binman would have been throwing Divock Origi random starts for being 'sharp in training'.

  33. #1533
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by randomlegend View Post
    I think anyone would struggle to win the league with McTominay and Fred as your starting midfield pair.
    I don't expect us to be winning the league as things stand. Other teams have better squads than he does. However he doesn't learn and anybody who doesn't find that incredibly grating is either far more patient than me or puts a lot less value on their time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    I'm not overly sure who would be worth binning Ole off in favour of.
    This has been part of my issue. But then I imagine the club has given this less thought than I have. They don't care so long as the money keeps coming in.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yevrah View Post
    I would genuinely get rid of Marcus Rashford too, but I know I'm probably alone in thinking that.
    He got twenty odd goals without playing well. I don't think he's good enough to be a first choice as things stand (he and Martial are the same in having one thing they want to do if they get the ball regardless of whether it's working) but unless somebody made a daft bid for him, which they won't, it'd be silly to get rid for the sake of it. Maybe we could just implement Lewis' shot-clock idea for him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raoul Duke View Post
    Phil Jones ()
    Did you see that he turned down a testimonial saying "Apart from my mum and dad, who else would turn up?” Poor Phil.

  34. #1534
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by randomlegend View Post
    I suspect Van de Beek was brought as cover/rotation for Fernandes but Fernandes wants to play 10000 games a season so "Donny" has had hardly any games.
    If only there was somebody, let's call him a 'manager', who was able to tell Fernandes he's getting a fucking rest whether he likes it not.

    I genuinely have no idea how good van de Beek is or isn't. Is he a shit trainer or something or has OGB just taken against him / didn't want him in the first place?

  35. #1535
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Brandon Williams off on loan to Norwich.

    Seems a weird move all round.

  36. #1536
    Senior Member Manc's Avatar
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    Two games in and the Ole inquest has begun. Just fucking get rid.

  37. #1537
    Administrator Kikó's Avatar
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    Rashford is a good right side forward. I think post recovery on his shoulder he'll be closer to his best which is very good. Much much better than Martial

    Edit: or is it left side? I can never remember.

  38. #1538
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post

    He got twenty odd goals without playing well. I don't think he's good enough to be a first choice as things stand (he and Martial are the same in having one thing they want to do if they get the ball regardless of whether it's working) but unless somebody made a daft bid for him, which they won't, it'd be silly to get rid for the sake of it. Maybe we could just implement Lewis' shot-clock idea for him.
    I heard recently that he had never hit 20 in a season?? Unless you're counting some league cup goals or something.

    He's certainly no Mason Greenwood.

  39. #1539
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    I just looked at his total goals tally. He won't have hit 20 league goals. But then some shitty cup nobody cares about is comfortably our best chance of winning anything so y'know, bring on the Wafer Cup specialists.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kikó View Post
    Rashford is a good right side forward. I think post recovery on his shoulder he'll be closer to his best which is very good. Much much better than Martial

    Edit: or is it left side? I can never remember.
    Left. On the right he has his moments but spends most of it going "Right, I have the ball! Now to cut onto my ri-.. oh, I'm already on my right. Erm erm erm erm" *loses the ball*

  40. #1540
    Won the Old Board Lewis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    If only there was somebody, let's call him a 'manager', who was able to tell Fernandes he's getting a fucking rest whether he likes it not.

    I genuinely have no idea how good van de Beek is or isn't. Is he a shit trainer or something or has OGB just taken against him / didn't want him in the first place?
    I like to think that Bruno Fernandes was brought in in the January because Paulp Ogba was leaving that summer, and then van de Beek was brought in because he was leaving this summer. But he hasn't.

  41. #1541
    Just Luca, but still a DJ Luca's Avatar
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    Can some stats nerd give me the Bissouma/Neves side by side?

  42. #1542
    Senior Member Gray Fox's Avatar
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    Powercube officially gone to Lyon. Expected to bring in £9m or so.

    Harvey Elliott having a stormer of a pre-season essentially filled his spot. No incoming expected.

  43. #1543
    Senior Member Manc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luca View Post
    Can some stats nerd give me the Bissouma/Neves side by side?
    Click me

  44. #1544
    Just Luca, but still a DJ Luca's Avatar
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    Huh, on that basis alone, it seems like Bissouma is closer to what we need. Neves is more prolific in advanced positions, contributes more to creating attacking plays, and can dribble slightly better, while Bissouma is the more accurate passer and a much better tackler. Also, compared to other midfielders, he's top decile in tackling, top quintile in interceptions and dribbles, and top quartile in clearances and pass completion. Sign him up, OGB

    EDIT: Asking price is £40m. Surely if we kick Martial and Lingard out at cut rates we can still scrape that together. Don't send Amad out on loan to make up for losing Lingard, and promote Elanga to the first team to make up for Martial.
    Last edited by Luca; 24-08-2021 at 05:02 AM.

  45. #1545
    Senior Member Lofty's Avatar
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    Supposedly Willian might leave Arsenal on a free to Corinthians, no doubt the club will have to pay him a wedge to leave. He was liking Chelsea's social media posts after the match on Sunday, top tier shithousery.

  46. #1546
    Bruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuno Reg's Avatar
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    @Luca Not a stats based opinion but Neves being more of a creator/dribbler and Bissouma being more of a 'destroyer' sounds about right. Bissouma was just ridiculous against Watford, I thought. Granted it was Watford, but it was one of those painstakingly obvious occasions where a player's at a level above his club. Sad to say but his performances are crying out for a move. I'd be shocked if we accepted £40m, though.
    Last edited by Reg; 24-08-2021 at 09:42 AM.

  47. #1547
    Webly Ian's Avatar
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    What about £40m, Andreas Pereira and a loan of Phil Jones?

    By my calculations that takes the value of the deal right up to a whopping £30m.

  48. #1548
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Bernando Silva has agreed personal terms with AC Milan. They are now trying to dig enough Lira from down the back of the sofa to make City happy.

    Shit source though.

    Saul to Chelsea or United doing the rounds again

  49. #1549
    Isn't he banned? Baz's Avatar
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    Good. I don’t want him at Liverpool.
    I'm a twit

  50. #1550
    Senior Member randomlegend's Avatar
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    Who, Saul?

    Yeah nothing you hear from how his last couple of years have gone is very promising. Rumours it's a loan with option though so basically zero risk. One of the Atletico tier 1s has apparently confirmed he's closest to United.

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