http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/...rdogans_Turkey
Shit's about to go down one way or another. Istanbul is covered with his face and the word EVET (yes) but everyone I've spoken with opposes him (not that it's a faır sample).
*sounds the @Mert signal*
It's a fairly blatant power grab, but if they want to vote to have an autocracy led by a nutter then that's up to them.
I like how you only speak to progressive white Turks.
It is a power grab, but it's not nearly as complete as Western sources are making it out to be. It's worth noting that even the opposition Leftist Party was involved in drafting some of the new Constitutional Amendments (and publicly supports some of them), and the far-right (historically secular) populist People's Party is in complete support of all the amendments. Yes Erdogan consolidates power, but there are still a number of democratic constraints on its exercise, and moreover he still needs to win elections. The Turkish people respond to incompetence, and Erdogan's party (until recently) did not have a majority share of the Parliament. If the abuses under the new system go too far, the Turkish people will respond, they've gotten used to having political self-esteem and therefore expect a certain standard of care from their government (compared to the past, where the Secular Elite "White Turks" just dicked around and enriched themselves while making jokes to each other in French, to the general indifference of the miserable masses who knew nothing else).Originally Posted by GS
For most Turks they: 1) Trust Erdogan unquestioningly and it must be admitted, for understandable reasons; he gave Anatolian Turks ("Black Turks") a sense of dignity, a voice in government, and tangibly raised their quality of life; 2) For Turks living in Turkey, it feels as if the country is in a quasi state of war with a number of enemies, they see empowering Erdogan as urgently necessary to ensure the security of the country (hence the support of the ultra-nationalists); 3) The vast majority of Turks believe that the 2016 Coup was carried out with the support and encouragement of Western secret intelligence services; Erdogan's recent crack downs are seen not as violations of freedom, but necessary assertions / cleansing of traitors. At this stage Western criticism of any move Erdogan makes, lends his action far greater credibility.
They should have been booted out of NATO the minute that coup fizzled out.
Turkey is one of my favourite countries and peoples (Not you, Mert). Seeing them disappear into an Islamic Dictatorship voluntarily is just plain sad. Ultimately it's the EU's fault as well, letting in shitholes like Romania whilst refusing a booming economy like Turkey has lead to them looking to Asia..
Ultimately, it'll be Blair's fault somehow.
Turkey Twizzlers getting banned was his fault (insofar as Jamie Oliver was his fault), so yes.
Islamic People's Republic of Turkey.
The EU should never have let in any of the countries that were admitted in 2004 or later (with the possible exception of Malta). They were nowhere near economically developed enough, and it's added a diplomatic complication by forcing them to waste their time trying to convince the likes of Hungary not to be absolutely shit.
lol enjoy that Europe.
Progressive. Liberal. Democratic. European.
Those votes more than likely carried it, and it won't effect them. You would be fucking livid if you were against it back home.
Emigrants should never be allowed vote in the elections of the country they left. We're near allowing it in a meaningless one (presidential) soon but it'll open the door to the slithery cunts lol voting in important ones.
Lol at European countries with diaspora demographic profiles lining up with literally the poorest, most Islamic, most illiberal provincial states in Turkey. What a fucking mess across the board.
That's Erdogan's point though isn't it? I remember reading an article about how the disapora were voting 'Yes' because of some romanticsed version of how Turkey works without having to worry about actualities of it. Erdogan knew this and he's won off the back of it.
Turks are probably one of the better minorities here. Give them a leather jacket and a takeaway and they're happy.
You'd think these people would have voted this down in their droves having been exposed to the positive, democratic, liberal European Union for so many years. Ungrateful bastards.
Wait, you hate the EU? Mate, I don't think you've ever voiced that opinion before.
I'm just enjoying the irony of it, really. They've completely fucked the people who actually have to live there.
It's a good point though. The Turks living in the West have voted for a man running on hatred of the West. If you're looking for hard evidence of nonassimilation (and the fault for this is on both sides, no doubt) it's as good as you're going to get.
Limited scenes in Taksim Square btw. There was a crowd singing his name and Allahu Akbar but an equal number of people hanging around the side streaming it to Facebook Live.
I'd say about 20-25% of Turkish people would have absolutely no problem assimilating into any Western society; most of the upper-class Turks who would come to Duke would join a diverse array of good fraternities (they wouldn't self-segregate at all, unlike other international population groups) and have normal White girlfriends. There are a lot (I'm speaking tens of millions) of very smart, very socially and academically competent, very open minded, Turks who any nation would be happy to take on. Phenotypically, these people generally look Central / Southern European / Balkan White*. On the other hand about 60-65% of the population are a undeniable net drain on the cultural / economic / social well-being of any nation they find themselves in, and are fanatically nationalistic / protective of their heritage and background on top of it. These people look like the guys working at your local kebab shop.
In the past that 20-25% would ruthlessly repress the lower-classes and deny them any agency / access to the levers of power and influence. Anyways without going through Turkey's entire political history, the tables have turned (probably inevitable). It's a lost cause at this stage.
On the bright side, my value as a potential green card marriage with an upper-class Turkish girl through family friend connections is now substantially higher. So there's that.
*Upper-class Turkish girls are actually incredibly hot, white with a hint of exoticism + not too tall + joocy lower body / butt genetics, kinda like a Whiter more Slavic Latina look. Posted pictures are people I have mutual friends with, I could post 100s more of similar background.
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That's another problem. The secular White Turks are pussies, they're infected with the limp-wristed 'global citizen' cuck mentality of the Left in Europe. That's part of the reason why they lost power, they are just kinda shitty, too principled, and too complacent in their relative material comfort, whereas the Islamists have a fanatical victory at all costs mentality. The Erdogan wing of the country would have threatened a Civil War (and some youth groups explicitly did) if they had lost, the Secular wing just shrugs their shoulders, mutters "well that's how democracy works" and at most maybe makes a few passive aggressive social media posts.
I think it demonstrates quite clearly that certain key tenets of the western political settlement simply aren't held or recognised by those from different parts of the world. There should have been a thumping 'no' vote solely on the issue of influencing the judiciary.
You get the impression that it's merely the first step towards concentrating further powers in the position as well, probably after using some 'national emergency' as a pretext. It's probably not unreasonable to draw comparisons with Germany c. 1934.
Yep. Kurds are truly fucked.
I'd actually thought a potential example of the 'national emergency' could be some terrorist attack that was blamed on the Kurds, prompting massive crackdowns. It's all a bit grim, isn't it.
Do you think they'll take on a more obvious Islamist approach now? Presumably Ataturk's secular legacy will go up in flames, at least.
It's been pretty Islamist for awhile now, but now there will be even fewer checks and balances so the progress will be accelerated and more overt. AKP's president openly called for an end to the separation of Church and State within the Constitution and the establishment of Islam as the state religion (total dismantling of any pretension of secularism). While it ultimately wasn't included in the new Constitution (it generated quite a good deal of negative controversy actually- it was clearly a trial balloon for Erdogan to gauge the public mood), it goes to show how bold the Islamist wing (such a statement would have been grounds for imprisonment 20 years ago- Erdogan was once imprisoned for reciting a poem which had anti-secular allusions at a political rally) has become; they will undoubtedly move towards achieving their goals. And there's nobody left to stop them. Younger generation is probably more radical than the older and not raised on the Ataturk cult of personality which was integral to the older education curriculum, so there truly is no hope.
So glad my parents GTFO, it's just a rapidly deteriorating shithole, and I say that with great pain. I no longer have qualms about assimilating into American society and leaving behind my past.
No fucking shit, captain.
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